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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Was dd being unreasonable not to give up best seat for old man?

391 replies

deno · 09/03/2018 18:53

DD1 is in her first year at uni in London, studying politics, and regularly attends talks given by politicians at different universities/lecture halls across London.

She was attending a talk by a Lib Dem MP at Queen Mary's - she'd been to the lecture theatre there before, so knew where the speaker would sit, and where in the lecture theatre she needed to sit to have the best view - the aisle seats on the left hand side of the centre block of seats. She got there very early, was the first in, and sat down in the nearest to the front aisle seat on that side of the room.

A few minutes later, an old man walks in, and looks like he wants to sit in the same row, so DD stands up to let him past her. But instead of walking past, he says to her, "Aren't you going to move up then?". She says that she wants the aisle seat, and he replies, "Well, I was hoping to sit there." She points out that she is happy to let him get past her into the same row, or the aisle seat in the row behind is available, but he starts insisting that his eyesight is too bad and sitting one foot further back will mean he won't be able to see.

At this point, DD sat down and just stopped talking to him. He huffed loudly and sat down in the row behind her, and then kept muttering to himself about how awful young people these days are, until the talk started.

Was DD being unreasonable not to give up the best seat to the old man?

OP posts:
steff13 · 10/03/2018 00:20

If it is such a non-issue for her/you then why question it?

Because an old man sat behind her and muttered about it and perhaps made her question herself?

CadyHeron · 10/03/2018 00:33

I wonder what the comments would be if it was an old lady wanting that seat.

Agreed, exactly my point a little bit further down the thread.
Would an old lady have got "must be faking, nowt wrong with her eyesight!" and other lovely stuff?

CadyHeron · 10/03/2018 00:40

It's like holding open a door, I don't do it because you are a women, I do it because I was taught to be polite.

Exactly! I've seen a thread on here in the past that had people outraged that men held doors open for them. Don't need it, I'm not useless etc..... it's basic manners and politeness! They honestly seem to have gone down the toilet recently.
I held the door open for a man earlier today who was coming through as I was.
A mutual "thank you" and from him "thanks love." No offence taken at the love that I've seen evoke outrage on here before as well, just acknowledging it's people, regardless of sex, being nice to one another!
Same in this situation of someone who has a greater need for the seat I was in. If it made no odds to me whether I moved back a seat,but to the other person it made their disabilities more comfortable, I'd do it.
Not ignore them and like some charmers say they must be faking it.

MrGHardy · 10/03/2018 01:03

What an entitled old tosser.

mathanxiety · 10/03/2018 01:15

He was cheeky and entitled, and I don't think he would have spoken to a man like that.

He had no way of knowing if your DD might need the aisle seat for some medical reason - early pregnancy overactive bladder/morning sickness, some health issue, eyesight issue, needing to leave the minute the talk was over. He should not have huffed or muttered.

Your DD took the trouble to get there well on time to secure the seat she wanted. The early bird, etc.

Clem7 · 10/03/2018 01:32

I’m firmly on team DD. I think it’s very entitled of him to expect to have his exact choice of seat wherever he happens to be. I wonder what he’d have done if he had been the first to arrive and then someone, purporting to have more of a need, happened to demand that one particular seat despite all the others being free?

marcopront · 10/03/2018 04:42

For those of you who are saying she should have moved because of his eye sight issues. What eye sight problem means sitting in the row behind would be so different? If he can see clearly for, let's say 20m would 21m be so difficult?

Also for those of you saying it would be no problem for her to move, to a similar seat why is it a problem for him to move to the same similar seat?

StripySocksAndDocs · 10/03/2018 05:56

Yes I think if it's been an 'old woman' then she'd have been seen as just entitled on this thread. Just like the man is being seen.

She'd probably have been turned into a frail white haired little granny with dodgy hips and a weak bladder too. Just like the man has been aged and given health and mobility problems also.

It's a really pathetic argument the 'what if it were a old woman' one. Because the one thing that isn't being projected or interpreted by posters is the sex.

It's also not like opening a door for someone to prove how polite you are either. It is more akin to telling someone to open a door for you.

One last thing the whole opening a door action. People don't get offended by it - they get offended by sexist men who do it because they want to make a show of how chivalrous they are. It's a patronising gesture not a polite one; the difference can be noted by anyone who notes body language and use if language.

Mummyoflittledragon · 10/03/2018 06:31

He wanted to sit where he wanted to sit and didn’t care that the seat was occupied and took umbrage that he was not obliged. If he had mobility issues or incontinence issues, he would have sat at the back for ease of exit as the stairs would have been too much.

GnotherGnu · 10/03/2018 06:48

People who think OP's daughter should have moved: where's the dividing line? Should she keep moving every time someone else fancies the seat she's in till she's tucked into a corner with no sightline? Should the next person who fancies the seat the old man is in be entitled to ask him to move?

In the real world is there anyone who asks already seated audience members to move for anything short of a good medical reason? It just doesn't happen, does it, and there's a good reason for that. Most people realise that if they want a particular seat they need to get there early or book it; and that if it's already taken, then using the nearest equivalent really won't make that much difference.

Laineymc7 · 10/03/2018 06:59

No she wasn’t being unreasonable. The man was not without a seat. There were seats in that row and behind.

GaucheCaviar · 10/03/2018 07:30

He should have gone to specsavers rung ahead to book if it was that important. Btw op this thread is pretty outi g by now.

Bluffinwithmymuffin · 10/03/2018 07:41

Today 01:32 Clem7

I wonder what he’d have done if he had been the first to arrive and then someone, purporting to have more of a need, happened to demand that one particular seat despite all the others being free?

Good point (and I bet he wouldn’t have moved)

AlonsosLeftPinky · 10/03/2018 07:50

I wouldn't have even considered moving. I have my reasons for choosing a specific seat and that's that. I don't feel I need to justify those reasons to anyone who also wants the same seat.

The man was not disabled, he just didn't have great eyesight. Nor do I but I'm certainly not disabled as a result.

And the man was around 70. That means he's had 7 decades in which to learn how to speak to people appropriately. If he's chosen not to do that then that's his call but there are consequences to how we choose to behave. I wouldn't for a second indulge someone's poor behaviour. Had they have asked me politely then I'd consider moving.

AlonsosLeftPinky · 10/03/2018 07:52

I also think the claims of OP asking the question being "very telling" are utter bollocks.

Some things just make for a good, interesting discussion and debate.

Unfinishedkitchen · 10/03/2018 08:07

Haven’t read the whole thread but no she wasn’t being rude at all. He was being manipulative and trying to use his seniority to bully her. It’s not like there were no other seats, he just wanted her one. I bet he was taller than her too so that when she sat behind him his big head would be in the way.

Good for her for standing her ground. When I was younger a older man insisted he had to sit where I was and I got up, he didn’t even say thank you as if he was entitled or something. Some people are rude and entitled, even old men. I repeat your DD was not BU at all.

sunshinesupermum · 10/03/2018 08:25

CadyHeron

A mutual "thank you" and from him "thanks love." No offence taken at the love that I've seen evoke outrage on here before as well, just acknowledging it's people, regardless of sex, being nice to one another!

THIS Flowers

sunshinesupermum · 10/03/2018 08:27

stripeysocsand docs

People don't get offended by it - they get offended by sexist men who do it because they want to make a show of how chivalrous they are. It's a patronising gesture not a polite one;

You can't seriously believe this? It's taking rampant feminism too far.

Firesuit · 10/03/2018 08:40

She wasn't rude. He was acting very entitled. Re-reading the OP again, I'm actually quite shocked by his behaviour. It was reasonable for him to assume she had chosen the seat at random and might not mind moving into the row, but then, having been told that she was sitting in the seat because she specifically wanted it, he still wants her to give it up.

The only age-related mitigation I can see for his behaviour is that maybe he's a little mentally slow in processing new information, and he didn't process that she was holding onto the seat because it was important to her, rather than because she was being bloody-minded.

I am very impressed by her. At that age, in fact for most of my life, I would not have been that assertive.

CCSA · 10/03/2018 08:47

I’d think she was a bit crackers to turn up early, sit in the aisle sit and block access. Not sure that the “view” is really so important at this sort of event

CallYourDadYoureInACult · 10/03/2018 08:55

Some people are just entitled dicks.

My DH and I went to the ballet at the ROH, first time for both of us and a treat for a special occasion.

Got to our seat and a man in his 50s tapped me on the shoulder and asked if I’d Been to the ballet here before. I said no, so he said in the most patronising tones: “oh I’ll explain to you, if you lean forward it obstructs my view so you must sit still throughout the performance. That’s just what’s done. You can’t move at all.”

I did what I was told for the first half until I thought:

  1. He’s a cheeky patronising fucker. Why did he assume that my husband and I would need educating?
  2. If he wanted a better view he could have shelled out the cash we did.

I did not behave like a dick, but I did lean forward and lean on the balcony to sigh through the death scene. It was lovely, my back was hurting, everyone else was doing it, and he pissed me off.

So I don’t think the OPs daughter was BU. Some people are just dicks

NataliaOsipova · 10/03/2018 09:00

People don't get offended by it - they get offended by sexist men who do it because they want to make a show of how chivalrous they are. It's a patronising gesture not a polite one;

I've never seen it as patronising; I think it's more about men wanting you to notice them. It's a peacock strut, in a way. And they often go away feeling really chuffed if you acknowledge it. So - if I over analyse it, I find it more empowering than patronising, if you see what I mean?

NataliaOsipova · 10/03/2018 09:05

CallYourDad There are a stalwart crew of those people at the ROH. They buy the cheap seats a long way in advance and then expect everyone else to pander to them....and give the whole place a bad feel. Good for you. And don't let it put you off going again!

(It has gone down in family history quite how vocally I called someone out (possibly the same man!) for complaining that my DD was sitting on a booster seat in front of his standing place.....)

StripySocksAndDocs · 10/03/2018 09:06

sunshinesupermum: "You can't seriously believe this? It's taking rampant feminism too far."

How embarrassing for you. Honestly, do you think patronising and sexist men don't exist? That isn't 'rampant feminism' to be aware of them. Or is it rampant feminism to say negative things about someone, who is male, regardless of his behaviour?

Not sure what falsedom you've created in your head about what I wrote. Whatever it is it's wrong.

cheshiremama89 · 10/03/2018 09:06

Not rude in the slightest, that cantankerous old bugger was rude!
Plenty of options were available to him, its the sense of entitlement that would wind me up!

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