About other people’s children

[Curiousaboutchoices]

I sometimes feel like I am the only ‘strict’ parent around. We are surrounded by lovely people but many are what I would describe as permissive parents. This goes from the very extreme ‘Jane is just experimenting with gravity ’ when 3 year old Jane was deliberately throwing breakable items down a set of stairs, to a milder version whereby people consistently let their kids speak rudely, interrupt, scream and shout if they are ignored or don’t get their own way. Behaviour such as taking toys off another child, ignoring instructions/requests, being rude are often laughed at. Lots don’t restrict tv, screens or gaming, let their kids eat loads of sweets and chocolate in between meals, let their kids get up and down from the table, go to bed when they like, or put their kids to bed and then do nothing when they get back up again. This all makes play dates and sleepovers incredibly hard when all this is acceptable behaviour at home but not in my house.

No one would think it acceptable for an adult to behave like this. If I was unable to go out for dinner without getting up and wandering around people would think I was a little odd. I’m not talking toddlers, I’m talking KS1 and 2. And it’s a lot of the visitors to my house, not a small minority.

I can hear people saying already ‘not your kids, not your business’, which is right, but what these parents create is kids who are incredibly hard work outside the home. When kids stay over or come to play they are unable to cope with an adult not responding to their whims immediately, find it odd that I tell them not to help themselves my food cupboards or go into my bedroom, don’t like being told they have to sit still at a table to eat and can’t get up and down, etc.

Is this a nationwide modern phenomenon now, that children can do what they like or am I just living in a weird bubble?

I absolutely agree with you 100% Curious

I think most would say that parenting can be hard and everyone has different styles.

However, that’s no excuse to let a child run riot and give them no boundaries whatsoever. You can give your children freedom to express themselves without letting them become feral.

Children have to grow up to become adults one day and as such they should be taught how to behave with simple, basic manners around other people and children.

Obviously people have different rules in their homes and you can’t anticipate what ‘rules’ or ‘routines’ each person will have. But that does not mean basic manners can’t be taught. To me that would be things like not to snatch toys off other children, not to take things without asking and to say please and thank you. This is real basic stuff that at the very least will make it easier for them and others.

I’m with you. My two, now nearly 8 and 10 make me proud for what I consider normal, polite, appropriate in public behaviour. We are pretty strict with them - that’s not to say they’re Angels at home all the time but outside the four walls of our home I can rely on them to always behave perfectly. They’re always complimented on their manners, by other kids’ parents who have asked if we would like to swap children and even by old domino playing men whiling the day away outside a cafe in Spain. They can sit for dinner in a restaurant for 3 hours and talk or sometimes we play cards if we’re out for the evening. They have known better since they were tiny not to run around even when their friends are. They know what is and isn’t acceptable. We are hardly draconian parents though I think in comparison to others we may well be. But at the ages my kids are I expect them to be able to speak politely with adults, eat with cutlery (so many of their friends still use fingers), not have tantrums when they have to leave a friend’s house, not to throw vegetables off a plate in protest, and to not call their friends’ mum an idiot (yep all my own experiences).
Before having kids I thought I loved kids. Now, turns out I like my own...not so keen on the majority of others.

I geniunely dislike some chewing gum chewing, rude, spoilt brats

I don't allow 11 year old gaming of any kind, so many might think me strict yet I spend time discussing cricket and will drive dc 50 miles each way every day for a week during half term as that is something he loves. I don't allow answering back or refusing to do things but I do allow toys all over lounge. I am strict on some things but not much on others. But any tantrums whilst out and I would take dc straight home.

I have things i am really strict about. Saying please and thank you and not being rude is the main one. Not snatching or breaking other peoples stuff too (i don't really care so much if they break their own anymore). We always got comments about how polite they were as toddlers, even if they were misbehaving - We got told in a bemused way that they will be throwing a tantrum about not wanting something but shouting 'No thank you' and 'please can i have x'.

We have had kids over who are really tidy and careful with toys but then quite rude too. We have had kids over who will smash up our toys and throw stuff at our walls chipping all the paint but then sit beautifully at dinner and use cutlery. The parents all are present and seem to be happy with that. We on the other hand don't break stuff and are very polite but eat with fingers and get down from the table when finished. (Altho i am working on it) I've seen the horrified look on the other parents faces when they are eating, even after their kids have destroyed hundreds of pounds of our lego while they smiled and watched. Different priorities i suppose. Personally i think mine are right, but i'm sure they feel the same.

I don’t see anything wrong with a 2 year old calling someone Poo poo head?

No, I don't suppose anyone would find an adult doing those things acceptable, but that's because adults are adults, and children are children. A baby screams when it's hungry, an adult doesn't, because it's an adult.

Op agree, we were in a restaurant recently around 5.30-7.30pm in a hotel we go to regularly as a family, they are quite laid back. There were three children around the same ages as ours running about shouting, screaming and climbing on the furniture, my children are 10 and 8. The manager was trying to put them in an empty function room beside the restaurant so they could run about in there but they kept coming out running about shouting whilst people were trying to eat their dinner. There were three women with the children, drinking wine, who not once got off their chairs to see what the children were doing or tell them to be quiet. Eventually the children's fathers turned up to take them home, allowing the women to carry on with their drinking, think everyone breathed a sigh of relief

My 3 year olds nickname is Mr Poop because that's what he calls people affectionately and laughs. We all laugh too. Because he's 3.

I am a secondary teacher and I don’t think kids outgrow this behaviour on their own. Before you say that you do what is best for your child just consider that they have to go to school and be in a class of 30. Imagine having a battle everyday with 30 children who don’t know how to control themselves especially listening skills. I currently have a class who gets half the work done of other groups because of the constant need for individual attention. And none of it is for special needs.

I am strict with daughter as mum was to me and she gets invited round to people's houses as she's so good, yet is cheeky and sometimes plays up at home (would rather that than in public (does sometimes)). I witness daughter's best friend wailing because a piece of paper was ripped and tantrums because couldn't have chocolate cake so parent gives in and gives them said chocolate cake really annoying to witness as if u say no, stick to it, otherwise child knows u give in

There are parents who don't have the ability to parent well. Often not their fault, they have come from such a traumatic background they never learned how. They often get into substance abuse or dragged into relationships that replicate the abusive behaviour they experienced. Often, their children are taken into care and fostered or adopted. Or they could be placed with family friends. None of these new homes are responsible for the children's behaviour but are left to pick up the pieces. Standard parenting techniques don't work with those children as their brains are wired differently. Then there are invisible disabilities such as autism. Yes it may seem annoying to an onlooker, but what you see may only be the tip of the iceburg. We should all stop and take a breath before we judge.

Can you be sure of that? If they come from difficult backgrounds, developmental trauma is a pretty big special need.

Ever dealt with a neglected child who grew up and who didn't get help to heal?

This has moved on. The thread was not about neglectful parenting. That is quite a different thing.

The OP is not suggesting these parents are neglectful. They just have different rules and boundaries. I have friends who are more liberal than me. I have friends who are more strict than me. As long as each family is consistent, it works fine. Problems arise when rules and boundaries are not applied consistently. If the rule is bed at 8, apply it. If the rule is no jumping on the beds, apply it. Don’t go ape-shit one day and allow it the next. That is where kids get confused and problems start.

My children have an after-school nanny in our own house. She is stricter than me about table manners. I am stricter about tidying up after yourself. Even my 5 year old knows the difference between her rules and my rules. No problem at all as we are both consistent.

When I have kids to play, it is my rules. This is much easier now that my children are old enough to play without parents coming too. I’m sure some of the kids think I’m strict but it is my house. No playing in the lounge. No jumping on beds. No food in the playroom. They just do it and don’t fuss. They all want to come back again so it can’t be that bad.

Not the norm then if it’s one class in many. Actually what surprises me most is that there are NO children with SN. shock Does your school operate some sort of weird SN apartheid system?

There are no children with SN in my DDs class either. Why is that so unusual?

Not the norm then if it’s one class in many. Actually what surprises me most is that there are NO children with SN. shock Does your school operate some sort of weird SN apartheid system?

There are no children with SN in my DDs class either. Why is that so unusual?

If a child has additional needs and those needs are accurately identified and well supported, the child won't be disrupting the learning of others.

You also wouldn't necessarily be aware of it if you're the parent of another child in the class.

If a child has additional needs and those needs are accurately identified and well supported, the child won't be disrupting the learning of others

You also wouldn't necessarily be aware of it if you're the parent of another child in the class

I just knew someone would come along and say "Oh but you won't always know if there are kids with SN in the class. Look, I'm not guessing here, I know for a fact there are no children with SN in the class...100% know for a fact...not a guess OK?

I agree with a lot of what op said but not all... I have 4 children who I am often complimented about.... they have their moments but are generally nice well behaved,respectful children.
I am fairly strict in regards to aspects of their behaviour and I insist they are respectful, honest and open with me.
They aren’t allowed to swear, run amok, answer back or be mean to each other but I am less strict with table manners and bedtimes.... I chose my battles!
They are loved, cared for and respected and are able to follow boundaries and rules... but everyone’s rules are different... I have never insisted my children stay at the table they leave when they have finished as do I!
Everyone parents differently and individually and most raise functioning members of society!

I currently have a class who gets half the work done of other groups because of the constant need for individual attention. And none of it is for special needs.

If you have a class of 30 teenagers many of whom need individual attention and have poor listening skills and none of whom have diagnosed special needs then yes I can imagine you have a battle on your hands.

100% know for a fact...not a guess OK?

You know 100% for a fact that they don't have a diagnosis. You can't know that none of them would get one.

Just sayin'.

I was told about a year ago that the reason my DD's 2 year old friend whacked her over the head with a plastic box was hormones. Zero proper discipline resulted in nightmare play date = no more invites.

Sorry for the mass debate. There are children with SEN but it is not a significant number and their issues are not with listening. This group seem to lack the skills to work as a team and care for each other and listen to each other’s ideas. There is constant calling out and interruptions. Before some lovely person jumps in and suggests I am a shit teacher, this is the only group I have like this. The rest have a certain degree of self control.