to ask how MN users can be so stupid about Trans women?

[Curiositykilledthecat113]

Why are trans women and men put into the same category? As if trans women are accepted by men. In a world where men are constantly try to look the most “manliest” do you honestly think that transwomen are accepted into this

So to summarise OP:

We're all stupid
Women are just non-men so of course reject males are women
Transitioning is ridiculous, embarrassing and shameful
Proper men wouldn't lower themselves to dress as women
We're all hateful
Men will rape us anyway so we should shut up about toilets

And btw thank you for posting this on AIBU

You will cause a few more to "peak trans" when the reality of the proposal of Self ID slaps them around the face like a flaccid penis.

Do you really think that all the men who view themselves as “manly” would lower themselves to dress as a woman just to peep at women in bathroom stalls? Do you really think that would happen?

Do you think acting like a woman is lowering yourself?

Since men are happy to rape, murder, imprison kidnap and mutilate women anyway, why do you think having a door with “female” on it would stop them, it’s a door not a magical forcefield.

Then why do trans women want in? It won't stop the men. Must just be about making women feel uncomfortable.

I'm pretty sure the OP is trying to provoke us into hostile comments on trans people. I know this will shock you, OP, but there are some very not nice people in the world. Some of them used to come to my school when I was a child (it was on the edge of a public park) and expose themselves to us. Some drinkers from a nearby pub would stand opposite the school, which was on a small, not busy road, masturbating. There are men who are sexually excited and fulfilled by making young women and girls look at their penises, erect or flaccid. These are the people who WILL take advantage of self ID to gain access to spaces where they are entitled to expose themselves and where there will be no legal way of preventing them.

Then there are the people who will claim to be trans in prisons to take advantage of what they perceive to be the privileges women have in a gentler regime, plus access to women for sexual purposes. If you don't think this will happen, look at this story about inmates identifying as Jewish to get kosher food.

www.thejc.com/news/uk-news/scottish-prison-sees-number-of-jewish-inmates-soar-as-they-claim-kosher-meals-1.63580

Most people who are in prison are there because they have no problem with flouting rules and regulations. What do you think will happen? They are bored, they are sexually frustrated, they are natural troublemakers and they will take advantage of the trans rights that are being fought for blindly, stupidly and aggressively by trans activists. Discussing this is not transphobic any more than having a burglar alarm is discriminatory. There is a serious danger here and it's not scaremongering to say so.

The majority of trans people are not the issue, except in so far as the rights to self-ID that they are pursuing will cause problems for them, and for women, and for children. I think if trans activists weren't operating in bad faith they would be listening to women instead of calling them TERFs and would be equally concerned about public safety. I know there are lovely, genuine, well-intentioned trans women and men out there; they are not the ones controlling this narrative or campaigning for access to the spaces and rights women have battled to attain. There is a streak of misogyny a mile wide in a lot of what trans activists say and do, and I find that unforgivable. Silencing women's concerns and shifting attention from women's issues to trans issues is deeply hostile. The language that they use is abusive and reductive. (There are many trans people who choose not to use that language, which I appreciate.)

I am not a TERF, but I strongly oppose self-ID because I have been a target for male sexual aggression since I was a child and I am not stupid enough to think anything has changed. Only someone truly naive (or someone who had not grown up as a girl) would expect anything different.

From the Sages link posted above:
'What does this mean in practice?

Currently, organisations offering single-sex services in sensitive situations may exclude people of the opposite birth sex if it is a proportionate means of achieving a legitimate aim.For example, a service for women who have experienced sexual assault could exclude a person who has transitioned to live as a woman from working as a therapist or accessing a women’s therapy group there.

Under the new recommendations, this would no longer be the case. A male person could legally change their gender to “woman” or “female” by self-declaration – no medical diagnosis of gender dysphoria or other assessment would be required, and they would not need to change anything about themselves, such as changing appearance or having medical treatment. This person would then be eligible to attend or work at the women-only therapy service in our example.'

What this also means in practice is that a young person I know who is suffering gender dysphoria and desperately wanting surgery is suffering even more stress from all the people turning this into a fashionable lifestyle choice. They are unwilling to be seen in public as their chosen gender until they can reliably 'pass' after hormone therapy. They might feel differently if TRAs were not causing all this controversy.

In my view those with gender dysphoria who undergo surgery should be able to have their gender reassigned, with birth gender recorded privately for DBS-checks for restricted roles, for county and higher sports competitions and for DNA searches if that is a significant difficulty for forensics. Those who don't wish to have surgery and hormones or whatever can do whatever they like in terms of how they dress and present, I don't care, but if they still have a penis they shouldn't be able to access vulnerable women and they should not be classed as women.

Amending the GRA to allow self-disclosure and no exclusions, as is being considered, would be disastrous for women.

That’s why I didn’t bother, PERF. It’s interesting to contemplate that there is a bit of tag-teaming to stop all the pesky gender critical women from communing with each other going on.
Much easier to do a quick eye roll and ignore the really obvious baiters though.
It’s Friday. Kudos to those with more energy than me!

s if trans women are accepted by men. In a world where men are constantly try to look the most “manliest” do you honestly think that transwomen are accepted into this

Being male has nothing to do with "manly" stereotypes. You see. That's your problem. Stereotyping. The deifintion of woman btw is not anyone doesn't fit in to the manly category.

It's an XX human with a vagina. And don't say you don't know if someone is a woman and what her chromosomes are. You know how babies are made.

They’re put with men as that’s what they are, they’re not women as it’s not possible to change sex.

*You will cause a few more to "peak trans" when the reality of the proposal of Self ID slaps them around the face like a flaccid penis.
*

Eloquently put

I didn’t know any of this until now. Good to have my eyes opened to it all!

3rd rule of misogyny: Women speaking for themselves are exclusionary and selfish.

gender dysphoria is a mental health issue, there really is no such thing as trans women/men, just women/men with mental health disease.
life is stressful and all sadly trying to go through life as another gender isn't going to change anything for the better. hence the high suicide rate.

I know MN is full of disgusting breeders and all, and no one should care about our opinion.... But people do. And this brings more attention to a group that have already become fairly synonymous with no longer taking TRA bullshit. You're just bringing more attention to how stupid it all is. You realise that right? You haven't made any intelligent coherent arguments, you sound like an arsey 19 year old. "Lily" is that you!?

Come back op. Where are you? You asked the question did you not want the responses? Don’t run off.😉

OP yes I know two fully surgically medically treated transsexuals.

That has nothing to do with the self ID problems we discuss on MN and my transsexual friends are also against self ID.

Anyway do you think transmen who don't pass are at risk from males or do you just not care?

Because they are, because they're female. The majority of sexual assault is by men against women, they don't rape women based on their gender identity. Straight men won't rape you because you're not a woman. Gay men won't because they aren't attracted to men with fake breasts.

There are no statistics to show that transwomen are at more risk than women. It's simply not true because you aren't women.

Cheers mamaryllis 🍷

Curiosity transwomen are not women. I guess they are men who don't like being men? How utterly arrogant of men to think they're so superior to women that they're even better at being women. That's what the trans movement represents to me: the height of male arrogance and ego.

It is a more complicated situation than some people like to make out. Unfortunately there is (or appears to be - how much of it is people who are neither transpeople, trans allies nor feminists stirring the pot for other reasons is quite hard to tell) so much rage, fear and stupidity on both sides that it becomes almost impossible to work out what's really going on.

Clanger Welcome! I avoided all the feminist boards and wondered why trans was such a big deal. Until last week.

Now I'm like an hungry gorilla who's just spotted someone running away with the last banana.

At work I'm known as "she's off again".

Hot diggity this is the worst thread yet.

OP you have put 2 and 2 together and came up with 'cabbage'.

I mean, at least know what you are complaining about before starting a thread.

sjwiki.org/wiki/Truscum

Truscum[3] (pronounced "true scum"), also known as transmedicalist and transfundamentalist,[4] are trans people who delegitimize the gender of other trans people.[5] They claim[6] one can't truly be transgender unless one experiences gender dysphoria, in this context it can sometimes be called physical dysphoria[7], as defined by cisnormative psychiatry[8] and medicine.[9]

Weebo I think this is one topic where people are genuinely confused rather than just plopping on a thread to talk shit.

I often see people saying "look at the feminist boards for an explanation" but where would you start? If OP just thought "transgender" was the new word for "transsexual" it would be an easy mistake to make.

Lower themselves to dress as a woman

Oh, we have a mysoginistic women hater. What a surprise!

Do you really think that all the men who view themselves as “manly” would lower themselves to dress as a woman just to peep at women in bathroom stalls? Do you really think that would happen?

Yep, some men will dress trans to access women’s spaces, and with self-ID coming in you won’t even need to make the effort of putting on a dress (you just have to claim to feel “like a woman” whatever that means...).

Here’s an example of a sex predator in Canada who pretended to be trans in order to prey on women at a rape crisis centre.
www.lifesitenews.com/news/sexual-predator-jailed-after-claiming-to-be-transgender-in-order-to-assault

What’s the prize for conclusively proving you wrong? Will you reconsider your position?

littlevoiceofsanity glad I’m not the only one! 🍌😂