To not agree with 'happy mum, happy baby'

[user1471506568]

Hard to articulate this without coming across as being intentionally offensive/goady but have been thinking about this issue a lot lately and would love to hear other people's thoughts.

Basically I keep seeing the phrase 'happy mother, happy baby' banded around in debates about loads of topics and it seems to almost be used as a means to justify whatever decision a parent makes as being best for the family. However the big assumption underlying this whole theory is that keeping mum happy is always the most important thing that contributes to a baby's happiness, but this can't always be the case and to what extent does this mantra let plain old selfishness creep in? Scientific research often tells us that some things are more beneficial for our children than other things and as our children are completely dependent and can't decide for themselves, should we not be taking more notice of this research rather than simply doing what suits us as adults best and what makes us happy?

I guess it's on my mind at the moment as I feel like I have to a certain extent sacrificed a lot of my happiness in order to make what I think is the best decision for my kids. Many of these decisions have come at a huge personal cost to me and I struggle everyday but I honestly do it because I think my choices are best for my kids.

So for me actually that phrase irritates me as it implies that it is easy to somehow achieve the dream where everyone in a family is equally happy and a baby or child's needs and wants can be met without anybody else's (usually the mother's) needs and wants being sacrificed. I think that this is damaging and gives parents an unrealistic idea of what parenting is like and also will be hijacked by some so that they can maintain their own happiness at the cost of their children's.

I’ve only ever heard it used in relation to feeding when someone has decided for whatever reasons and issues to formula feed instead of bf. So if that’s the ‘scientific research’ you refer to YABU.

Can’t comment on the rest but if something is detriment to a mums mental health then I agree with the phrase. Can’t think of what else it would refer to? As PP said I have only ever heard this term used as a support to women.

Ahh xpost with the last few I see

I completely disagree. I don’t like the phrase, it’s too twee for me, but I actually think its very helpful for some mothers to hear that they can put their needs first and it isn’t going to be the end of the world. You only have to look at the responses above to see that people are already insinuating that it means you are “selfish” if you dare to not martyr yourself to your chid 24/7.

I guess it's on my mind at the moment as I feel like I have to a certain extent sacrificed a lot of my happiness in order to make what I think is the best decision for my kids

Well, that is your call. But your OP reads very much as though you would like to reassured that everyone else is equally miserable and self-sacrificing. I'm not. I adore my son, but I certainly haven't reinvented my life for his sake, or become any less interested in my own goals and contentment.

I had this A LOT when dd was born and throughout her v infant years. Really annoying and self-serving for dd's mum to make the most ridiculous of demands/ultimatums. A real power trip.
Those were difficult years.

This phrase is not justification for a cop out but it has its place when a mum is suffering from guilt because of contradictory advices she hears / is Given. Mothers need to build their confidence.

So yes common sense really. I use it as and when necessary and will continue to do so.

I definitely think happy baby, happy parents is more apt. That sense of relief when you finally get a screaming, over tired baby to sleep is like nothing else.

I also disagree to an extent.

My mental health has suffered enormously in recent months and it has got to the point that I’ve been so unhappy, that my own feelings have affected the sort of mother I’ve been. So I have had to make some changes in order to sort out my mental health, so that in time I can be a better mum again. So in my case, me being happy then means I’m a better mum to my Dd.

Using it as an excuse for lots of ‘me time’ is irritating though.

I think it’s good in certain circumstances such as when breastfeeding is not working out. Why women should have to punish themselves with guilt when there is an alternative is beyond me. In terms of mothers getting a break and all other ‘guilt’ inducing choices which are perfectly acceptable, just not gold standard. However, it shouldn’t be used to pacify dangerous choices!

Tilapia - sorry I don't know how to get your name in bold. Deliberately left the detail out as didn't want to make the thread about the decisions I made that I thought were best for my children because I didn't want to by implication make people feel that I was judging them for not making the same choices if that makes sense.

I'm struggling to think of an example that won't start a bun fight...

I think its an idiotic phrase generally used by selfish people trying to justify pleasing themselves first.

Exactly. And to also justify poor parenting choices. It's a stock phrase of the hun brigate though.

This phrase is frequently used to comfort a mother who's had a shitty time trying to breastfeed and who has not succeeded. Where she's got tongue point of absolute despair because despite pumping 12 times a day her baby still isn't getting the hang of breastfeeding and she doesn't have the support she needs to carry on.
A Mum without PND is certainly hugely beneficial to the baby and not succeeding in feeding your baby the way you planned sadly often leads to PND.
I've never heard anyone say to a mother that of going out drinking everynight males her happy then that's good for her baby.
YABU.

Even very young children pick up on their parents' stress, anxiety, low mood etc - if you are an unhappy parent because of trying to make what you think are the best parenting choices for your child but which are possibly not the best for you, it's likely that your household and therefore your children are not going to be at optimum happiness. Therefore, happier parent = happier baby.

Also, I generally think that, with the exception of genuinely neglectful or substandard circumstances, pretty much everybody averages out as an adult and makes their own way regardless of whether they had a SAHM or a WOHM, were breastfed or bottlefed, ate mostly chicken nuggets or had a varied organic diet, were ferried to and from structured activities or just left to free-range and so on and so forth. I have a lot of friends: good luck identifying which successful adult arose from which parenting model.

Hence, spending your children's early years miserable because of your choices or fretting about personal sacrifices is almost certainly a waste of good years and also not having as much of an impact on your children's future lives as you might currently be convinced it will.

Well op as I say (and X posted with others) I've only heard it in the context of bf. I really can't think any other examples where someone would use this phrase

Is this a disguised bf v ff thread?

Gin, probably.

Raindogs - I never said I was miserable so don't know where you got that from. I guess as other posters have said I have struggled with the phrase as it just doesn't ring true for me. I have sacrificed some of my personal happiness related to my wants and needs for the sake of my children but ultimately this has made me happier as I know my kids are happy. It's great you haven't and that's why I posted to get other people's thoughts and experiences.

Not very well disguised if so

I always thought uncomfortable mother comfortable baby was a better saying as if I was uncomfortable they would sleep/feed beautifully. If I got into a comfortable position they would wake up/be grumpy and generally express their dissatisfaction.

EVERY parent sacrifices some of their personal happiness in some way op. It's in the job description.

It's overly simplistic bullshit.

I've mostly heard it used to support a Mum who's really not coping with a particular thing, basically as a way of saying it's ok to stop/change. I don't think anyone would agree that happy Mum = happy baby regardless of the context. God knows id be happier if I could lie in until lunch time every day but given that my DD screams if I even try and have another 5 minutes in bed I don't think she feels the same 🙈 Although actually I was quite surprised recently at reading that quite a few people had loved their babies out of their room before 6 months because the baby kept waking them, rather than because they kept waking the baby.

The one that bothers me more is 'I know what's best for my child', most recently seen on a post on Facebook about the importance of staying rear-facing in the car until 4 by parents justifying their decision to turn their babies at 1. And the 'how did people survive before (insert current guidance here)'. Well not so many did did they 🤷‍♀️

It's a daft phrase but I can see both side.

Surely by making the decision to have children you know that your life will never be the same and will invole having to make sacrifices?
I also think most of us simply don't realise the actual extent of those sacrifices until forced to make them.

At the moment, for me, it is getting an hour or so break to do something away from a screamy, colicky baby. This makes me 'happier' and better able to deal with said baby. I refuse to bf this time too. For my own sanity.

I gave up my career after the first but still work part time because I couldn't do SAHM. It would've made me miserable not working.

I think it's vital to be a bit selfish and do things for yourself. The issue is getting chance to!

OP you sound smug and judgmental.

Lovesagain - No it isn't a disguised thread about any particular issue. I have deliberately not included specific examples because I know that people are itching to have the BF v FF, WOHM v SAHM etc etc debates.

I guess an example I could give that isn't too contentious I hope is that I find playing with my children sometimes a bit tedious and boring but I know that this helps them develop and makes them happy.