AIBU to ask why you for Brexit?

[BillySmut56]

I'm politically neautral on Brexit, it's a complicated issue, but I'm interested in the consequences that are coming out now. If you voted for Brexit, what were your reasons?

Don't you think that if the lower educated and the poorest in a community are that upset 17million go out and vote, there is something pretty shitty happening in a country...

Yes, there is mummy. The media and politicans have spent decades telling people that the problems of the "lower educated and the poorest" was caused by the EU not UK policy. This is a cynical tactic designed to manipulate those who were not in possession of the facts.

the lower educated and the poorest in a community are that upset 17million go out and vote, there is something pretty shitty happening in a country

Abso - fucking - lutely

And when members of the elite like JRM, Gove, Farage and that tosser Johnson are telling you what to do run for the hills or do the opposite.

Yes there are problems in this country but the scapegoat is the EU. Now that scapegoat is disappearing the British civil service is the new scapegoat. Another unelected elite to blame.

The people to blame are the rich, upper class, privately educated, white boys! The ones blaming the foreigners!

Obviously a simplistic response but do you really think that bunch have the best interests of the working classes at heart? Really?

www.msn.com/en-gb/news/world/hunter-knocked-unconscious-by-dead-goose-falling-from-sky/ar-BBIEb5v?ocid=spartanntp

Cause and effect , this is a scenario very much like the poorest in the country voting leave .

It is important to consider the above argument in the context of the Coalition Government’s Austerity programme. Following the implosion of the financial sector between 2007-2010, the mantra since has been centred around the importance of deficit reduction and ‘household’ fiscal prudence. However, as the Institute for Fiscal Studies has recently demonstrated, such cuts have fallen in a disproportionate manner on those areas already ‘more reliant on central government grants’.
Despite the median cut value being 22.9%, cuts have varied from 6.2% for Lincolnshire to the larger levels of the North East and North West. The number of Sure Start centres declined from 3,631 to 3,019 between April 2010 and June 2015, whilst overall government spending on social care fell by 13.4% by the end of the Coalition. The poorest areas, and the poorest families, have been hit the hardest. It is highly plausible, therefore, that the impact of austerity has strengthened a framework within which the leave campaign’s message could have gained credence and resonance.

Maybe I don't know about all these things.

But why no plan?

Just something. Anything at all.....

Do people just see the headline and not the full article ? So for instance from The Telegraph , the headline is Brexit gloom lifted again as UK growth is upgraded , sounds marvellous doesn't it ? Indeed the first couple of paragraphs make it sound so , but keep reading , towards the end of the article the same bunch of people who gave us the cheery news state that the UK growth was struggling to accelerate ,will still be trailing behind other countries in the Eurozone , the US and Globally and that The UK will remain stuck in the middle lane for 2018 and over the medium term , oh and they have downgraded their growth forecasts for 2019, 2020 and 2021

Make perhaps the whole thing is a dastardly Tory plan to ensure they remain in power ? The general population is pissed off with austerity , give them something to rail against , the EU , give them a referendum , stir up nationalism to peak frenzy , get a leave vote , declare this ' The will of the People' repeatedly , thus laying the blame for any future consequences squarely with said people , call GE during turmoil , get in for another 5 years . Anything bad happens now , not their fault , entirely down to the will of the people and respecting democracy .

Other than that , nope no actual detailed plan of how the UK is going to function out of the EU in approx. 14 months time , eek !

You can work out as many what might happen plans, but until something is agreed on both sides how can they announce anything.

Or do you want the..
Should we stay.
should we stay in name only.
should we go soft.
should we go hard,
should we just do WTO.

Plan,,,

but until something is agreed on both sides how can they announce anything.

I think that is the very nature of plans, isn't it. That they look forward?

Announcements about what has already occured is history.

Or do you want the..
Should we stay.
should we stay in name only.
should we go soft.
should we go hard,
should we just do WTO

YES YES YES to all of the above , although a bit late in the day now , all of those scenarios should have been detailed and there for everyone to see during the campaigning or at least that is how a responsible government should have acted .

I bet you 1000 pounds all these plans are being thought of in one form or another.

This still does not mean you should have the right to see read fight over them until, the final deal is know, just because you think you should.

After all this is a trade deal and they wouldn't want the other side to know all the details, as it just isn't done.

As to the Refurendum, how can the remain always fall back on we didn't' think they meant this..

We knew, we knew leave meant trade deals, and all the rest, does this mean remain were just blind, or so sure they should win, that they reckless ignored all your good advice. As the remainers on here seem to have such wonderful incites to what would and could have and should have worked.

The thing is though Mummy , the other side does already know all the details , the other 27 countries are well aware of all the scenarios, because someone has bothered to do the impact assessments on them and how they effect the 27 other countries .

Impact assessments in the UK

Exist and are very detailed but no-one can see them
Don't exist
Exist but not very detailed and no-one can see them
Published a load of cut and paste stuff from wiki

all of the above has been the government position over the last few months .

Everyone that wanted to vote, voted.
A vote was won.
Can we just not leave the woman to get on with It?
Europe is not going to make it easy.
We will not get everything we want.
No one has a crystal ball
Our lot will do their best to get what we want.
What would make them less sure in Europe was if everyone stopped squabbling and trying to undermine her and got behind her.
If more time was spent fighting for better terms rather than heading off yet more revolt, we would get the job done quicker.

Impact assessments in the UK

Mummy this is so much more than just a trade deal , or even several trade deals .

No frumpety, this is a trade deal, it always was just a trade deal.
Everything else is just add-ons.

Jamie with the greatest of respect , I didn't vote for her , I didn't vote for her party and along with 48% of those who voted in the referendum , I didn't vote leave , so no I will not be 'getting' behind her and her shambles of a government .

If , and this is a massive fairy tale mythical creature of an if , the government suddenly started acting like one , came up with a plan of how we are going to proceed that does not in any way leave us worse off than we were before June 2016 , then I could change my position.

It never was just a trade deal , it was indeed a lot more simplistic and had fewer countries involved , but just a trade deal , never .

Just in case I am at cross purposes with you Mummy when you say 'this' in the past and present tense do you mean

Leaving is just a trade deal ?

or

Being a member of the EU was just a trade deal ?

Are you from London by any chance GhostofFrankGrimes ?

Are you from London by any chance GhostofFrankGrimes ?

No, I'm a northerner.

Oh and Jamie what are these better terms you speak of ? In the customs union or out ? in the single market or out ? financial passporting , who gives a toss or we are buggered if we lose it ?

Remember the answer you give is your opinion , it wont match up precisely with the 17 million other people who voted to leave .

I just wondered Ghost as I do agree with Mummy that a whole lot of people felt strongly enough to vote Leave across the country, and it seems normally to only be Londonders that do not usually understand why and how bad things may be in some places

I mean This was originally a trade deal, that spread into our lives like a virus with add ons.
Now we are leaving this is working out a trade deal, and yes there will be add ons to that as well.