To say bras are not for boys

[AssignedPuuurfectAtBirth]

Another trans bully nightmare. Targetting the yellowberry bra brand now

lilymaynard.wordpress.com/2017/12/31/bra-gate-yellowberry-products-now-for-everyone/

When will this BS end?

This is the basis of patriarchal control of women.

Exactly. I have seen so many instances of women caving and apologising. Genuinely submitting.

Which could never, ever happen if men did not have the power. And that power can only be maintained if it is underpinned by threat.

And, of course, you don't have to be the man who is threatening to, not only benefit from the power those threats afford you, but use that power knowing women submit.

And then women are blamed for not "standing up" to them. Why can't men stand up to them? Why do men in general not feel like what happens to women is anything to do with them, even when the perpetrators are men? And that's the million dollar question really isn't it. Most men only seem to care about women they know / love, not about women generally. Is it because they're brought up to be more selfish and less empathetic? Is it because of a subconscious feeling about women being not worthy of concern in the same way men are? Is it because so many of them have mistreated women / girls even if it's exploiting them 3rd hand then it's easier to pretend that they aren't very important and just to turn a blind eye?

xposts and a bit of a tangent there

All and Everyone of us must have the right for boobs and penises.
The era of an Hermaphrodite has arrived.... behold.
Ones without or opposed to, must be burnt.

[bangs head].

UpABitLate

It's interesting how many men perceive women, isn't it? As lesser than. As submissive.

Does it ever cross their mind that women are forced to be submissive by people who are bigger and stronger, I wonder.

Up i think it's that they genuinely don't understand that we are/feel at risk from these men.

In their heads, if someone was being a dick they'd tell them to fuck off. They genuinely don't get why we wouldn't do that.

I have a friend who says "equalism not feminism" and his reasoning is that he has experienced sexually aggresssive women on a night out and cooks the meals in his house so there's no need for feminism. He just doesn't get it.

Exactly. SheKnows

What is manspreading or that thing where men walk down the street oblivious to the fact that women are moving out of their way, if not the benefit of power initiated by their more violent members.

What must it be like to be hundred percent aware, but only on a subconscious level, that women automatically defer to you, physically.

The primaeval knowledge that you have never analysed or even noticed. But is always there. In every walk of life and everything you do.

The shock when men think women are hogging a meeting, only to be told that women have been talking for 30 percent of the time, for instance.

I don't think all men view us as lesser. I think some are a bit confused as to wjy we are so 'wet' sometimes and don't stand up to these men.

I guess that's where the 'blame' bit comes in.

The friend I mentioned above knows that I had rape threats made against me directly and openly on a train full of people. He also knows that a stranger (man) discreetly looked after me.

All he sees is that I was ultimately ok. He doesn't get the fear, anger, humiliation that it happened.

I don't mean lesser in an obvious all women are fools way.

I mean that they are unaware of their privilege. Or unaware of the fact that it is privilege. To them, it's just normal.

I think the average man has no idea of the number of incidents of intimidation, threats, aggression, and actual assaults / violence that most women have been subject to, to a greater or a lesser extent, and that the majority of it is sexual based which is just completely alien to them.

How they are unaware despite the fact it comes up every couple of years is beyond me.

I wonder if it goes back to this "my women" and other women stuff. While it is other women talking they don't feel that it's relevant to them in any way so they tune it out.

Maybe it's all just academic to them whereas for us it's in our faces so we don't get why they just don't get it.

So then the next question is, when men, or TIMs, threaten us with rape, threaten our children, all that stuff. Do they genuinely not think for a moment that it will be taken seriously?

Or do they know that of course we will take it seriously?

Or, a mixture?

I mean, when a man threatens rape, then I, as a woman, take it that he seriously wants to rape me. I've not been threatened with this online just in real life a couple of times.

That's a little difficult when women are relentlessly no platformed, persecuted for objecting, threatened and beaten with the deafening mantra #NoDebate

Also why is it I only two way? Why are men not also at the table? Or TIFs for that matter.

Men who have presented gender critical ideas to the media have had a bit of backlash but not the same rape threats and death threats and threats to their families as far as I've seen.

Certainly this is reserved for women and it's the rage at us stepping out of our place. Men are allowed to have opinions and debate. Women, not so much.

This is a very good article about experience of one woman advocating for men vs women.

So then the next question is, when men, or TIMs, threaten us with rape, threaten our children, all that stuff. Do they genuinely not think for a moment that it will be taken seriously?

I don't think many men do take it seriously. They think these men are outliers, weirdos, one-offs.

And of course, the extreme ones probably are. But nonetheless, they are leveraging and exploiting a patriarchal society where men have the power.

Women absolutely know they cannot afford to rattle the cage.

Street harassment being an example. If you turn round and give a cat caller a mouthful, women know there is absolutely every chance that they will get threatened as a result.

In fact, I would be willing to bet if you freeze frame just after a woman has told a cat caller to fuck off and then asked a selection of men what would happen next, I think there would be many men who would expect her to receive a negative reaction.

Instinctively. As it will probably make them uncomfortable to say so out loud.

They know how it works, they live it. They just never analyse it and see it from the woman's point of view.

What I meant was, the ones doing the threatening - do they imagine we won't take it seriously? Or do they imagine that we will?

Men often say they were just joking or got carried away when confronted with making these types of threats and they had no idea they would be taken seriously. Is it possible that this is ever true? Surely all men know that any woman threatened with rape by a man will not just go oh that's obviously a joke and of no consequence whatsoever, I won't even bother laughing because it's literally not had any effect on me whatsoever, I might as well have just read a weather report.

"In fact, I would be willing to bet if you freeze frame just after a woman has told a cat caller to fuck off and then asked a selection of men what would happen next, I think there would be many men who would expect her to receive a negative reaction. "

Ah, but she was rude, wasn't she. There was no need for that.

And of course when I do it (the hypothetical man being asked) it's completely different to how that man did it.

Up I love that article by Jessica Eaton, menshould be forced to read it.

What I meant was, the ones doing the threatening - do they imagine we won't take it seriously? Or do they imagine that we will?

I would imagine that the majority of them haven't thought about it.

There will be those who mean it and those who don't. But I don't really think they consider how we will actually receive/perceive it. It's just about them venting their anger at us.

Ah, but she was rude, wasn't she. There was no need for that.

Exactly. "Well what did you expect?"

They get it, it just never, ever produces any kind of dot joining exercise or lightbulb moment.

I've said it before, I do wonder if this entire issue could be turned round in one generation if feminism 101 was taught in schools.

About how gender roles negatively affect women and men. Girls and boys.

Like that excellent attempt by the BBC programme no more girls and boys.

It didn't make the boys, nor the male parents feel emasculated or sidelined. It helped both sexes.

Challenging negative gender stereotypes in school is one initiative the government could introduce that I would wholeheartedly support.

It would stop the bullying of 'not typical' boys and girls and be fairer all round.

Starting of with "what is a boy/girl?" And then unpicking every preconception.

They know how it works, they live it. They just never analyse it and see it from the woman's point of view.

In my experience of debating this with men on left oriented sites like the Guardian, they claim it's not that common because they haven't personally seen it. So I think quite a lot of men are just self centred and unobservant and don't think much. There's this sense that women they are not connected with personally are just kind of things to be commented on rather than people with feelings and lives.

"DARVO refers to a reaction perpetrators of wrong doing, particularly sexual offenders, may display in response to being held accountable for their behavior. DARVO stands for "Deny, Attack, and Reverse Victim and Offender."
dynamic.uoregon.edu/jjf/defineDARVO.html
They do it because it works. Much of the time when we become upset they dismiss us by saying they only did it to frighten us. They are not confessing, they are bragging.