To think SIL has mental health issues

[Vanessatiger]

Back story: in the beginning SIL and I were okay with each other, she lives across the big pond so visits were about once a year.
Then I had a miscarriage at a late stage, was deeply traumatised. At the same time, she went behind my back and said to DH to dump me because I had told his mother that before the miscarriage we had a big row and DH slammed the door loudly and I got shocked and started bleeding.

They (MIL and SIL) said what I said was horrible about her brother and I deserved to lose the baby (SIL) said so.
Since then I had only seen her once. This was years ago.

Fast forward 4 years, I got pregnant with DD now 3 and DS now 8 months. SIL has never once got in touch and been silent whenever I write to her on her DS’s birthday and during Christmas. I feel I should mend our relationship for the sake of DH as he’s very close to his sister growing up.

So MIL has never met our DCs as she always made excuses not to meet them. SIL met DD once as a baby as was not that interested. DH has two DSs from previous and she dots over them.

Anyway on Christmas eve I sent an email to her saying Merry Christmas to her and her DS, wishing them a nice holiday. And told her she’s welcome to skype our DCs.

She wrote back with spite. Saying she dies not want to get to know our DCs because I’m their mother and that she feels sorry for my DH because he has me. That it’s inappropriate to wish her a merry Christmas as her DM is terminally ill. Then she added “ i want no contact”.

DH was deeply hurt by her email as she copied him in it.

They always had a good relationship despite being far away from each other, but it seems she now closed the door to him as well.
He’s hurt she wants nothing to do with our DCs. His mother already did the same but DH thinks it’s forgivable because MIL is old and ill. But SIL isn’t old nor ill so shouldn’t shut his children out like that.

We’ve decided not to send DHs kids to her anymore as we’ve done in the past two summers. Because she seems to have poisoned their minds about me as well.
Plus we don’t want our children to feel left out once they’re older.

Is she mentally ill or what?

Oh and I can see what you mean if you thought MIL/SIL were suffering from depression or were bipolar and THAT was why they were acting against your wishes. ( mental health issues)

But I think they just don't like you. Because you have maligned their son/brother.

I'm sorry op but this kind of thing really upsets me. Mental illness is a term that gets thrown around by unqualified people to describe others in a negative light. I'm really surprised you feel you can comment on her health, mental or otherwise. It's quite an offensive comment.

That being said I totally agree with previous replies, you did s nice thing trying to mend the relationship and if that's how she's going to be then don't give her any of your time. She sounds like she has handled the situation very badly.

Keep your chin up and know you are the bigger person xx

I'm fairly certain I recognise the OP from multiple other usernames and there is a massive back story. And yes I think the SIL would have a VERY different version of events.

Oh my word I hadn't read that all the way through, you accused him of causing your late miscarriage with nothing to back it up? Bloody hell how can you not see how upsetting that would be? I think you will just have to face facts that she doesn't like you and you won't be part of each other's lives. It's not the end of the world, you can still have a happy life without them in it, especially if you don't like them anyway!

That miscarriage comment though...unless you were told by a doctor that was the cause...I could not forgive it. Although I'm sure at the time you were grief stricken beyond words. If you wanted to really mend things I think an apology would be in order there.

Whatever you do good luck and try to enjoy the things you do have which you are thankful for xx

Elton I've been thinking exactly the same as I've been reading this thread. A very similar style of narrative to previous threads.
OP, you are wrong to pin your SIL's behaviour on mental ill health. It is very insulting.
You are being unrealistic to think that your accusation about DH causing your miscarriage can be easily forgotten or forgiven.
Your SC don't live with you. I think that it would be fairer to them to enable them to continue to visit their terminally ill GM if you can afford to. Yes, it is unfair that your younger children don't have a similar relationship with their paternal family, but don't punish the older 2 for this.
Your DH needs to be able to make his own mind up over how he communicates with his sis and DM. You are obviously very biased and influential, but he deserves some space and time to decide for himself. Does he visit his DM ever? Would he go on his own with your 2youngest?

whenever I write to her on her DS’s birthday and during Christmas. I feel I should mend our relationship for the sake of DH as he’s very close to his sister growing up.

Why are you persisting in writing to someone who told you deserved to lose your baby? You say you want to mend the relationship, but why? It's clear SIL doesn't want a reconciliation so why would you keep pushing?

Also, in your OP you only mentioned that your DH slammed the door after a row, which made you miscarry, but later you mention more abuse ('bang the table with his bare hand to scare me into silence, cornering me, punch the wall next to me'). Why did you minimise what he did initially?

Are you minimising other abuse from your DH?

I really hope the posters who think they recognise the OP from other threads are right; otherwise, the response here is quite shocking.

She hasn't pinned her SIL's behaviour on MH issues - she asked the question and has been told quite firmly not to link the two and she has apologised.

In their disgust at the OP for blaming her DH for her miscarriage, people seem to be wilfully ignoring the fact that she has said her pregnancy involved daily rows where he banged the table to scare her into silence, cornered her, punched the wall next to her... under normal circumstances MN would be outraged by this.

I don't get on with my SIL but if she was grieving after a miscarriage and blamed my DB (assuming she had been given no other medical explanation), and that is the way he had treated her, I would be on her side. Blaming him for the miscarriage may be cruel but I would think that is an entirely understandable response given the way he treated her throughout her pregnancy. I certainly wouldn't then be saying she deserved to lose her baby.

@mirialis You're right. I can't speak for anyone else but for me, miscarriage is such a hot-button issue that it's hard to see past that. I just remember the agony of worrying that I had done something to cause my miscarriage and if someone else had told me I had, I would have been devastated beyond belief.

I still think it was an unbearably cruel thing to do but it doesn't cancel out OP's DH's abuse or his sister's terrible behaviour and I apologise if it seems I was suggesting it did.

But presumably you have a good and normal relationship with your SIL mirialis? And your dBro and you a good one? It doesn't sound like this is the case for OP.

This family sounds toxic before this happened and the dh has obviously not been honest and admitted his behaviour to back up his wife, so things can't be as good there as the op thinks either. Otherwise if he had backed her up and apologised then SIL wouldn't have disbelieved her. SIL is a cruel person to say OP deserved it, that can't be disputed and I'm .urprise again at her dh. If someone said my baby deserved to die I'd be nc immediately. Which makes me think there's again lot more to this again and it probably involves all of them being toxic to each other.

I'd also be concerned about what has changed, people who are abusive to their partner during pregnancy usually get worse. They don't do a 180 and blame it on stressful work. And they always have the potential to do it again...

Peach, I can see where you're coming from, but personally I don't think a woman who has miscarried blaming someone else for it (even the father) is on a par with someone telling the woman herself that she caused it. The OP suffered it, not her husband.

I know men have feelings. I know that fathers matter, believe me. But fathers do not have miscarriages. They may be bereft about it, but they do not experience it physically. How many men have written about feeling utterly betrayed by their own body after a miscarriage?

In recent years, the cultural shift to include men in parenting, and recognise that fatherhood is an important role, and recognise that yes men can be devastated by pregnancy loss, I think we're in danger of losing sight of the greater impact of miscarriages and childbirth on women. We're going from old attitudes of "oh, men shouldn't care" to 'the effect on men is just as great as on women'.

Also, I wouldn't really be in a hurry to assume that a man engaging in abusive behaviour cared as much about his unborn baby as the next, throughly decent man...

Would posters really spend £1000s to send kids to visit someone who not only hated them, but encouraged the kids to hate them too and who'd said they deserved to have a miscarriage?!

Personally OP I'd have ended contact with her the moment she'd said that. What a disgusting thing to say!

I can understand why you might have thought your husband's physical and emotional abuse might have caused the miscarriage. It must have been very scary for you. He sounds pretty awful to be honest.

Try and move on from SIL and I hope you are safe now with your DH. You say he's not physical anymore, which makes me wonder if he's still being abusive in other ways.

I’ve only registered this username. I haven’t used other names.

I haven’t prevented DH from seeing his DM. He took the two older ones recently and he went on his own in the summer. He asked DMILif she wanted to see the younger ones, she said no (even without me). They (SIL and MIL) aren’t interested.
I’m no saint,but they are a complicated family. DMIL has gone NC with her niece because the niece had an affair with a married man (DM doesn’t condone such shameful behaviour). So she rather has no contact with her only niece than keeping in touch with her only niece that lives in the same town as her. DH only grew up not knowing his dad’s entire family, because MIL has gone NC with that branch of the family for whatever reason. She has form for it.

Re not sending Stepsons to see their aunt,no why would we when she’s not been civil with us. Would you send your child to someone who talks badly about you and potentially would poison their minds with negativity? Screw that. Aunts have no automatic rights to their nieces and nephews.

I forgot to add that I feel sorry for her DS as he has no father. He’s a single child and all his life he never knew his father as SIL said the father is a psychopath and not allowing her DS to see him. Though not sure how true that is.. i never knew the father.

Nothing you describe points to mental illness.
Neither of you hold the other in high regard. I don't see the need for the drama attempts to 'fix' things as you live thousands of miles apart, so couldn't have a genuinely close relationship anyway.

OP - for some people, going "no contact" is the absolutely nuclear option; they would rather suffer all sorts of upset and injury and than break off all contact with a family member. For others it's the obvious and simple solution and once their mind is set there's no going back, no matter what the other person might try to make amends. Sounds like you fall into the former category and your SIL into the latter. I personally don't think either is necessarily healthier/saner/kinder/wiser whatever.

Your SIL has said "no contact" and that means NO CONTACT. I don't think you should be facilitating and paying for your stepchildren's contact either. If it is important to SIL/MIL/DH's ex they can sort it out between themselves. After what she said no one can expect you to facilitate and pay for your stepchildren to go and spend time with her.

I'd just add to that, though, that there is a difference between 'no contact' and 'refusing to speak to someone'. The first is a means of cutting out drama and pain, the latter is an attempt to prompt both.

Yes Yorick - I think the SIL's message that she attached to the "no contact" email made it pretty bloody clear she's quite up for causing drama and pain in the OP's life.

Yeah...it's the equivalent of sending someone an abusive message and then finishing with 'I don't want to discuss it any more', which basically means "I've had my say and I want the last word".

So much drama. SIL sounds like the only sane one here.

OP, you sound like a goady fucker underneath all that faux nice concern. Accusing her closest relative of causing your miscarriage is a really shitty thing to do. Someone saying something so extremely manipulative and nasty, would incur my wrath too and I probably would dislike you after that. I hate passive-aggressive people who continue to pester me, instead of staying the fuck away. Why don’t you leave her in peace? You sound quite poisonous with your fake concern over your SIL mental health, especially while her mother is ill. It is perfectly normal to loathe manipulative people. It’s a shame your kids are paying the price for your behaviour!

I am not concerned about her at all, just trying to find a reason to her behaviour. I think she’s the poisonous here but whatever floats your boat.

Oh, OP I think your posts made it very clear you don’t care for your SIL and it is all about you! Your SIL’s behaviour makes perfect sense to me. You shown your true colours to her a few years ago and she doesn’t want anything to do with you. I completely agree with Sashkin, she actually sounds totally sane! Whereas, you sound like pure poison. No wonder, Sil and Mil do not like you.

I am not concerned about her at all, just trying to find a reason to her behaviour. I think she’s the poisonous here but whatever floats your boat.
How many times do you want ppl to give you the reason, op? She hasn't liked You since you accused her db of causing your miscarriage, and you've been bugging her since. So much so, that it appears she doesn't want much to do with her db now either. She doesn't have to like you, or have anything to do with you or your DC if she doesn't want to.
No matter how many examples of how her/dmil are unreasonable will change this. They don't impact on the reason she wants NC with you, you're just making yourself look petty by dredging up unrelated stuff. (I'd possibly go NC with a niece who knowingly had an affair with a married man too. It's a scummy thing to do)
Just leave her alone, if she wants dh's older DC to visit, she can initiate contact. Not that it's anything to do with you really.

just trying to find a reason to her behaviour.

But .... it's obvious! Why do you keep asking? Please help me understand why you keep asking. Your SIL and MIL don't like you and don't want you in their lives. Because** of your treatment of their DB/DS.