about the childminder and conjunctivitis

[mikesh909]

Background: DD is 1 and attends a childminder usually 3 days per week. This week she is booked in for all 5 days due to a temporary change in my work schedule. Other than attending this childminder, she is at home with her father and me. No other groups / settings / activities. We have been so busy lately due to work commitments we have been nowhere and seen no-one.

Over the weekend DD came down with conjunctivitis. We saw a pharmacist who said nothing OTC for 1 year olds. I read the NHS website which states Public Health England advises no need to stay home from work / school / nursery (www.nhs.uk/conditions/conjunctivitis/#work-and-school). I also read their parent handbook which states 48 hr exclusion period for D&V but mild illnesses e.g. colds are acceptable. I am a teacher and its not easy for me to take days off. DH stands to lose a sizeable Christmas bonus if he takes any days off for any reason in December. DD seemed well in herself so we dropped her off as usual this morning.

By midmorning I had received notification to pick her up. I now understand that the 'mild illnesses' in the policy doesn't cover conjunctivitis. Despite the huge hassles and financial losses that this will incur, I understand that I must make alternative arrangements for the rest of the week.

In the text conversation and then later when I collected DD, the CM herself and one of her team were both very insistent that she had not contracted the infection whilst in their care. In response to this, I was equally insistent that she most likely had. I cannot see how she could have picked it up from home when neither of us have (or have ever had!) this infection and no-one else has been here. She has not been anywhere else. There are many other kids / parents at this setting and they also go on regular outings to other public places. The conversation got a little awkward in the end. I told the CM I was finding the insistence hard to take. So... 1. Was IBU to press the point that the overwhelming probability is that my DD picked up this infection whilst in their care? I need to contact them to confirm her hours for January - 2. Would IBU to mention it in writing? Her response at the time was about protecting the other children - which indicates to me she hasn't really understood my point. I.e. that I know I need to keep DD at home for that exact purpose, but nonetheless I'm unhappy with their obstinance.

Yes, Increasinglymiddleaged I am going to do so. And you're right I was unreasonable to get into a debate about where it was picked up was futile.

It's happened, you can't change it, get over it!

You've been going on about it for three hours now.

Conjunctivitis is unpleasant and I'm sorry your child has got it. I dread to think how you'll cope with head lice and worms as they go round child care settings like wildfire.

My DD has had all three over the years she was at nursery/childminder, I just treated and moved on.

OP. My DC1 kept getting it, and the CM kept sending her home, and it was always hellishly inconvenient and frustrating. My CM was excellent though - it really was just one of those things and something DC1 grew out of eventually.

You’d not be unreasonable to suggest maybe the “mild illness” policy needs clarifying- perhaps to exclude conjunctivitis and to add a “discretion of the CM” clause - but please don’t add this but about the policy being misleading as to

whether it's a suitable setting given an individuals work commitments etc.

because basically unless you employ a nanny, every childcare setting will have the same sort of issues for working parents without family back-up.

More . End of Christmas term, first trimester, ill baby. You need plenty of TLC.

Say sorry to CM along with your Christmas card & gift, and chalk it up. Good CM relationships are worth their weight in gold, honestly, so try to let it go & repair things.

I know this doesn't directly relate to your questions OP, so please don't shout at me

It's so hard when they are little and picking up these things at a childcare setting (or elsewhere) I'm a teacher too and my 1 year old got viral gingivitis (from nursery?) which is apparently a form of the herpes virus followed by chicken pox (definitely from nursery) then my 3 year old got the pox too. Vast quantities of days off resulting in docked pay.

Definitely agree with pps that if you generally like your childminder that this is not worth pursuing and a conversation after Christmas about which illnesses she will not accept children with, is a good plan.

Hope you have a relaxing holiday.

I have three questions. I hope you can answer them honestly.

1. Do you like your childminder?

2. Do you trust and respect your childminder?

3. How do you feel about other parents making decisions about what constitutes a minor illness and it being different to what your opinion of what one is?

I think the easiest option would have been to text before or ask at drop off. It sounds like you cleaned her up and snuck her in without mentioning it hoping the childminder wouldn’t notice.

I think you've had a hard time here OP. My children are older now, but when you're a working parent there is nothing more frustrating than having a bouncing off the walls, happy toddler who is not allowed to their childcare setting, when the NHS website clearly says that this is not an illness that requires exclusion from a setting. I am really vigilant about illness - never send children back before the 48 hours are up for sickness etc, don't do the "send them in on Calpol and cross my fingers" type thing, but conjunctivitis is a massive pain in the arse. I too have had the situation where the gp was telling me it was fine to send children to nursery, and printing out the proof, and nursery saying no.

However - in saying all that - if the childminder is refusing then there isn't a lot you can do, unless you are prepared to risk losing your place. I just wanted to offer a bit of understanding as it really is rubbish when you know they are likely to come down with something else in a couple of weeks. If it's any consolation, after 4 years of always feeling like I was letting my employer down, my DS1 went through the first 5 years of school without being ill once!

Your child most likely caught it from another child whose parents thought it was fine to bring their child to nursery with conjunctivitis.

It sounds like CM should make a list of illnesses that mean child stays home.

Did you tell CM child have conjunctivitis when you took her in?

I think if a childminder makes excuses not to have children for this that or the other they are just simply unreliable and no use to a working parent. This should have been clearly stated by the childminder in her conditions. If it wasn't then she was completely in the wrong. Don't stand for it OP. There's enough stress in life without dealing with an awkward childminder.

Causes - Conjunctivitis is a condition that occurs when the conjunctiva (a thin layer of cells covering the front of your eyes) becomes inflamed.The three most common causes of this inflammation are: infection (infective conjunctivitis)an allergic reaction (allergic conjunctivitis)something irritating the conjunctiva, such as a loose eyelash (irritant conjunctivitis).

This is from the NHS website OP. You owe your childminder an apology. Conjunctivitis doesn't have to be caught. Anything could have caused it.

I used to be a CM and I would send a young child home with conjunctivitis as they are incapable of not touching their eyes and washing hands thoroughly meaning it would very easily spread. It isn't fair on the other children.

Not only but I caught conjunctivitis from a child I didn't know who had it at the time. I has to dispose of all the eye make up I used as the infection can live in there.

Based on your argument Pengggwn, my DD is 100% certain to have picked up the infection at the CM as I can say with certainty that she has not encountered any infected people whilst with me. The CM cares for many children and routinely takes them out into other public places. She cannot say with certainty that no infectious people were encountered.

As many pp have pointed out, there are other ways she could have become infected with conjunctivitis (allergies, irritants). And these apply to both environments.

Thank you nosquirrels

I wasn't planning on saying that, it was more just in recognition of the various pp who have said that conjunctivitis wouldn't be excludable at their setting. Obviously there are many ailments that everyone excludes for and others where there is discretion involved. If our CM is a particularly strict one, I might have to reconsider our arrangements.

1) Do you like your childminder?

We're very happy with the care our DD receives. She's very flexible with days and times and that is valuable to me. I have no personal feelings towards her, we have a business relationship.

2) Do you trust and respect your childminder?

Yes. Would I leave my DD there if I didn't trust her? If you mean do I believe she lied about no other infected mindees then no, that's not what I mean.

3) How do you feel about other parents making decisions about what constitutes a minor illness and it being different to what your opinion of what one is?

My decision was based on NHS guidelines. As a result of the situation today, I now understand that the CM policy may not always match this. This was the first time I've been faced with such a situation so it was a learning experience for me. I don't believe it should be down to parents to decide what constitutes a 'mild illness'. I do believe the written policy should be clarified to avoid the need for this.

Did you tell CM child have conjunctivitis when you took her in?

It wasn't me who dropped her off and it wasn't the CM herself who took her in. But yes, my partner mentioned that she had been under the weather over the weekend.

Thank you for the compassion, Elmersnewfriend.

I think I'm going to leave my contributions to this thread here. Thanks for all the constructive comments.

There's no way of knowing where the infection came from so why do you want your childminder to say your DD caught it there when that simply may not be correct. It's like you are trying to force a confession from her for some reason.
Conjunctivius is very contagious and every childcare setting I know would ask for a child with the condition to not attend. Perfectly standard and reasonable practise. If a child has a contagious condition that they are likely to pass on to others they should stay away to avoid passing it on.
If you work in a school I would have thought you would already know that.

I thank my lucky stars I don’t have any parents like you!! Incidentally I would accept you child with conjunctivitis but the way you talk and and feel about your CM is horrible.

You know they can get conjunctivitis in a variety of ways they don't have to catch it from someone else as such? When my DD was teething and snotty she'd wipe the snot up her face and infect herself - bingo - conjunctivitis!

C'mon people - read the thread. The op has already said that she's not going to mention it.

Op it is difficult with a cm if they haven't got clear policies about what they do and don't exclude for. Worth seeking clarification for anything else that might be different to NHS.

The op has already said that she's not going to mention it.

Yeah because she realises she was wrong, she owes the CM an apology.

Reading more of the thread and the NHS guidance etc I suspect childminder just doesn't want to deal with it. To be honest I can understand that it's not pleasant and a bitch to get the drops in. However it would set alarms ringing with me as to what she may be like with other issues if she's so funny on this one. I'd look at a nursery - they will have strict exclusion policies for D&V etc but far more accommodating in administering prescribed meds.

@Jakeyboy1 - Most CMs I know exclude for conjunctivitis as like I said before it's difficult to manage with toddlers and spreads very easily. That's why. Most nurseries exclude for conjunctivitis too.

"Most nurseries exclude for comjunctivities too" not in my experience or several other posters on here

The policies of other childcare providers is irrelevant here. OPs CM does have this policy, and OP clearly isn’t happy. Therefore she needs to find another childcare provider.

OP - we’ll done for taking the comments on board about your two original questions

It depends on the age of the children. IME (Ex CM and worked in several nurseries for 8 years). Children in the baby and toddler rooms would be excluded.

@Itsfinderskeepers that's interesting. Local nurseries to me don't exclude and would administer drops/ointment with signed consent.

So would a lot of cms littleducks. It’s not a blanket policy on the type of childcare which is why I stand by my point that the parent should have said ‘X has conjunctivitis, is she ok to come?’ Instead if slipping her through the door with a vague ‘she’s been under the weather this weekend’.