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AIBU?

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Original poster

To be angry at photos at Nativity?

758 replies

MrsAnamCara · 14/12/2017 15:45

Just seen DC infant nativity. We were sent out letters, went to the office yo get tickets, had texts to remind people-all fine and well. No mention of needing permission to take photos/videos. Nothing mentioned before the start of the actual nativity performance either. The performance starts and several people whip their phones out and begin taking photos and videos but not of individual children, of all of the children on stage. It goes on throughout the performance and I can see in their view finder they are filming/recording video of 5+ children... A parent the right if the school Hall is stood filming the entire performance.

No one said they weren't allowed to but...neither was the guardian or parent of every single child asked either.

In my D's nursery, they asked for written permission, and if only one parent didn't give permission then no one was allowed to take photos or videos. Even if we were allowed, then it was photos and videos of your child only (zoom in) and if there were other children then you couldn't post it on social media and send to anyone else.

It really ruined the performance for me, as I don't know these people who are taking videos/photos of my child, I don't know where they will post them or send them to, I don't know who will see that photo or video. I did not give anyone permission to take his photo or record him?

I'm I being unreasonable to think the school should have asked for legal written permission for all children's parents or guardian's? And if some parents don't agree or give permission then that's too bad.

OP posts:
Chocolate254 · 17/12/2017 09:17

You have also made a very valid point stourton, Sounds like your school works around the issue very well.

Blink66 · 17/12/2017 09:33

A very good compromise stourton.

Ketzele · 17/12/2017 09:36

Stourton, I think it's very unfair to suggest posters with threatened children are being selfish. We are talking about general policies here, which will work most of the time. In the situation you describe - which is much more unusual - I would of course expect the school to respond to the needs of those individual children. My argument has been that the needs of vulnerable children come before the wish of the average parent to get a photo - but of course a child with a terminally ill parent is also vulnerable, and their needs should be prioritised. Why on earth would anyone here say anything different?

Blink66 · 17/12/2017 09:40

OlennasWimple

No, people may not join the photo performance for a number of reasons - including just not wanting their children in photos as outlined here. Seriously if all of KS1 does a nativity together I doubt most parents even notice a few more not in each performance due to other commitments.

I don't recognise the merit or talent aspect in assignment of roles in the first place. However, if safeguarding is an issue for the individual then that is probably the appropriate choice. However, if the school wanted to work around it - it's certainly not impossible to have two children take turns - and maybe that should be the case so that more get to do so.

Blink66 · 17/12/2017 09:43

Ketzele

The policy outlined seems to work all the time, and there is no reason for people to explain their circumstances. I don't think she said anything about being selfish - but given the above looks to work for everyone, maybe they are.

JacquesHammer · 17/12/2017 09:44

Seriously if all of KS1 does a nativity together I doubt most parents even notice a few more not in each performance due to other commitments

If all KS1 did a performance at DD's school there'd be 50 kids. It would be very obvious, especially to the others in the class when there's 12-15 in a class

user1478939671 · 17/12/2017 09:49

YANBU but do something about it for the next time if it bothers you so much. It was probably just an oversight. These things happen.

Blink66 · 17/12/2017 09:53

Well, same as ours then and we don't- it's a sea of children. Nor do we know why the kids have not been involved in one of the productions - generally parents couldn't manage to bring them at that time is my assumption.

Anyway - some good other working solutions out there.

JacquesHammer · 17/12/2017 10:05

generally parents couldn't manage to bring them at that time is my assumption

For school? Our performances for KS1 are class performances. One per year group (a single class) and then a larger production for juniors. All take place in school time.

Anyway as you said all good solutions. Parents all happy with ours - in fact it's part of the contract you sign when your child joins so no excuse. If you didn't agree with that, you could choose another school. It's all about managing expectations

goodtoknowthisyear · 17/12/2017 11:15

I think that some of the posters on this thread, in particular some of the adopters, would get their point over better if they were not so incredibly rude (twelve twats of christmas, for example). People post on threads without RTFT all the time without being called a twat. It is difficult to hear different points of view and any kind of discussion if things are made so personal.

Not the point of the thread and not intending to minimise real threats to any child (adopted or not), but according to people in this line of work it is rare for adopted children to be at serious risk from birth parents. Many children are adopted because the level of care cannot be achieved for various reasons, rather than because of or being subject to the sort of risks being referred to in this thread. I am writing this so that an impression is not formed that risk will apply to most adopted children.

Maireadplastic · 17/12/2017 11:36

The needs of at risk or sick children can definitely come before mine. No contest.

Lizzie48 · 17/12/2017 11:38

Goodtoknowthisyear, it's not necessarily about adopted children being in physical danger. That isn't really what I would worry about, though there were DV concerns. The issue with the birth parents knowing where we live is that we don't want our DDs to have contact with them while they're too young to cope with it. It also needs to be carefully managed, not to just suddenly happen.

cantkeepawayforever · 17/12/2017 12:25

Goodtoknow,

IME - and as I say, it is more normal than not, IME, to have at least 1 highly vulnerable child in every school - the main children at risk (in terms of numbers) are those who are with 1 parent, fleeing / hiding from / at risk from the other (or members of the other's family).

Those who have posted on this thread describing their own situation are often from this group too - those for whom the other parent poses the risk.

Adoption is not necessarily a risk factor. It can be, but there isn't a 1:1 correspondence between adoption and risk.

Fostering may be more of one - compulsory placement in foster care is often 'closer in time to the original discovery of harm' than eventual placement for adoption, so emotions can often be running higher.

Obviously my experiences are not statistically significant, so are 'anecdata'.

KimonoDragon · 17/12/2017 15:00

Absolutely not being unreasonable to feel upset. They must have consent to film or photograph the school children. Our school films then sells the dvds. I have a foster child who is not allowed to be shown on Facebook etc for own safety so I would be horrified to say the least!

MizGi · 17/12/2017 16:57

I get your concerns especially with regards to all the ills of the current digital age that we find ourselves in. However, is it really fair on the other parents who would like to have photos of their children at the nativity play for memento? Perhaps schools might want to consider having children whose parents do not consent to having their pictures taken perform separately/on their own and vice versa? Would be lovely isn't it?

JacquesHammer · 17/12/2017 17:39

Perhaps schools might want to consider having children whose parents do not consent to having their pictures taken perform separately/on their own and vice versa? Would be lovely isn't it?

Wow. Just wow.

Would you like to stick a big "I'm different" badge on them too?

TittyGolightly · 17/12/2017 18:38

Our school would ditch the shows rather than have parents act so shittily.

PiffleandWiffle · 17/12/2017 19:57

Would you like to stick a big "I'm different" badge on them too?

A hood would probably solve more.... Grin

caperberries · 17/12/2017 20:35

Is this why a lot of schools no longer do class photos?

It seems impossible to find a solution that is fair to everyone

caperberries · 17/12/2017 20:37

By the way, it isn't just the Daily Mail that lifts threads from Mumsnet - this one has made it into The Sun

www.thesun.co.uk/fabulous/5153452/mum-sparks-fierce-debate-over-parents-taking-photos-at-her-childs-nativity-so-whos-in-the-wrong/

PunkrockerGirl59 · 17/12/2017 21:53

I think throughout the year I'm lulled into a false sense of security on MN. In that most not all posters seem like nice, genuine, empathetic people. Until we get to December and the nativity photo/filming threads start. Queue all the screeching from those who are totally clueless about how life is for an at risk family. It's like it'ss obviously my right to film and completely block everyone else's view because #making memories#feeling blessed is so much more important than my responsibility to safeguard every single child.
Complete gobshites who should be ashamed, but won't be because they have absolutely no concept outside their happy family lives of what it's like to have an at risk child or to be an abused partner who doesn't wish to be identified. . The worst and saddest part of is is that they don't actually care Angry

AuldAlliance · 18/12/2017 07:54

This is one of the saddest threads I've ever read on here.

If we needed any proof that social media don't make us more open-minded by allowing us glimpses into the lives of others, this is it. It's just an echo chamber for people to shout loudly, ignoring evidence that might call their convictions into question.

If we needed any proof that technology is turning us into more inward-looking, egotistical individuals, this is it.

The idea that anyone might be oppressed because - in order to protect young children from potential danger - they can't take photos of videos of their kids in a school performance is a pretty clear sign many people take their basic human rights for granted.

CocaColaTruck · 18/12/2017 08:29

Most schools I've taught in (and many from long before facebook etc) don't allow any photography during the performance because it's a distraction for the children and gets in the way of the enjoyment of other members of the audience.

They all allowed for photographs to be taken after the performance, easy enough to remove a child who shouldn't be photographed before that happened.

skincarejunkie · 18/12/2017 08:59

Our school does pre printed colour photo programmes, in costume, with all the children who are able to be photographed on. The carers or parents are asked each time if they are ok with it. No photography needed during the show then. A chance to live in the moment and enjoy watching it. It's rare these days and wholly enjoyable!

whiskyowl · 18/12/2017 10:13

This thread is unbelievable, dismaying and upsetting. I literally am struggling to comprehend the utter selfishness of so many people who put their desire for a photograph over the safety and wellbeing of someone else's child.

Memories are not enshrined in a picture. Memories are in your head. You don't forget a magical moment just because you don't have a picture of it. Photographs are really a lot less necessary than social media makes them seem.

There needs to be a new word for this level of entitlement and self-obsession - the phrase "first world problems" doesn't cover it.