Mothers with enormous toddlers in slings...

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AIBU to wonder how the feck they manage?

My neighbour has just walked past my window with her son dangling in front of her like a bloody giant in a harness!

He's almost 4! No SEN and very sturdy/capable.

We live in a tiny town/village and she can drive etc....she's probably just going to the shop down the road.

Why??

their back problems have only started since they’ve been ‘wearing’ their kids. ah, so we'll ignore that it would have started roughly with childbirth and not mentioning lifting and turning in and out of high chairs or cots or carseats. It's definitely the 'wearing' of the kids that have done it.

Gotta love a Bjorn

No kicks at all from my 9lb+ newborns in my c-section scars because their little feet were up around my waist in a comfy, comfy wrap. My main issue now (on the RARE OCCASION DS2 is carried) is having my hair completely re-styled. Mini-Vidal has worked out how to undo my hair clip

Strength training for back issues is not the same thing as carrying a child on your back for a few miles on a regular basis.

Even with a well designed sling or backpack, you are carrying around a weight that will put pressure on your back and core, and your posture will not be the same as your posture while not carrying. Weight classes and weight exercises are completely different as they give attention to a variety of muscles and if designed right they should not stress discs or the spine, or cause the lengthy changes to your posture that extended child carrying does.

Good exercises for back issues if you already have them - partial crunches, hamstring stretches, wall sits, press up back extensions, bird dog position, knee to chest leg bends while on your back, pelvic tilt, bridging, swimming, pilates. Depends on the problem though.

I'm totes on for trying this with my four year old tomorrow - pic to follow!

this place needs 'like' buttons

Pregnancy and birth are pretty risky to this area. a well structured padded toddler back sling is netter than having to carry a 4 year old on occasion.
It is true that your pelvic floor and lower back can be adversely affected by pregnancy and childbirth. However, there is no need to exacerbate any damage there by continuing to carry heavy children around.

As Apple said upthread, the more you accommodate carrying , the more your child may appeal to be carried.

Everyone carries a child occasionally - they fall, they get genuinely tired, you decide it would be fun to give a piggyback, etc. But people who have planned for it by buying equipment have incorporated the habit into their lives and are talking about the positive mother-child relationship aspects of it.

I do not think we are talking about the occasional carry here. We are seeing people committed to it as a lifestyle (this term has been used on the thread), who have slings and backpacks designed to be used by older children.

DrRanjs
Bet you'd have seen more of it in a less affluent area though and less shiny silvercross.

Absolutely the opposite is true - it has been my observation that the less affluent the area the fancier the prams and buggies you are more likely to see. It is a signifier of status.

I would be willing to bet a lot of money that nobody used slings in Dublin in the 60s/70s.

If you increased your weight to 66kg you would put pressure on your joints - ankles and knees mainly - depending on how fast you put on the weight, and also on your overall level of activity.
If I weighed 66kg, a not unreasonable weight, would put me at a size 12, and carried that 66kg wherever I moved, is that also a terrible risk to my pelvic floor?
It would not necessarily put pressure on your pelvic floor, as long as the extra kgs would be distributed around your body - some to the hips, thighs, buttocks, upper arms, boobs and midriff and places you might not suspect, like your calves or even your feet. If you concentrated the extra weight around your middle (beer gut style or bigger gut + backfat) then you would very likely be looking at issues with your lower back and also your pelvic floor. Carrying heavier older children around is like adding weight to the midsection.

Am I the only one who had 4 year olds that would have looked at me like if I’d suggested putting them in a sling?! And then would have run off up the street shrieking, “Hurry up Mummy! I’m hungry!”

The final Royal Marines commando test, done at the end of their training- is a 30 mile march with backpacks containing around 40lbs of weight. They know a thing or 2 about fitness and do not get overly concerned by the risk of back pain? www.royalnavy.mod.uk/news-and-latest-activity/news/2013/december/12/131212-rm-commando-tests

I didn't buy anything, I made slings to be used with a baby... that happened to still be good when he was older. No special toddler purchase.

As to carrying more because he could be... no, not really. He walked just fine, he just got tired on very long days when out somewhere like Disneyland. Ever tried pushing a buggy through Disney? It is a pain, especially if you are keeping up with an excited six year old.

Both my kids are grown or close to. They both did plenty of sport and are (mostly) happy to hike when we go out. The whole sling thing when younger has no relevance now. Just like having a bottle a little while longer has no relevance to a 20 something year old's life now.

As for pressure on lower back/pelvic floor etc. It was moving heavy furniture in a hurry that caused my problems while hoovering. Maybe people should stop hoovering, it is obviously risky for backs.

Am I the only one who had 4 year olds that would have looked at me like hmm if I’d suggested putting them in a sling?! And then would have run off up the street shrieking, “Hurry up Mummy! I’m hungry!”

Clearly not, because you're not the only one who hadn't used a sling since they were babies. Of course it wouldn't occur to the child if it's not something they're used to. Just like you'd get weird looks if you suddenly suggested to a 2 yr old that they have a breastfeed if they stopped at 6 months, but a 2 yr old who's been breastfed all along will love the idea.

But be honest, there was no time when they wailed "I'm too tired I can't walk any more," and ended up getting a piggy back? or a ride on a buggy board or sending a parent ahead to bring the car nearer? or you took the car to pick them up from school when you'd usually walk because it's December and near the end of term and everyone's knackered? 4 is still very little. Most people talk about their 4 yr olds being "exhausted" after just a day of school, never mind something more exciting. (Not mine - apparently didn't get the memo that she's supposed to be clingy and lazy from getting the occasional sling ride as a preschooler.)

Now it may be not, it may be you have the miracle child who will happily run around all day and still hike 4 miles home. Or that for whatever reason your habits don't involve days out that keep going till the biggest child drops. But these things are totally normal and I seriously doubt would attract the amount of judgement the odd sling ride seems to be.

www.forces.net/news/navy/how-become-first-female-royal-marines-commando
Initially, there will be no limit on the height and weight for women (men have to be a minimum of 65kg). It takes 32 weeks to transform civilians into Royal Marines Commandos (64 weeks for officers). The training culminates in four Commando tests, all completed carrying at least 21lb of kit and a rifle.

There's a nine-mile speed march in 90 minutes, a Tarzan assault course, a six-mile endurance course and finally, the famed 30-miler across Dartmoor, carrying around 40lbs in under eight hours (for recruits) and under seven (for officers). It’s no laughing matter – just last year it claimed the life of a Royal Marine trainee.

The time, distance and weight criteria will be exactly the same for women in all four tests...

...What happens to female recruits who get pregnant during training?

A. They will be removed from training for the wellbeing and safety of the child and put into another role at the CTCRM (Commando Training Centre Royal Marines).

Carrying the 40lb pack across Dartmoor is part of a super-fit lifestyle and the culmination of a few months of a training regimen designed to ensure recruits are up to the task. Even still, someone died trying it (the report on the death claims he was carrying around 15kg/32lbs of equipment).

Just for a little perspective - 21 lbs is about the 90th percentile in weight for a baby of about 8-9 months. It is considered a big deal for a very fit man with no prior experience of pregnancy or childbirth to complicate his pelvic floor.

A four year old! Heck can hardly lift some of them let alone trudge about with one in a sling. That woman must have shoulder muscles like Hercules.

Catkind - is it fair to a four year old to plan a day's activity that will exhaust him or her?

I think it's good for the biggest or oldest child to realise that not all plans will be tailored to their requirements, and to participate in activities that have a pace or duration that the younger ones can handle.

Doesn't matter whether it looks silly. In most parts of the world its totally the norm. I've lived all over Asia and you always see children being worn, hardly any prams, and the children cry and kick off a lot less because they feel calm and secure close to their mother. You really notice the difference when you return to a western country and see so many children screaming for hours in prams/push chairs or having tantrums in supermarkets because they're tired and fed up. I do wonder how they manage myself - especially when there's 70 year old grannies carrying large toddlers for long walks! But in my personal experience and from what I have witnessed its good for both mother and child.

If you are pregnant or have pelvic floor issues I’m pretty sure you can make your own judgement on your ability to carry heavy weight around

....And sometimes that might mean not doing it - common sense surely?

Strength training for back issues is not the same thing as carrying a child on your back for a few miles on a regular basis.

Yes, all those army folk and long-distance hikers carrying around rucksacks for miles aren’t building up muscle strength at all!

You think it’s weird to have kids in slings because you’re not used to seeing it. That’s only human, but it does not make the idea in itself a weird or unhealthy thing. Modern children getting low levels of physical activity below what they need (and they do!) isn’t because they’re mostly in slings, it’s because they’re mostly in cars. Which is no less of a lifestyle choice than using a sling, and a much more physically unhealthy one to boot, but we don’t see it that way because it’s standard and normal and expected.

Most of the people I know (us included) who used slings as transport after babyhood did it because we didn’t have cars, so it was more practical than being limited to a young child’s speed and distance all the time. Even now my 3-year-old is in a back carry sometimes for things like hillwalking when she gets tired before we do. I don’t see any kids her age getting carried everywhere; I do see a lot getting driven everywhere, including her school nursery classmates who live closer than we do and go home in a car every day.

Okay I'll bite.

Admittedly my 4yo is tiny (I've seen people talk about 1yos who weigh more than her) and we've only used it a handful of times since she turned 3, but it's a lifesaver. Last time was when we had to get across London in a really short amount of time at rush hour. Chucked her in the sling to get across busy concourses and through busy tube stations safely. If she'd not been in the sling I'd have had to carry her and that feels much more unsafe to me. I've carried her from birth in appropriate slings and it's never been an issue.

MathAnxiety

Please, please actually read my, DrRanj's, curry's et al posts about how and when we carry our children. PLEASE. I say, once more with feeling, IT IS NOT CONTINUOUS, it is occasional, and it is almost always to promote physical activity for the whole family, or to manage a child where there is no alternative.

I also refer you back to the part where I said I'm an occupational therapist working with patients post-spinal surgery (i.e. slipped discs, stenosis from wear and tear etc). Given my full-time profession, do you not think I'm pretty aware of what is and is not risky to the health of my back?

the famed 30-miler across Dartmoor, carrying around 40lbs in under eight hours (for recruits) and under seven (for officers).
The endurance here is not just the weight, or the distance, or the time but all 3 in combination. I've carried DS on my back for an hour or so, I've walked in the countryside for 8 hours (covering about 11 miles and including a leisurely lunch, think The Ramblers assume 2.5 miles in an hour). To do both over a much greater distance is much more challenging, 30 miles in 7 hours is over 4 miles an hour which is fast walking. To build in eating time you're probably going to have to jog for all of it. It's really not the same as slinging a 3 year old for the school run or a potter around town or an English Heritage property .

MathAnxiety

It's considered a big deal for them to carry 40lb for 30 Miles in 8 hours. Not for half an hour or so at a leisurely pace which what I assume most people are doing.

Respect to anyone who’s doing a 30-mile school run in 8 hours with a 40lb toddler, though!

I totally agree with mathanxiety that it’s when it becomes a lifestyle choice and ulitimately habbit for both parties that I find it a bit unhealthy. If that’s the way you choose to carry for short periods of time up to the age of about 3.5 I don’t see an issue. If we go on a really long walk with a 2 yo of course we take a carry pack so it would be no different to that. But I’ve seen pregnant women turn up to a designated toddler walk with one kid on the front and a nearly 4 yo strapped to the back! Of course she screwed her back and I just don’t see any necessity for it at that time. I view unnecessary slinging in the same kind of category as people who try to control their toddler with snacks. My other major niggle on group walks.

Sounds lovely and cosy
Mind your own feckin business