To think gender alters the perception of what is said on MN?

[1DAD2KIDS]

I use a username that clearly identifies my gender (and is also my biological sex). Often I feel that if people assumed I was a woman their response would be different. Or if you swapped the genders around some people's responses would be completely different?

Okay 1DAD2KIDS what is this ground breaking male perspective that you feel this site is missing - what areas, topics, threads on this forum need this perspective and, in your opinion, are lacking in it, please give some examples.

Also can you give examples of where your input/advice has been dismissed or treated differently by virtue of your username/perceived sex.

RedDogsBeg nothing ground breaking. Does it have to be? Surely many conversations value from many different perspectives. And as I have said before often sex is not of significance. Why did you thing my aim is to be ground breaking?

I may also add Lweji that the explanation to your question was cut and pasted from the very same post that you took this quote:

Lweji We have something a bit more to add than childish Male impotence digs that really say a lot more about you and what I'm talking about than me (plus water off a ducks backs)?

Really cant see how you missed it?

1DAD2KIDS Tue 28-Nov-17 00:10:56
"RedDogsBeg nothing ground breaking. Does it have to be? Surely many conversations value from many different perspectives. And as I have said before often sex is not of significance."

If sex is not of significance, why do you deliberately put DAD in capitals in your username and why do present pretty well every post you make as coming From A Male Perspective, rather than simply being the perspective of one among the many thousands who post on Mumsnet? Wouldn't that be enough?

RedDogsBeg if you need expample just read the thread. Its late and I'm not a bloody tape player on repeat. The thread is full of examples of bias and general consensus of its existantce. I think it's existantce is genrally excepted. What now seem the issuse is diversions and/or whether that bias is right. If you still despute it's existantce fine. Well can agrue the toss another time.

corythatwas yet again read the thread if you wish. I have answered that question too.

I used groundbreaking as you clearly think it is important to put across your particularly male perspective.

Could you answer the rest of my post please.

No need to get snippy, it is clearly something you feel is particularly directed at you and that you have personally experienced, therefore it is not unreasonable to ask for specific examples.

A site set up for motorbike users, heavily populated bymotorbike users to discuss motorbike issues would have a motorbike bias

. If I joined in discussions about particular motorbike issues and announced I’m a car driver and want to give the perspective of car driver, you’d get similar responses.

Same if you joined Dog owner sites and posted on threads about dog issues with the perspective of a cat owner and complained about dog bias.

I care very much about males, I care about male rape, I care about male victims of domestic violence, I know that women hurt men too,but the only time I’ve ever seen these mentioned on MN and on many other parts of the internet is when women are trying to talk about male violence etc.

If a man started a thread asking for help/support or discussing ways to raise money for males fleeing domestic violence, or male suicide they’d get very different responses. I’ve seen these male issues thrown into women’s conversations as a way to either shut them up talking about male violence, or in a telling them they should be helping males instead of women. A lot.

Genuine question as I’ve never looked, but are there women on Dadsnet (or other heavily male sites) creating similar threads to this and pointing out the male bias, or joining discussions between males abiut male rape to give the female perspective and experience?

My 12 year old dd tried to creat a rugby team for girls, a few boys said it wasn’t fair, she asked them they didn’t point the unfairness out when girls were turned away from the boys team. In a similar way, do you use any other forums discussions and do you point out biases there too?

Hope im not sounding goody, am just typing quickly as I’m off to bed.

But is disingenuous to suggest that a male voice doesn't add to some conversations a different piece of the jigsaw that is important. Like when you posted about times you have been made to feel uncomfortable by women on a thread (aimed at women in it's title), where women shared their stories of sexual harassment, assault, rape and abuse at the hands of men?

The world is still so divided on grounds of sex. But to be fair your question is a bit of distraction from the question of sexual bias. Its more about the presence of bias and hierocracy in relation to sex than a question of when and when not a male perspective is of significance. You are making a very big thing of it but all I was simply adding to the conversation was the there is sometime significance to male voices in some conversations. That’ll all.

And I have explained the bias to you, I have answered your question. You can’t answer mine. You can’t name a single time a ‘Male perspective’ is so vital (when it hasn’t been explicitly asked for) which makes me think you know that you’re wrong. It’s only important to you that people on here know you’re male.

Please keep in mind that this is your thread - what is it you want from it? It’s not a conversation about bias because you’re refusing to accept the reasons for it, you’re just complaining that it exists at all.

Apologies that I missed your reply to my question.

You said that MN would benefit from having more male voices.
There are already a few around and nobody prevents men from being here. So, it's not a MN issue, but an issue with men who stay away from the site, really.

As another pp mentioned, there are very few items where men can give unique perspectives. And you're being biased if you think a male voice is needed on a cheating thread, for example. What does a man have to say that it's inherently different from a woman? Cheaters are condemned here. If a cheater posts he or she gets a right bollocking.
Of course, as women, we don't know what it's like to live with a penis and loads of testosterone. We also haven't experienced male privilege or the pressures of having to act like a man.
But do you think you're experience of being cheated on is very different from a woman's?

Or do you think you can come and explain to women why men can't use the washing machine?
Or why men can't spend so much time with their children?

Do explain how so much enriching are specifically male points of view that are not covered by the range of men and women already on MN.

Also, apologies, it should be "your experince" not "you're experience".

Oh, I give up, just embrace typos.

YANBU.

1DAD, when I see you post I immediately tense up and brace myself for the usual suspects to annihilate you or kick off or start sneering at your comments, regardless of what you've said.

It would be easy to agree that gender alters the responses, but often the OP sets the tone. I would suggest that the biggest differences in responses can be seen in sex related threads.

If the OP is male then they will often focus on the sex aspect it's self ie we aren't having sex, why? Leading to responses like "you aren't entitled to sex" etc

When the OP is female she will mention lack of sex but throw in how that measures her feel lonely, or unloved. Other women will respond better to that than the male focus on the physical.

Gender doesn't exist, it's a social construct.

Biological sex exists, gender is not a real thing.

You only need to go on lack of sex threads to see there are all kinds of responses regarding causes and how to address them. The proportion might be slightly different, but the contents aren't.

Sadly, male and female experiences can be different, particularly after having children. I have yet to see a man complaining about how tired he is because his partner takes off on nights off leaving him to hold and breastfeed the baby, then ask for sex when they return.

Women tend to ask about lack of sex after a few years, men after a few months. That's partly why they get different answers.

Men tend to ask: why am I not getting enough sex?
Women tend to ask: why doesn't he want to have sex with me?

So, if there is a bias, it's from the OP's on those threads to start with.

And the the answers are for the most part: talk to each other, if you're not happy you can leave.

People don't have different responses to you because if your gender. No one can see how feminine or masculine you are. Responses may be affected by your sex though

But is disingenuous to suggest that a male voice doesn't add to some conversations a different piece of the jigsaw that is important

Haha disingenuous to suggest that men's opinions aren't important?? It's such a relief for me to come into mumsnet because it is predominantly women and women's opinions. We are bombarded by men's opinions on every subject everywhere, all the time. I'm not interested

I was a accused of being a man on here - different user name but neutral. In fact I was accused of being a Granddad!! I can't even remember why but it was something to do with looking at the facts rather than join in the hysteria that was being whipped up over a thread.

Most women get plenty of 'male perspective', thanks. There's no shortage of it all around us. Perhaps that's partly why, on a female-dominated website, we quite like to talk about things from a largely female perspective.

Maybe have a little think about how a woman's perspective might be viewed by men on a male-dominated site...

Dad, as long as you aren't a Tory, you are fine with me!

I usually jump to the defence of men. I have a son who has been bullied by girls to the point of sexual assault. He is constantly belittled for being small, (small penis jokes are not funny), and I am trying to get psychological help for him. He is socially awkward in the way girls are often not and I fear for him.

However I wonder why you OP want to be on a women's site, not to learn, to increase your understanding, but to criticise? You are right there is sometimes a double standard - and sometimes it is justified when all the facts are taken into account, sometimes not. And if not there will always be a female poster who will moderate/ pull up others/ point out the double standard. You would be hard pressed to find that on a male site.

GetMeOut makes a good point about the specific nature of this site
Lweji has also raised sensible issues - yet you seem not to want to hear them.

Just to say my point about the male perpective having value in some conversations was merely a nod to people who earlier pointed out that the opersite sex can offer a different perspective. It point is a bit of a red herring with regards the conversation. But some have chosen to make an absolute meal of the side point rather than the core of the conversation itself. Not too sure what more I can say on this point after this post.

RedDogsBeg sorry if I come across a bit snippy, it was late, I was tiered and lots of people keep asking the same questions 0028 I answered your question, well in a way. Examples from my self and others have been given. I can just keep writing the same stuff. If you are not happy that this bias exists that's your choice.

GetMeOutOfHere Please fully get your point and as i have said before. However I don't agree as to my mind bias and hypocrarcy are important issuses which ever way you switch the sexes. Your argument is like saying if I'm a Rangers fan and I walk into a Celtic pub it's perfectly natural I get beaten, that's fine, couldn't expect any other and thus right. For me it's not the polarisation of the sex that's the issue, it's the bias it's self. But that just maybe a point we disagree on. Sorry to hear about your girl. Rugby is a great game that I enjoyed playing my self. Although I did once get totally bombarded on here just for exploring the idea of mixed sex teams (buts that's a different story).

StatelessPrincess well yes, MN has really opened my eyes to another half of the debate than is often missed in other circles. It has made me see thing's in other ways and also that there are some conversations where a male voice may not be appropriate. It has made me feel uncomfortable a few times as I have become more aware of aspects of being in female shoes. For me it's a vital sign of the importance of conversation and in many areas having a wide spectrum of perspectives.

Pumperthepumper please reffer to 0001. Asking the same questions again over and over don't change anytging, we are just running in circles. What I want from it is to open a conversation, where you find it a conversation you want to participate or not is solely up to the individual.

Lweji you can understand my suspion when you accuse me of not answering your question in a post containing a quote from the very post I answered in length? Anyway that's, that. Good questions, I think add insight to the fact that sometime a male voice is of significance (try telling pumper). I agree with some of the earlier post that the treatment is different. The way males and females are treated in many areas is completely different in society. We see things often through different lenses. Therefore that other perpective can be very much part of the bigger picture and help give insight for example of how oppression propagated through say the way men see the world. But anyway as mentioned at top this is actully a bit of a red herring to the debate. Oh and dont worry about typos, we are all pron, I am dyslexic and it's a pain, plus my phone don't help. May I ask you just be a bit lenient on mine too in the future.

GunnyHighway I agree that there is a diffence to the treatment of men but not on the nature of the content per se from me. I have seen simular conversations were the sexes have been reversed an often the man's denial of sex has been seen as somewhat abusive. Having said that some others have called it on these conversations and said what if the genders were reversed. As said before people do have different opinions and that is the reason different perspectives are valuable to a conversation.

001, not sure of the relevance to this debate? All I would say is gender is a real thing to the mental wellbeing and existantce of many people. There is something a bit worrying about dismissing a whole aspect of someone core belief and very selfimage like that IMO. But that is a whole different debate (unless you accidently posted on wrong page).