Independent Catalonia...

[littlebird7]

Are we cheering from the rooftops delighted that they finally got their independence? Or shocked and sad for our Spanish friends have such a huge split in their amazing country?

Or do we feel both emotions at once?

I am shocked and but knew it was coming, could see it was heading that way when 700 companies moved in one week....

Over to you

I think that the only way to avoid conflict in this situation is for Spain to allow a legal referendum and abide by the result
Let both sides have their say and hope the result is a clear majority. I suspect it would be to remain united.

I can't believe how heavy handed the Spanish government has been. When I saw that boat full of policeman ready to batter people into submission like they tried to do a few weeks ago. I hope the Catalan people do stand up to this awful Government and fight for their rights. II real trouble starts I blame the Government 100% for their handling of it. No compromise or discussion just force and sackings.

@dratsea haha yass

Babybarrister- sorry, I know very little about this subject - what's the difference between speaking Castilian and Catalan?

@babybarrister for a private job you’re not required to have Catalan, mainly English. For a public one you do. Same way you need Galician in Galicia , Basque in the Basque Country , Valencian in Valencia and so on.

A friend of mine applied for university lessons in Santiago in Spanish and they were provided in Galician ! Same thing happened o another friend in Valencia

I know people whose children have been told not to speak castillian - these things are happening!
Not saying you don't, but not something I've ever seen.

We all know that it is impossible to get most jobs in catalonia without speaking Catalan.
We don't all know this, I don't think this is true. I know a lot of people here that don't speak Catalan, they have various jobs in all levels.
Not looking to get in an argument btw, just your experience is obviously very different to mine.

Castellano just means Spanish, same as Castillian.

Catalan and Castellano are two different languages.

That's just not true.

isn't it more that if you're using a public service you should be able to access it in the language of the land (your language) so they need to offer both castilian and catalan for public facing roles? same in wales isn't it?

I don't really know enough about this. I'm going to read up.
My initial thought though, is that Spain have made an utter hash of this and the brutal way they sought to disrupt a vote they'd already declared had no sranding and would make no difference was awful.

Catalan is a separate language - not a dialect _- and very different to Castillian

It's not very different though. I have never been taught Catalan but as a castellano/Spanish speaker who knows a bit of French too, I can understand Catalan. There is a lot of crossover and a lot of things you can understand. Same as a Swedish speaker can understand people from Norway or Denmark as the lanugages are related. Basque is very, very different though and totally unrelated to any other language.

Hope the situation is more stable today.

Catalán and Spanish both come from latin therefore you can kind of guess what the other words mean , same way with Italians , I can understand them without having a clue of Italian.

I have been living in Barcelona since 2011 and what babybarrister says about the catalan language is COMPLETELY TRUE.

I speak French reasonably well whereas my Castillian Spanish can just about order a drink and tell me where the loo is... However when I visit BCN I find French and Catalan to have so many more interchangeable words that I can easily manage conversations. Catalan is definitely a different language not a dialect of either.

@toomuchtimereadingthreads2016 I have sent a big chunk of your long post to my slightly younger daughter (just started Uni) who has been asking why I am so worried and upset about the situation, as I think it expresses my concerns more fluently than I can manage.

It depends on the job. Speaking castellano only has been fine for members of my family living in Tarragona. If you know French and Castellano then you can understand Catalan. It’s a Romance language. Lots of words are different, eg to eat is comer in castellano and Mangar in Catalan, Manger in French. Grammar is quite different.

Very sad what’s going on. Each side saying democratic rights have been violated. Difficult to see how separatists can claim victory when so few of the silent unionist supporters did not vote. Just my view

Ive spent a lot of time in that part of the world teaching. Most of the people were proud to be Catalan and wanted independance .
There is a saying that the Spanish never give anything back though.

hardly a Latino living in catalonia was given the vote!

Source please. Also how did their treatment differ from that of other foreing communities settled in Catalonia?

proper referendum INCLUDING everyone living and registered in catalonia - probably a million Latinos....
A million? Link please

Foreigners usually can vote in local elections (think local councillors) but not regional (for example Welsh Assembly) or national. Certainly foreigners were not allowed to vote in the EU referendum (3 million EU citizens...).

You seem to be insinuating that the Catalan government broke some universal referendum rule and tried to prevent certain groups from voting on the basis of ethnic origin or the idea that they might be more likely to be hostile to independence. I think you are wrong on all counts. Anybody would think you have an agenda.