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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

Surestart sexism

361 replies

LeCroissant · 18/10/2017 16:24

I just got this sent to me by email from Surestart (identifying details blocked out).

When I was at surestart with my kids, a few years ago now, most sessions were, of course, attended by women. Chairs were deliberately kept sparse in order to force mothers to stand up and play with their children. No hot drinks were allowed. No unhealthy food was allowed. At all times we were to demonstrate what good parents we were by never taking our eyes off the children, no matter how tired we were. I once had to go home from the local surestart centre because the two chairs that were available were taken I had nowhere to sit to feed my newborn.

And yet, for the men's session (run at the weekend of course, because we know that men work during the week and women don't) there's coffee, bacon sandwiches and fucking newspapers!!! AIBU to think this is fucking ridiculous?

Surestart sexism
OP posts:
humanGnomeProject · 18/10/2017 17:11

If more women attend then surely it's fair to encourage fathers.

Feminism won't have won until everything is 50:50. It's means equality for all, not simply women.

Why is any positive action for men berated? This seems to be working against toxic masculinity for the better of all.

The patriarchy can't win!

pisacake · 18/10/2017 17:12

"Well we can't expect men to just do boring women's work can we foxes, we have to make sure they're having fun too,"

If nobody turns up they don't get funding. What alternative would you suggest?

Original poster
LeCroissant · 18/10/2017 17:13

So, because women show up and do the work, they get nothing humanGnome? And men get incentives and treats? How is there any equality in that? Surely men should turn up and do their bit because they give a fuck about their kids, not because they're bribed with coffee and bacon?

OP posts:
Original poster
LeCroissant · 18/10/2017 17:14

I would suggest that they provide the same things for men and for women pisa, rather than actively preventing women from sitting fucking down while giving men coffee, bacon sandwiches and fucking newspapers!!!

OP posts:
Aeroflotgirl · 18/10/2017 17:16

Exactly LeCroissant, the men are still the fathers and have to take responsibility. If they have refreshments for the dads group, they have to have refreshments for the mainstream groups too, not to bribe dads to attend toddler sessions with their kids.

Aeroflotgirl · 18/10/2017 17:17

The parents who attend the sessions in the week, might well get fed up and not come then the Surestart will be worse off.

NeverEverAnythingEver · 18/10/2017 17:17

"Feminism won't have won until everything is 50:50. It's means equality for all, not simply women."

Hahaha. Here they are offering MORE stuff for the men! It's equality gone crazy! Oh hang on...

Original poster
LeCroissant · 18/10/2017 17:17

Surely any decent man would be mortified to know that bribes are put on to make him bring his children out to a group? Bribes that women never get?

OP posts:
NeverEverAnythingEver · 18/10/2017 17:20

Was it Gloria Steinem who said something like we thought that if we told people about the injustice they would be outraged?

They were not outraged about sexism, I fear ...

NotAgainYoda · 18/10/2017 17:21

I agree with you OP

Bacons sarnies for all or none

NotAgainYoda · 18/10/2017 17:23

I'd also like to know how they can be sure intellectual chat will be available. Is it because they are men?

humanGnomeProject · 18/10/2017 17:23

No. Where is the "nothing"?

This will benefit everyone. Do you not understand the modern idea of equality? (see image).

Do you not think that men should be encouraged to do these activities in the same way women should be encouraged to work?

What is your specific problem? That men are getting something women don't even though this is an area that men are hugely under-represented? I think you've misunderstood all the feminism is achieving for us.

Surestart sexism
Aeroflotgirl · 18/10/2017 17:24

Are they saying, mums are not capable of intellectual chat then Hmm.

Beammeup11 · 18/10/2017 17:24

Lecroissant, we must have attended the same centre! I also got that emails sent someone with initials D.M.
I agree with you about that centre, the couple of chairs that they had there clearly isn't enough. Especially when I struggled to walk to get baby weighed after a C-section!

Jessikita · 18/10/2017 17:24

Lecroissant cob is a LeicesterShire word too!

NeverEverAnythingEver · 18/10/2017 17:26

I didn't know I have to be encouraged to fucking work.

NotAgainYoda · 18/10/2017 17:27

Hang on a minute though. Are you sure it's men only at these weekend sessions?

Aeroflotgirl · 18/10/2017 17:27

Honestly op, I would complain, and ask that there is a similar group for Mums, Aunts, Grannies etc, I expect people won't come to the usual sessions, if they have wind that men are treated more favourably.

ArcheryAnnie · 18/10/2017 17:29

I would suggest that they provide the same things for men and for women pisa, rather than actively preventing women from sitting fucking down while giving men coffee, bacon sandwiches and fucking newspapers!!!

This!

Also totally agree that women should just turn up, announce they identify as men, grab the bacon rolls and the newspapers, and settle in.

demirose87 · 18/10/2017 17:29

It is a bit sexist. Parent and toddler groups aren't allowed to be called "mother and baby" groups anymore, because dads also attend, but now there are these groups exclusively for dads.

just5morepeas · 18/10/2017 17:30

That is so sexist! I can't believe that - I hope you'll reply with a complaint.

My sure start centre is as you described - I don't think there's necessarily anything wrong with that, but I did also enjoy the more traditional play groups where the parents get to sit and chat whilst the kids play. But if the "Dad" group isn't the same as the regular group that is bollocks!

It's the "intellectual chat" thing that's most bloody insulting I think. That and the fact that it's apparently okay to suggest that it's a normal thing that Dad's need to be persuaded to spend time with their kids!

Aeroflotgirl · 18/10/2017 17:30

I used to go to a fantastic Toddler group with my children before it closed Sad. It had been running in the community for 30 years, and it was so relaxed and nice. YOu would pay £1.50 per session, child would get a drink and a biscuit, and the parents would get a hot drink, biscuit or cake. Then the Surestart came along in the area, and it had to compete with that, and closed.

NotAgainYoda · 18/10/2017 17:31

I would have loved a bit of intellectual chat when mine were little

Or any chat that lasted more than the span of time between one toddler hitting another

I once got so addled that I pointed out an aeroplane to my husband when we were out shopping on our own

HerSymphonyAndSong · 18/10/2017 17:31

Perhaps Marcus de Sautoy and Waldemar Januszczak are attending

JustPoppingIn · 18/10/2017 17:33

Are you sure it is run by surestart? The logo on the advert seems to suggest a church led thing.