Surestart sexism

[LeCroissant]

I just got this sent to me by email from Surestart (identifying details blocked out).

When I was at surestart with my kids, a few years ago now, most sessions were, of course, attended by women. Chairs were deliberately kept sparse in order to force mothers to stand up and play with their children. No hot drinks were allowed. No unhealthy food was allowed. At all times we were to demonstrate what good parents we were by never taking our eyes off the children, no matter how tired we were. I once had to go home from the local surestart centre because the two chairs that were available were taken I had nowhere to sit to feed my newborn.

And yet, for the men's session (run at the weekend of course, because we know that men work during the week and women don't) there's coffee, bacon sandwiches and fucking newspapers!!! AIBU to think this is fucking ridiculous?

Weeellll

It wasnt my fault

I'll put a little trail of bacon down and hope he comes for it.

Is this the ‘intellectual chat’ us wimmin miss out on??

I think it might be cherry

He doesn't deserve the bacon multi

Im going to bed

If anyone gives him bacon then there will be trouble

But I want him to teach me things! So many things!

Multi maybe if we feed him enough bacon he will give us a treat by telling us what labour feels like?

So lovely to see that newdaddie is just as much of an arse elsewhere on MN as he is when he gets his arse handed to him on FWR.

What would be the collective noun for red flags do we think?

Perhaps we should be a bit kinder to new dad,

What he’s described in his most recent post about how his ‘workshop’ worked is not exactly far off the universal partnership plus parenting support groups and they do hold those at children’s centres and do require a referral

True Socks but a bit odd that he had his back turned to the centre of the room during the workshop

Dionne agree'd.

Morning.

Yes, please be kind, I demanded bacon earlier as my man right and was thoroughly ignored by dw.

I hear girl guides have made a resurgence Rufus so it could be a great place to start to hone her people management skills for the future. And I think she may need it given some of the less than stellar (understatement) examples of parenting I read about on MN. Present company excluded ofc.

Of course newdaddie

But leader of what? The country?

I am more worried that my dd will destroy the world to be honest

I worry about that too rufus. I do think it’s important to encourage that bit of inner toughness, confidence and autonomy but at the same time I hope she retains enough empathy to do good by others too.

We’re thinking a continent or two, any more than that could be problematic. Dd has nationality for 4 continents, 1 by birth and three by descendant so she’ll have a choice.

Dammit! Where do I sign up for my DC to be future leaders of indeterminate realms?

Newdaddie
If I had gone to a breastfeeding group and found a man there, back then I wouldn't have had the courage to speak up. Mostly because I was in the throes of PND and also because, like most women I have been in countless situations where men have encroached on my space or told me I'm wrong and shouted me down with an aggression that they don't even know they possess.

I would have possibly stuck out the session waiting to see if you would be challenged or most likely would have left early and never returned again.

With my 3 youngest DC, I needed significant help with BF - my not returning to a BF group (because you were there) would have meant my children either continuing to lose weight and my switching to formula.
Technically my DC were referred to the BF sessions however it is also recorded in my notes not just their notes - it certainly isn't in my DH's notes because he isn't capable of lactating. My DH is indeed their parent too and of course he supports me in BFing and getting help but he was able to understand what the councillor and I said outside what is considered a female space.
Your intrusion in that space is strange in the extreme and why you constantly battle against what women - who presumably have more experience of lactating and feeling the need for female spaces to be honoured as such - have to say, is worrying and problematic. Your poor DD.
You are extremely aggressive and dismissive of women, do you think this is appropriate? Are you aware that you probably do this in real life too? So many women on here are challenging the way you speak to us and yet you're so dismissive - it's pretty specialist. I can guarantee you scare women, you scare me.

Also
"there were no vulnerable women there."
Oh no, did I forget my "I've been raped" sandwich board and bell?

Why, quite frankly, does your right to be a father usurp my right to a safe women's space?

4.5 years! Wow that’s a mighty long time to take to learn to bf. Maybe if you spent less time jumping to conclusions and more time actually listening... not that you wanted my advice anyway but I really think you might need professional help at this stage.

Apologies to everyone who took the time to report this post this afternoon. I did not intend that as a derisory remark about mental health. I don’t do that. I assumed in the context and flow of this thread professional meant healthcare professionals specialising in infant nutrition. I ofc could have been clearer, but late on a Sunday night I lacked the necessary effort.

And tbf long comprehensive disclaimers do somewhat negate the impact of posts... but I digress.

@CherryChasingDotMuncher I thought it was a decent burn myself... but I’m not surprised that 4 year olds do better burns having reacquainted myself with that age group recently, they have the imagination and honesty of their precocious years in their favour, I can’t really be expected to compete with that it’s not fair.

newdaddie

I didnt think it had anything to do with mental health either

I just thought it was a fucking stupid comment, and cherry was right it wasnt a 'burn'

Was it deleted then...don't answer ill go and have a look

Briechon I’m sorry to hear about your PND and your experiences.

You ofc raise valid points, I agree with you on the points you raise. Wholeheartedly. I do think we’re posting at cross references though and suspect you haven’t rtft, I think our different experiences and needs as parents do not need to conflict.

I have read the entire thread, you are very dismissive.

Not my intention Brie

I was at my session based on our medical need. My local authority provides a safe space for women via its alternative women’s only bf sessions. That’s why I don’t think our experiences conflict.

The medical need of your baby and your wife are not your medical need. Do you say "we're pregnant"?

I don’t presume to judge the validity of your medical need so I’d appreciate the same courtesy.

Assuming you're not FtM you don't have any medical need for lactation specialists.

Yes, safe space for women, but it's ok for you to be there because you are a lovely middle class dad who is bringing up his daughter to be a leader. The women there should have just understood that you are a special case and not minded. After all your dp didn't mind, and she needed your 'support ' so fuck every other woman, including those who are shy, in pain or don't want to get their tits out in front of strange men for many other reasons.

Oh go away.

Years ago when I was breastfeeding I just would have left the group without saying a word to anyone.