To think this is DD hinting that she is a lesbian?

[chisteck]

Hello, just curious really, as that's what I'm thinking.

DD is a massive feminist. She will spend hours debating with people. She said tonight that it's a shame she is attracted to men as she's never going to be keen on the way heterosexual relationships work (that women need to be wined and dined and be looked after, etc.) and thinks this will be a problem for future relationships.

I don't know, it seemed very much like she was hinting. It doesn't matter. I'm just wondering if I should ask her.

I tell you a story OP
When I was about your dd age, I remember suddenly coming to the realisation that it was my mum that was doing everything. All the NOT so nice bits were all on her shoulders whilst my dad did what he wanted and picked and choose the bits he was seeing nice.
So let's say, they would do some painting together and he would do the wall at his height whilst my mum was doing all the awkward bits. Or dung th painting in the shade whilst my mum was doing the one in the sun (we werevoverseas, the sun was VERY hot).
I remember realising and being very very upset about it. I cried for a while on my own and then told my mum as she was worried about what was happening.
The result was me never talking about it, my mum crying (I didn't quite understand why at the time) and nothing changing.

I could have gone down the road your dd isntaking and fight tooth and nails against what are attitudes that are deeply misogynistic. The problem is that your DH doesn't see it, nor do you (see the comment about how women here should stop moaning because there are worse women than them)!Because they have gone on for so long that they look normal for you.

Eg your DH thinks she should be grateful that he has gone to work and provided for the family. Really? Isn't that NORMAL for a parent to do that?
He is asking what for dinner - she sees him EXPECTING you to cook. Why should he?

Tbh I'm not surprised about her reaction. She totally and completely rebelling against the whole set up of your family. And on the top of it, you are BOTH telling her it's normal and she should suck it up...

That is unpleasant in the extreme. If he doesn't believe it, and he knows it upsets your daughter, why on earth does he keep saying it? Is he deliberately trying to break down their relationship? Do you want her to come back and visit you when she leaves home?

His cakes are crap.

My dad makes similar jokes about me working part time and doing nothing all day etc...
I always feel awful. Because the reason why I'm not working full time is because I'm ill. it reinforces and feeds every single worried and uncertainty I can have.
He is also very good at making comments like your DH does as a way to wind me up. The result is that it's making me even more likely to defend my fenminist principles and tell him to straight 'why are you asking mum and not doing ing it yourself?'

Your DH is doing the same. With similar result. He is basically feeding the rebellion against something she sees as inherently unfair.
If I was him, I would stop.

I'm sure there are many men who are happy to split the bill and believe in equality but perhaps need to "conform" to your local norms. She just needs to weed out the crap ones.

Can I have some of your valium please, OP?

Have you never had the experience of having to spend time with someone that makes jokes you don't like? About the British? About the Royal Family (if you are a supporter)? About blondes (if you're blonde)? They don't really mean it, it's all just banter. But you really would not like to spend a day in their company, let alone a whole lifetime like your daughter, as their constant undermining "jokey" criticism of your beliefs or of you gets on your nerves?

he actually says that women are moaning in this country when they shouldn't be and we should actually be supporting the women in different religions and races across the world who do actually have something to moan about and I absolutely agree with him.

Oh fuck me!!! Where to even start with this. Im not even going to try. Yeah your dd is rude when she talks to her father but she is angry and you are both so dismissive about how she feels and how they are completely relevant especially in her upbringing. Your husband needs to stop the jokes and to expect his dd’s to be thankful he worked to provide for them is just odd. It’s like you asking them to thank you for washing their clothes all these years, it’s parenting the fact that “his wife” has raised such a socially aware dd is what he should be grateful for. This in itself is a minor miracle.

I tell (mixed race asian) DS that asians are rubbish at football but it's OK cos I'm just having a laff.

I repeat it regularly just to make sure he hears what I think of him regulary but I'm only joking of course.

How is a woman intelligent just because she doesn't take advantage of a free meal?

I don't think some of you know what intelligence is.

What? I don't think you know what you're talking about.

If you have nothing to add to the discussion, why are you actually on it?

People who think they're making pithy comments really do amuse me.

How is a woman intelligent just because she doesn't take advantage of a free meal?

Are you the OP's husband?

@Kewcumber I had to read your post twice. I thought you were serious

@20lbsToLose what does your post even mean?

Yes Kewcumber why is it OK to 'have a laugh' and make misogynistic jokes belittling women for being the sex they were born but we would never dream of making casual racist jokes? Or maybe idiots like the OP's DH would.

What’s wrong with offering someone your coat? I’d offer mine to a friend if they were cold and I wasn’t!

I’d also hold a door open for someone, whoever they were. It’s polite innit?

Sounds like she has the idealogical zeal of the young. Which is a good thing and much needed. It may be a bit gauche and lack the nuances that age and experience bring with it but we all have to start somewhere. Better that than getting your news off the sidebar of Facebook and worrying about what shade of orange you should be.

*"What’s wrong with offering someone your coat? I’d offer mine to a friend if they were cold and I wasn’t!

I’d also hold a door open for someone, whoever they were. It’s polite innit?"*

Yeah, it's also sexist if men only do this for women. No one is suggesting that you shouldn't offer your coat to your friend, or hold a door open or that it isn't polite to do so.

Might be a hint, might be exactly what she said, a genuine concern. I was - I still am! - worried about how traditional gender roles would affect my relationships with men because a lot of them hadn't/still haven't got the memo on equality.

I've muddled through with my DH, and we don't get it right all the time but we're a lot more equal than we would have been if I hadn't been worried about this stuff when I was 17. It would have been easier to navigate some of that with a same-sex relationship, but that would have presented a different set of worries. Not least that I'm not gay!

And if she is... so what?

How could "Shame I'm NOT a lesbian" be a hint that you were lesbian, though?

How could "Shame I'm NOT a lesbian" be a hint that you were lesbian, though?

Because all feminists are lesbians obvs. Duh.

@Kewcumber I had to read your post twice. I thought you were serious

DS would seriously maim me if I were (unike OP's DH who has got away with a bit of understandable rudeness).

I grew up like this in the 60's and 70's and learnt something from it. OP and her DH sadly seem incapable of realising that casual sexism and politeness are not acually the same thing.

In fact the OP says at one point something like - I'm prepared to cook and wash and clean so I don't have to work. Neither she nor her DH think what she does is work.

Sadly my mum suffreed from this a bit and when my Dad left after 35 years she was royally shafted because despite being the brighter of the two she had spent half her life looking after children, washing cooking and cleaning and then doing basic clerical work and had very little pension of her own. It was however deemed to be sufficient with a larger share of the matrimonial assets.

So now my Dad is retired on a comfortable pension whilst my mum lived frugally on little more than the state pension.

You could still end up in this way OP, be thankful that your DD is unlikely to, rather than dismissing her fight to be recognised as more than someones cleaner.

We follow the same trend of being built differently.

What utter, utter bollocks. What part of your build makes you particularly suited to doing housework, OP? What part of a man's build makes him particularly suited to sitting in an office? Since most jobs do not involve heavy manual labour which would require a level of strength only possessed by men, I really don't know what your 'species build' crap is all about.

And if those are the kind of 'jokes' your husband comes out with, I'm not surprised your daughter is rude to him. Thank goodness she has risen above his sexist views rather than actually swallowing them.

Don't even try and guess! Just wait until she brings someone home to meet you!

She said tonight that it's a shame she is attracted to men as she's never going to be keen on the way heterosexual relationships work (that women need to be wined and dined and be looked after, etc.) and thinks this will be a problem for future relationships

I can see her point. I'm hetero, but don't like the power politics in male/female relationships. It can be difficult navigating your loved one's "natural" masculine privilege.

And you only have to read a lot of the threads in here to see that there are an awful lot of men who just assume privilege in all sorts of ways.

So, she's right. BUt I'm not sure that becoming a lesbian is a viable alternative. It can be, for some/many women, but maybe she's just trying to sort out in her head the contradictions between the "romantic love" thing that most [all?] western women are socialised into, and the reality of male privilege, even in intimate relationships.

It was a puzzle for me 30 years ago - it's sad to see it's still a conundrum.

@AssassinatedBeauty he actually says that women are moaning in this country when they shouldn't be and we should actually be supporting the women in different religions and races across the world who do actually have something to moan about and I absolutely agree with him.

Oh brilliant, what do you do to support grassroots feminism in places like Iran or India?

Probably not as much as I could or should be doing. What sorts of things do you do?