SDs dressing inappropriately

[Winosaurus]

I originally posted this on the step-parent board but posting here for traffic.

I know I'm going to get flamed for this but today this has reached a new peak.
My DP has to DDs 12 and 8, they dress so inappropriately I'm sometimes lost for words. They both are wear a full face of make-up and clothes that barely cover their bodies and I'm really struggling with this for several reasons.

1. People look at them constantly when we go out because of how revealing their clothes are and I'm worried it'll attract the wrong attention and potentially put them in danger - particularly as 12yo is getting older.
2. My DD7 now wants to copy them which is causing issues and uncomfortable conversations to come up as I obviously won't let her dress this way but I also don't want to be critical of SDs or their mother for allowing them to dress this way (she buys most of their clothes)
3. I honestly find it embarrassing. When we are out as a group/family people automatically assume I'm their mum and I've had women in particular make remarks about how they are dressed.

I've talked to DP about this and pointed out not only the inappropriateness of their overall looks but also how it could put them in danger. He agrees with me and will occasionally ask SD8 to remove her make-up but overall he doesn't seem to see how wrong it is. I am not being mean about the girls, they are lovely but it's getting to the point where it's making me uncomfortable to be on outings with them when they have their bottom cheeks hanging out of their shorts or transparent crop-tops on. How can I get my partner to see it objectively?

I can't believe anyone would think it ok for and an 8 year old and 12 year old to wear full make up and shorts that show their butt cheeks and see through tops.

I would absolutely judge a parent for this - but the OP is between a rock and hard place due to some opinions that step parents should butt out whilst parenting the children when it suits (i.e school pick ups, washing clothes etc)

When I was 12 I was just becoming aware of boys and I pushed the boundaries with wearing make up and 'trying' to look older. Thankfully I had parents who reigned me in.

To echo some other posts - sparrow's post are quite uncomfortable

This is alright if it happens to girls of 16 then? It's definitely not. Still predatory.

That is not what is being said, and you are twisting people's words.

Clothes don't put girls at risk. The perpetrators of sexual violence against women and girls do.
Yes,they do. But only in an ideal world would the first part be true. Out here in the real world, you need to acknowledge that clothing sends messages, and you have to be prepared for responses. I seriously doubt an eight and a twelve year old would be.

What @NataliaOsipova said. Every word.

OP, I'd be concerned too.

what natalia said.

As an aside i think seeing a child dressed like that would indicate that nobody particularly cares about her wellbeing and therefore was an easy target.

of course its not all right if it happens to girls of 16, or 60, its not right if it happens to any age, but hopefully at 16 we have more maturity to deal with a difficult and upsetting situation than we have at 8 or 12

Well some of the answers on here are unbelievable. At 12 it is up to the parents even step parent to say what is appropriate. She is a child wanting to be a teenager older than her years. Allow light makeup and clothes that are modern but appropriate for her age. Parents are usually to blame. i have seen 5 year olds dressed like 16 year olds from top to toe and the only people responsible are the mothers. At the end of the day you are the adult in charge of them and responsible for their berhaviour outside or in. Sit them down and explain the dangers out there ( this is especially for the people on here who dont seem to acknowledge the danger to children this age) and let them know that you will say what is appropriate. Their father must get involved here and back you up. Where is the real Mum? Can you not speak to her and ask her to get involved in this. If I didnt think think my children were dressed appropriately I would not take them out until they changed. Once again you are the adult responsible. They need to adhere to your boundaries not their demands.

school uniform often appears as sexualised costume.
That is partly to do with the acceptance in the 70s and later of males in general acting like dirty old men, and partly because our biology tells us that anyone who has reached puberty is a desirable partner, despite the fact that - especially since the 1700s or so, it has taken longer than that to be an adult, whilst improved nutrition has lead to puberty on the whole occurring earlier.
Men that actually are adults do not see children as desirable (or if they do, have the decency to keep it to themselves and not act on it), but the association of post-pubescent young women with the school uniform that they wear has produced this stereotype.
As has been said several times, clothes don't put you in danger: Perverts or young men with no self-respect or self-discipline put you in danger.
Unfortunately, though they shouldn't, clothes can catch the attention of the aforementioned perverts or young men, and people will unfairly judge the victim rather than the abuser.

If OP had been the mother, saying "AIBU, when my young DDs visit XH and his DW, they let the girls dress in the most revealing clothes and a face full of make up each, and I think it's wrong they allow this" she'd have had entirely different answers.

But as always on MN, A Stepmother's place is in the wrong.

Of course clothes should not invite sexual assault. Just as I should be able to leave my front door wide open with a few gold bars in the hall and not expect burglars. But that is unrealistic.

And above and beyond this, even if the girls were living in a vacuum with no predatory men/boys around, the clothes would still be inappropriate because they are 12 and 8 years old.

What do you do at weekends, OP? Can you do some outdoor activities that are definitely skimpy-clothes unfriendly? And then you can chuck at them some warm, decent clothes you've bought. And make sure you rush out of the house early so there's no time for primping and preening. Country walk? Local football match?

Agree you can't do anything about stepmother's choices but you can at least show them that at in your world there's more to life than appearance and aping celebrities. Especially when you're 8 years old.

I think your partner is the link here and has to say something to his ex. He will have to take the consequences from her as she won't like it. You say he doesn't notice it and just sees his 'babies'....but he HAS to notice it. Please try and make him see. I think your idea of pointing out the leering from other men was a good one and might jolt him forwards.
Your partner really could enforce them to wear what you both want when they are with you and You never know, the girls might even appreciate that too, as they are only dressing like this with encouragement from their mother.

Hi winosaurus - apologies if my post seemed a bit garbled. I realise it's your DP's DDs not your DDs. I was just pointing out that if it had been your DDs being allowed to dress this way by exH and his partner you wouldn't have got all the crazy replies. I'm sorry you got such a hard time early on in the thread and I'm glad so many voices of sanity have turned up laterly.

This topic is a minefield, but here goes.

There is already a possibility that the 12 year old is being exposed to risk, as the OP mentions that she was found at the park with a group of boys 16 - 18. What was said to her about this at the time?

Perhaps some personal safety tips are a good idea - stick with friends, call home if anything makes you uncomfortable.

How about a regular breakfast conversation with the 8 year old - what are you wearing today? Talk about what is suitable and appropriate for the day's weather and activities. Be blunt - make up is not needed today; you need to be warm enough; shoes need to be sensible for walking or running around. Ideally your DP should be having this conversation, not you.

Some of this will hopefully rub off on the older sister too. But I think she also needs a separate 1 - 1 chat that won't embarrass her - perhaps from the point of view of looking her best for all situations.

Do you go by car a lot? Perhaps a brisk walk to town with the wind whistling around their shorts and crop-tops will produce a rapid conversion to warmer clothing...

I simply cannot believe some of the responses here. I have a 10 yr old daughter. The thought of her dressed as you describe for an 8 YEAR old and a 12 year old is just sickening. I can't think of any advice OP because I think if I were in your position, I woukd simply refuse to leave the house with them.( I also cannot think Id be having anything to do with a man who saw this as acceptable for his daughters). And that is not a sensible response either. It is completely unacceptable for an 8 yr old to wear any make up as a regular thing. As for clothes that are designed to look sexy. How CAN that be a responsible way for any parent (the girls mum AND dad ) to allow. Clothes are not 'dangerous' of course. No sexual assault on the 12 year old could in any way be excused by whatever she is wearing. However, it is common sense for gods sake that walking around with her buttocks hanging out IS going to attract attention and make her vulnerable. It is also teaching both girls at a very young age, that to look sexy is good, that when they get dressed, their looks really count. When my daughter gets up in the morning I have to tear her away from her book, nag her to brush her hair and get dressed - at the weekend in clothes that mean she can walk the dog, climb trees. I cannot but feel sad that this 8 year old is messing with her face and evaluating her looks. Yes, when girls become teenagers their clothes and looks become important but why, why now are they dressing like this??

Just came back from the (lovely) local stationers where there was a brand of stationery, clearly aimed at girls, called 'Top Model'. All illustrations of girls posing with huge anime eyes and glittery clothing.

Given that it is for the purpose of writing, why not 'Top Writer' or 'Top Journalist'?

This thread has, unfortunately, attracted some classic MN comments and PPs who seem to enjoy being deliberately obtuse.

OP, I agree with you that 8YO and 12YO dressing in the way you describe (hot pants with bum cheeks visible and see through tops with bras showing) along with a full face of make up is not appropriate at all and is rather grotesque. Those PP saying "clothes don't put you in danger" etc are minimising the situation. Men/boys look at women and girls, a lot of men are decent and register that it is an inappropriately dressed child and think nothing of it and leave it at that, some men don't and still leer and stare too long or make inappropriate comments, boys are even worse for this because they have immaturity on their side and mates to play up in front of. I've read threads on MN about women being indignant (and quite rightly so) about the fact that builders/workmen/drunken louts jeer at them and catcall in the street when they are just walking about going about their business wearing modest clothing, what makes the naysayers think that these same groups of people won't be leering and making inappropriate comments to these girls?

I agree with the PP who say that dressing older/appearing older attracts attention of older boys AND girls and can lead to underage drinking, sex and drug use.

I also agree with PP who say that dressing like this is like wearing a sandwich board emblazoned with "My parents haven't set proper boundaries and leave me to my own devices too much, they don't pay enough attention to me/what I'm doing" basically advertising that they are easy targets for manipulation and vulnerable to predators.

Aside from the sinister sexualisation of children, it really isn't physically healthy for them to be dressing like this. Crop tops in cold weather can lead to kidney problems, not to mention colds and chills etc. Trowelling make up on isn't good for anyone's skin, let alone an 8YO's.

The skincare route may be a way in to discuss the make up with your SD, I doubt you'd make any headway banning make up, but maybe compromise and ask them not to use foundation and lipstick, just eye liner, mascara and tinted lip balm. You could talk about blocked pores leading to spotty, scarred skin, you could even go along the lines of "I know you want to look your best but there's foundation on the bedding/towels/furniture/your clothes and it's really hard to clean; you don't want your lovely outfits stained".

I don't have any new advice for the clothes, maybe you could look at fashions online together and discuss which styles you like, I don't know if there are any appropriate magazines to look through with them (is Look appropriate?! I have no idea)

Thank God as we near (I hope) the end of this interminable thread that we have a majority of reasonable responses. I was beginning to doubt humanity, for a few days.

Agree with PP's who have pointed out that dressing this way is advertising the fact 'my parents don't care how I dress and have no control over me, what I have to offer is on show, I have low self esteem and am vulnerable'

@NataliaOsipova

👏🏼👏🏼👏🏼👏🏼👏🏼👏🏼👏🏼👏🏼👏🏼

You lot are very naive if you think that a man/teenage boy will never look at an under age girl no matter what she's wearing. It makes a HUGE difference what they are wearing. Presumably you never bother to lock your houses either because that's victim blaming too.

Any decent man will not act on it of course - but they will look. Also not all men are decent.

IMO it's never ok to walk down the street with your arse hanging out and a see through top on. It does look slutty, attention seeking and it is asking for trouble. It may be something some people will choose for a night out at an older age (once they are confidently able to understand the type of attention they will get and deal with it) but young girls should not be allowed to choose this as they don't understand the implications.

Girls can still look trendy - they don't have to wear boden. Just cover up the flesh between mid thigh and shoulder and tone down the make up.

What a load of rubbish on this thread

Op you're right. Utterly inappropriate. Simple.

Cannot believe the amount of bullshit on here, it is not appropriate for little kids to wear a full face of makeup or have their arses on show. Good luck OP, hope you come back and feel reassured that you ANBU. Thank goodness for those of you who've swooped in to reassure me that the whole world isn't insane.