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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

To be annoyed at this feminist

530 replies

PlayOnWurtz · 05/09/2017 08:01

I happily call myself a feminist and will enter into discussions about it freely in real life and online. I got into one conversation about appearance and politics and how you rationalise body hair removal with feminism. I said I simply feel unclean, it's nothing to do with politics or being oppressed if I don't remove armpit and leg hair I feel like I need a wash.

Cue me being told that I clearly missed the memo on western socialization and oppression and that me removing body hair to feel clean wouldn't happen if I hadn't been socialised to feel this way Hmm erm no love I feel like I need a ruddy good wash if I don't shave I'm not oppressed....

AIBU to be annoyed and more than a bit Hmm

OP posts:
WishfulThanking · 07/09/2017 09:39

Nail on head, basil

That would explain why people get so upset on these threads. I have never understood this passionate hatred by women for a movement that is actually trying to help them. What you have just said does go some way to explain it. And I'm sorry to say but adds weight to my thoughts that these people are hard of thinking. It's head in sand mode.

Walkingdead11 · 07/09/2017 09:43

Let's also not forget the powerful influence of porn, particularly on the shaven pubic hair scenario......it's so significant and damaging to the lives of women. We all know that porn sex does not represent a healthy attitude to sex and relationships, why don't more women question this??? It's bloody depressing!

PlinkyTheFairyWitch · 07/09/2017 10:01

And I'm sorry to say but adds weight to my thoughts that these people are hard of thinking. It's head in sand mode.

I think you have to temper that with some empathy. Feminists criticising and judging other women for making choices under patriarchy gets us nowhere fast.

BertrandRussell · 07/09/2017 10:50

"Feminists criticising and judging other women for making choices under patriarchy gets us nowhere fast."

How do you feel about people criticizing and judging feminists for speaking out about the patriarchy? Because that seems to be just fine!

AhhhhThatsBass · 07/09/2017 11:05

The fact is, the feminist in question is probably right. I wax everything to within an inch of its life purely because it's the done thing. I hate having to do it and if all women were hairy, I'd leave it. But that will never be the case. In fact My husband caught sight of my unwaxed nethers a week or so before my waxing appointment and was completely grossed out.

PlinkyTheFairyWitch · 07/09/2017 11:05

How do you feel about people criticizing and judging feminists for speaking out about the patriarchy? Because that seems to be just fine!

I'd prefer they didn't.

Feminists can criticise the patriarchy all they want. But criticising other women for making choices under same aforementioned patriarchy is just not on, IMO, and counter-productive. Feminism has lost its sisterhood and is much, much poorer for it.

Seachangeshell · 07/09/2017 12:23

bass Your post has just made me feel a bit sad. Ridiculous I know, as I don't know you or your husband at all.
It's such a shame that you hate waxing so much and that your husband is disgusted if you don't keep it up.

Is it just hair he has a problem with or would he be equally put off by other imperfections (e.g. Boob saggage, which is coming my way now I'm 40)?

Walkingdead11 · 07/09/2017 12:23

AhhhhThatsBass

And therein we have our answers.

Offred · 07/09/2017 12:30

But the whole point is that when feminists are speaking about the effect patriarchy has on shaping culture *many people take this as a criticism of them as an individual because of what I and others outlined re individualism and 'freedom of choice'.

Walkingdead11 · 07/09/2017 12:35

The patriarchy has done such a bang up job on women that they actually believe they have a choice and they are doing it for themselves........😂 ya couldn't make it up!

Lovingmybear2 · 07/09/2017 12:37

I wax because I want to. Dh couldn't care less.

Bass you shouldn't be doing anything to your body you don't want to

Walkingtowork · 07/09/2017 12:39

*Walking" I said on a different thread that this unknowing auto-oppression is the cleverest trick of the patriarchy, and got laughed at and a Hmm face.

I stand by that though. However, I totally get why many people don't want to see it. Bloody depressing when you do.

Lovingmybear2 · 07/09/2017 12:40

walking you are making it up!

Lots of posters on here don't shave or wax, others do. It's choice and yes fashion but I don't think it's some mass patriarchy conspiracy.

Rather fight bigger battles like Jacob Reece knob heads views.

Walkingdead11 · 07/09/2017 12:42

Yes it is beyond depressing. It's the same kind of mentality that puts the likes of Jodie Marsh and Katie Price up there as the new face of feminism, cos they own their sexuality and make money! Er no...........

Walkingdead11 · 07/09/2017 12:46

Lovingmybear2

I don't know 1 single woman under a certain age who doesn't shave off ALL their pubic hair. Now I'm not saying there aren't any as that would be daft. However, it would seem perfectly clear to me that the prevailing attitude is that pubic hair is unsightly, unhygenic and to be got rid of a.s.a.p.

Walkingtowork · 07/09/2017 12:53

Loving no one believes there are actual conspiracy meetings being held! It's the pattern we see all around us, that we perpetuate unless we can step outside of it for a moment and see what's actually going on.

Which I can't wholeheartedly recommend tbh. As I said, it's a bloody miserable realisation.

Walkingtowork · 07/09/2017 12:55

Jacob bollock-face's views are not unrelated to the oppression of women you know!

Walkingtowork · 07/09/2017 13:03

Sorry that sounded a bit aggressive. What I mean is, I see his views on women and the wider pressure on women to look a certain way as all part of the same system we live under

Lovingmybear2 · 07/09/2017 13:20

Yes I didn't think there were secret meetings of men Wink

And I agree with you walking that more women do wax etc more than they used to but then again there are far more spas etc around than in my salad days of the 80s there were no beauty salons as such, at least not around Birmingham Grin and no one had their eyebrows waxed let alone bushes.

Girls today seem to have immaculate makeup and hair, my dds wear anything they bloody well want to and would hoot at the thought of dressing to please a bloke. They mentioned the patriarchy when I pointed out that their dad had done a 12 hour shift and could they do him a sandwich.

I can't get worked up about body hair to b honest bur feel far more scared of people like Jacob reeve cock and his vile views on women and the creeping trans agenda of men creeping into women's lives.

Those are the battles we should be fine fighting surely not arguing amongst ourselves about our hair choices.

Lovingmybear2 · 07/09/2017 13:21

However I do see your view that they are linked although not sure I agree totally with that.

Walkingdead11 · 07/09/2017 13:48

But it's all part of the same battle......it may be only hair but it's still a system which is telling women what to do by making it appear that we have choices, when actually many don't.

Kezza8 · 07/09/2017 14:00

But men don't feel unclean if they don't remove leg and underarm hair? I do remove mine, btw, but I am just saying that woman are conditioned to feel like this and you have proved the point perfectly x

Lovingmybear2 · 07/09/2017 14:10

Maybe but from what I see of my dds and their friends, all late teens, tjhey have far more confidence in their bodies and abilities than me and my friends did 30 years ago waxed or not.

Walkingdead11 · 07/09/2017 14:26

Do they though? Surely if they were that brave they wouldn't all strive to look the same?

BertrandRussell · 07/09/2017 14:32

I know this is anecdata, but my young adult dd didn't start removing her pubic hair until she got involved with an abusive man who "modified" her in lots of ways. Growing it back was part of the liberation process.