Why can't Teacher training be done in summer holidays

[daffodil10]

Why do summer holidays need to be extended by 3 days to cover inset days when teachers have had 6 weeks off. And before I get shot down I realise they may have been in school over the holidays etc. But what is the point in going back to school on a Thursday

You did bring up the inefficiency of starting on a Thursday. I'm simply sharing that, from my point of view as a teacher, starting on a Thursday can actually make the school year run more smoothly and help maximise learning time. Which is surely what all parents want.

I disagree with set terms for all. Inset days are a nothing to me anyway as I work in Ireland. But we have the flexibility to set some of our own midterm dates, as long as we teach the required amount of days, and it works very well. It helps us to break up long terms (especially around Easter which can vary so much every year).

Our break dates are published on the school website, emailed home and sent in a printed newsletter home with the child. If parents don't check one of these, they have only themselves to blame.

Personally, looking at the pressures English teachers are under from an outside perspective, I think that the system should be finding ways to make their workload more manageable. I've no objection to the stuff you're bringing up per se, but I feel that the cost to the teacher (at a time when there's a high number leaving) is a priority to consider in these discussions.

I once had a parent demand a pack of work for their chils because they were taking an 8 week trip in term time! Apparently I have a DUTY to ensure their child is educated. I replied that I do, when they send their child to school.

The absolute cheek! They can catch up on the work they've missed by choice themselves.

I had a similar case once, I was teaching Resource and the child was taken out for 8 weeks. I think it was approx 30 teaching hours with me they missed.

Mum came in, all worried about the missing time "and when will he make up the hours he's entitled to, I don't want him missing more class, you'll have to take him after school..."

No, lady, gtfo. You take him out by choice, you miss the education I would have provided, your fault and your issue to solve - end of.

Before our new head teacher joined, inset days were sprung with very little notice, sometimes less than 48 hours in advance. The new head releases them in July for the following academic year. It is miles easier to plan childcare now.

Our school has wraparound care attached £15 in the morning and £17 after school. I'm very envious of people that can send their DC to a school breakfast club with money for toast etc.

They complained when they took their child out of school for 8 weeks and that child then underperformed?!
Face.
Desk.
Repeat.
So bloody glad I don't teach anymore.

liadain
That's ridiculous.

But it happens.

Like a y11stude t who had the assessment dates given at the start of year 10, and mid way, and before the summer and at the start of y11 still need up on holiday for a fortnight over the assessments.
My catch up offering ws he could complete the assessment at the back of my room on nights I was already staying back doing revision clubs. Home thought it as unfair that he was disadvantaged because 'the other students had lesson time to plan and had your help'.

1. Of course they had lesson time. They were in school.
2. They didn't have lots of help from me because it's not allowed and I was a stickler for following the rules to the letter.
3. I don't HAVE to have him back. I could have pulled him off timetable on sports day or enrichment afternoons instead.

They always seem so surprised too when you don't bend over backwards Maisy, don't they!

I don't know where or how these people get the idea being so demanding is acceptable. At the end of the day, it's just a job like any other - this idea of us being beholden to teach them anytime and anywhere is ridiculous.

Totally!

And what's annoying is that people like this take up so much time dealing with them that actually takes our time away from teaching and learning.

When dealing with entitled, rude people like this I always remind myself that most parents are unbelievably supportive, trust us to get on with our job, help their children achieve and are lovely and polite individuals. I always remember that we don't hear from them because they're quite happy with what we do and on parents' eve they are always the most lovely appointments.
(Often the lovely parents have our backs too. One year an entitled parent was awful to me in full ear shot of other parents. Another's parent sent their child to get me a cup of tea from the cafe area!)

Every now and then you get a truly lovely parent. I have kept cards and saved emails from parents thanking me profusely for helping their child. It's lovely when the student wants to work and the parents want to support BOTH their child and the teachers. Funnily enough those kids tended to be the ones who did best!

@Wolfiefan the lovely parents and kids are very much in the majority. That's why we do what we do. The entitled, annoying ones unfortunately tend to have the loudest voices and take up most of the time sadly.

That's very true. The vast majority of parents are totally fine, lovely people - and you get some truly great ones, and some arseholes. It's unfortunate that the arseholes can often be first to spring to mind...I imagine nurses and other frontline staff might have similar stories to us.

I keep a box with notes from parents and kids, and it's nice to pull out every once in a while and bring all those lovely memories back.

Mum came in, all worried about the missing time "and when will he make up the hours he's entitled to, I don't want him missing more class, you'll have to take him after school...". Not worried about the missing time to support attendance (assuming for a holiday). He not entitled, he has the privilege of attending lessons in school during set timetable. I'm really shocked at the terrible attitude of some of the parents on this thread. I clearly need to be more vociferously happy with the support given by my DS's school and teachers.

text
Most parents are awesome and lovely.

It's always the loud, entitled, unreasonable ones who get the most air time. You only have to wade through school threads on MN to realise that there's a certain type of person who will want to call the school for anything (and gets egged on by other such people on here). Woe betide any teacher who voices a dissenting view. The mob pile in an it's only a matter of time before you get 'oh so you're a teacher. That figures' and lots of goady fuckery.

But MN, like the real world, often the most reasonable parents just can't be arsed being 'that parent'.

The thing is I like hearing from parents. My child couldn't do the Hw. He's really upset. Thanks for letting me know. I can help him.
My daughter thinks she's crap at... well she isn't. Now you've told me I can take every single opportunity to show her where she's done well.
Being "that" parent isn't about contacting the school with valid concerns. It's about being cross because your child didn't do the HW and got a detention. Or the million and one other things that's the fault of the teacher and not the young person.
And I did get it wrong. Of course I did. And I may have mishandled situations at times. And I apologised and moved forwards.
I hate the all teachers are bullies attitudes in this thread. Wonder why some teens have filthy attitudes?

Absolutely wolfie.
Calmly and reasonably talking to teachers is fine.
I was unimpressed at a student's sudden attitude in class last year and we had a word. Mum called up to explain how guilty her child felt about taking it out on me. Turns out they were trying to deal with something at home and I got the brunt of it. I cancelled the detention.

Equally, calling up to let us know home situations, ask us to keep an eye on them for whatever reason etc are all useful reasons to call.
If parents think I've made the wrong call and they ring up and say 'Can i have your take on an incident with chloe?' I'll happily chat.

Being 'that' parent means getting angry over anything, undermining the school, trying to get your child out of detentions but being equally furious when they get isolation, telling your kids to 'tell miss/sir that i said...', expecting unreasonable demands, reporting staff every 5 seconds etc.

Yep. I think sometimes a quick call or email can really help both the student and teacher too.
At the end of the day don't the vast majority of teachers want students to be happy and to enable them to achieve the very best they can. I wanted my students to grow into happy, healthy young adults who could take their results out into the world and build a great life for themselves.

So at the Senior Leadership Team meeting this week (held after school) we looked at the three week holiday club that we offered as a trial this year. Activities included film making, baking, sport, drama, extra English and Maths, humanities projects, and some trips - fantastic you would think? No - we made a loss. We are a school of 1600 and new Year 7s were invited. We thought that it would be mainly the newbies and current Year 7. We really struggled to get 15 students a week out of a potential 420. It will not be offered again.

Ah most parents are nice text . That story is years old now, but I'll always remember it for the sheer cheek involved

I think it's down to being in a public facing role - and of course working with people's children, which is something even the most level headed person can be completely unreasonable about! Teachers know that most parents just want to work with us.

goeasyonthetonic
It's the same story in lots of schools i think.

If there is a demand and school could even break even they'd probably do it.

A private company would do it if there was enough demand to cover costs and a bit of profit.

Nobody is going to make a loss for the sake of a few parents who seem stunned that thry have to find childcare in the holidays.

Sorry, I forgot to add that bit Maisy. There would of course be a pro rats pay increase to make up for the additional hours.

I've had parents outraged that we can't rearrange an A level exam so they can take the child to a wedding. Or going on holiday on the day of the maths GCSE exam. Not a lifetime experience holiday, think static caravan in British seaside. Then have a go at school when they can't just catch up

In regards to inset days. Not all schools are as efficient as the ones on this thread.

Dds school announced an inset day with a week's notice.

In June I was begging for the start dates for THAT September so my Mum could book a holiday with the dc without crossing the start of term. Others needed it for childcare reasons.

Not all schools are as efficient as the ones on this thread.

It's pretty standard to list well in advance, at least one year, if not two. Not sure what's going on in your child's school, though.

It's pretty standard to list well in advance, at least one year, if not two

Its all very well being 'standard', until your DC are at a school where it isn't standard.

In which case the issue is actually with your school and not the whole system. I've worked in 5 schools and my kids go to one and all of those have published them at the start of the year

I agree that it's really unusual. We follow the county dates and have a week extra at half term as we do twilight. Dates are out a year in advance.