Would you move to America if you were me?

[BenDuck]

DP is from the US and we have talked for a while about going to live there (East coast) and the conversations are now getting more serious, he is starting to look for jobs etc. I'm still feeling really conflicted though. Part of me wants to, mostly because I fucking HATE brexit and like to be away from it all but also because we would be able to afford a really lovely house there. There is loads of stuff that bothers me though- having to drive everywhere, lower food standards, Trump.
I also worry about my position legally. I'm currently a SAHM but earn a little doing evening work (that I wouldn't be able to do there) so would be v reliant on DH. Esp. as would be hard to get a working visa. I worry about what would happen were we to divorce- would I be stuck there unable to bring DC back to UK (they have dual citizenship)?
Anyone been in a similar boat???

Blimey Marialuisa - where do you live?! I thought my $7k a year I'm property tax was expensive. Also $200 on a meal! There are five of us and we never spend that much.

It's not every man for himself everywhere at all.

We have free health care if you can't afford it and lots of community grants and help.

I'd rather be skint here than in the UK.

You haven't mentioned if your DH's family is in the place you want to live, to me that's a huge factor. On jobs if you are married you will have a visa with the right to work, that is not an issue at all. I was just in the US a few weeks ago (east coast, liberal area) and if you don't turn on on CNN you wouldn't know about Trump. Local politics are more important in most people's daily lives. And as mentioned he won't be there forever, whereas Brexit...that's a different story isn't it.

Also how long has your DH been in the UK? You've gotten him absorbed in your country and your children have been born there. When families have two countries of origin I think you have to take seriously the fact that you will need to make the effort to expose them to both.

As you can see OP some people love living in the US and some struggle.

I adore where I live, my kids are in great state schools, our house is roomy and has an acre of land, DH gets 30 days holiday a year, and we live in a really safe friendly town.

The thought of giving that up to move back to the UK... Nope.

But it's also a horrible country to live in if you're poor, disadvantaged, or unhealthy.

If you moved here as a spouse you would be allowed to work. If you divorced you'd be able to stay and would most likely share custody of your children. Without their father's permission you'd be unable to take them back to the UK to live.

I'd suggest you and your DH think hard about looking for jobs that pay fairly well, otherwise I wouldn't consider making the move.

By America we're talking the USA? As opposed to Canada?

I've lived on the East Coast of the USA for 5+ years. The weather/seasons are amazing. We have a lovely community of Americans and other Brits/expats. DC go to a fee-paying school but that's more due to the city we are in than anything else. Despite all the rhetoric about guns, I feel safer here than I did in London. There is very little petty crime and you can leave things in your garden and they don't disappear. We have made a lovely life for ourselves, have great neighbours, a nice standard of living and health insurance/medical issues etc haven't been an issue. Our policy is excellent and we've had top notch care when we needed it.

All that said - I don't think I'd do it again! I'm the trailing spouse and don't have a visa to work here. Now the kids are getting older I find myself bored and discontent and so we plan to move back by the end of the year. We don't want to settle here ultimately so haven't applied for green cards. Trump et al haven't affected our daily life so far but I don't like the way the far right are heading. I'm also sick of being forever the foreigner and have experienced racism.

BeALert

I know! Wherever she is it's expensive, our property taxes are $3,400.

I have lived here for 30 years. I was a SAHM for a few years and was working very part time when I divorced Exh. I couldnt leave with the kids as they were all born here. Get them UK passports first off, probably wont help but its something. ( They can get US passports too but get UK ones first ). The child support system is so much better here. I got shedloads. Also the work situation is better, very easy to find a job and neither your wages nor any new partners wages will impact the child support. I live between boston and the New hampshire border. If I can help PM me.
The other thing is you would come in with a greencard if you have been wed more than 2 years, a full greencard not a temp one. That would allow you almost all the rights of a citizen, No voting etc but you could work and do what you needed. You could also apply for citizenship after 3 years if still married or 5 if divorced.
I know this country is a laughing stock right now but seriously the standard of living is so much better. Everything is so much cheaper. There are so many opportunities. Trump wont be in power for ever. You can get decent organically raised food very easily, though it does cost more its still cheap by uk standards.
I say go for it, honestly

"From what I've read (no experience) work life is v full on in the US. You work longer days than in the UK and only get 10 days holiday a year and it's frowned upon if you take them."

I'm pretty sure workers' rights are terrible. I have heard of people taking more holiday and it's quite common to take unpaid leave there as that's the only way many people can have enough time.

"MN is not the best place to ask this as it has a fairly vocal minority of posters who hate the US and will describe it as some sort of third world fascist state where no one is safe and society barely functions, rather than the sophisticated, diverse democracy that it is. "

I think you'll find that scepticism of the US is quite common outside MN, all over Europe and many parts of the world in fact.
I'm not sure the current wave of neo-Nazis would put me off as it's a big enough country for there to be all sorts of strange groups, but the right wing politics (from both main parties) and the gun culture definitely would put me off.
My other thing would be the drive everywhere culture and the terrible workers' rights.
I've heard that the people are very friendly though.

Just to add, DH's company's holidays are excellent. 26 days plus national and local bank holiday equivalents, a month of paid paternity leave and extra days at Xmas/New Year. Lower paying jobs really don't have good holiday situations at all but there is definitely room to maneuver when you get a contract here. Don't let that put you off is what I mean!

I ahve visited the US and it is a beautiful country but I am with insancerre "I wouldn't move to America even if you held a gun to my head. But, I'm not you. If it feels right, then do it."

BenDuck "Kids are little (4 & 2). I would definitely want to move back were we to separate" Please check out the situation internationally legally if you were to divorce. I have heard of one woman stuck in the USA after divorce as she cannot remove her kids.

If the kids grow up and meet partners there then they may never leave.

Agree with caffeinestream "I wouldn't do it in your shoes. You're not planning to work and you're worrying a lot about it not working out. I think moving abroad only works if both parties are fully committed to it, and it doesn't sound like you are."

Does your DH have UK citizenship? If not he should get it before he leaves in case you want to come back to the UK as a couple.

Been in Texas for 4 years, Dh and I are both Brits, kids aged 8 and 12. Such an easy life, so convenient. We have a great house, garden and pool, organic food is reasonable in shops, farmers markets and restaurants, never seen a gun, driven 36k miles in the past year (including 9 hour drives to Florida etc). Dh gets 5 weeks holiday a year and I get 3 but only been in this job one year so will increase this year - I also work flexi hours so easy to fit in with school commitments.

Spent today on the beach, kids went boogie boarding, weather was hot, blue sky etc.

Trump doesn't affect us on a daily basis.

We are lucky to have medical insurance and no waiting list to see the top specialists in the world. My doctor can normally see me the same day, costs $25, blood test /mammogram results within a couple of hours etc.

I resisted a move to the USA for years, was an expat for 18 years before coming here, mostly in Europe, Middle East and Asia but it really is a good place to live.

I think it depends on where you are planning to live as the East Coast is huge. And AFAIK you wouldn't even be able to take your children out of the country on holiday without your husband's permission. So it could be a brilliant experience where you make good friends quickly or it could be hell if you are unhappy, split up and can't get back to your family and friends. Have you already been there? Do you know your husband's family?

Heyhosilverballs - I live in a community like that in the midwest, in a suburb of a city with a shocking murder rate. I often don't lock my door or my car, and the generosity and community spirit is fantastic. When there are marches to support liberal causes, hundreds of people decamp to the trains downtown from here, with banners, babies on shoulders, etc. You really don't see that side much on TV, understandably I suppose.

I experienced the downside of the Hague Convention myself, having divorced with five DCs. The upside to staying here is that my DCs were able to stay in their terrific high school district and so far have gone to great universities. Fingers crossed they will all be financially independent upon graduation (two more to go in full time education). The downside is that my extended family are all in Ireland, UK, and continental Europe, and flights are expensive. Plus, once the DCs started high school and had activities like summer school, sports camps and summer jobs it was very hard to get them all on a place to visit their rellies across the pond.

I don't think it's at all unreasonable to consider whether you want to be stuck in the US until your younger child turns 18, or whether you would then find yourself stuck between a rock and a hard place because your children's lives would be firmly rooted in the US, with the prospect of them starting families of their own ahead of you. If you move back at that point, can you really just take up your old life where you left off? How do you maintain the sort of sustained contact that makes family life a reality if you are on one continent and grandchildren are on another? Otoh, how do you do your share of caring for aging parents at such a remove? How would your children do that for you if they were in the US and you were back in the UK?

Best to treat this as a permanent break with the UK and not to entertain the hope of returning and life getting back to where it was. How does that sound as an option for you?

If you are still inclined to go, is it possible for you to enter into an agreement with your H that would be binding that the DCs and you would be able to return to live permanently in the UK in the event of divorce?

I wouldn't move there if you paid me. I did, however, go to Australia with Aussie DH.

I am totally guilty of not having RTFT but just wanted to pass this on - UK friends of mine moved to the USA while unwed, but for her to stay there (non-working) they had to marry within 6m, iirc. Things may have changed now but it might be worth checking on that.

"From what I've read (no experience) work life is v full on in the US. You work longer days than in the UK and only get 10 days holiday a year and it's frowned upon if you take them

It depends on the company, but on the whole it's no different to the UK. Holiday days are a perk not a right. A good company will offer lots of leave as part of the package.

As a rule a lot of people put in long hours Mon-Thurs so they can take Friday off and have a long weekend. Most good companies have the attitude of as long as the work gets done and you do your hours, I don't care when you turn up

Essentially find the right company and you will be very happy.

Going while unmarried requires a fiance/e visa iirc. There is a deadline about the wedding date.

Kursk - not trying to be argumentative, genuinely interested - is 2 weeks not the standard for annual leave in the USA then? I had a cousin who worked for Reuters in London, and he was only initially given 2 weeks AL because this was standard for all Reuters' employees,, US and UK. He left after 6m, partly because of that.

Apologies to the OP for not reading her correction of DP to DH.

I still wouldn't do it if you paid me. And I'm still stuck under the Hague Convention in Australia, if anything were to go wrong with my marriage.

Haven't read all the responses, but number one thing if I could go back and change would be to NOT move to the USA.

Unless your dp (and must be dh if you are to get one too) is going straight for green card, moving here unless you have your own visa is going to restrict you. Even then if you have your own visa, if you lose it (i.e. Lose job, you end up in same position).
Very few of the work visas come with a spouse visa that allows you to work, for example h1b doesn't. Spouse visas are obviously dependent on you being married, so if anything happened marriage wise you'd either have to leave or find your own job/sponsorship.
And... Hague convention is a bitch. Once your children are ordinarily resident (time required varies but let's say 6 months or so), they come under the jurisdiction of where you move to. I'm intimately acquainted with this as my non-us citizen stbx is not allowing my us citizen DS to leave the USA. I've been told it wouldn't matter if DS was a non-us citizen, same rule would apply.
So, if at the end, he refuses, and I can't get a court (judge or jury) to agree I will either have to stay married at mercy of stbx indefinitely, divorce and leave country without DS, or try and find an employer who will sponsor me (most unlikely option).

It's all shit. Unless you have a prenup or post up, and even then courts here may over ride in the "best interest of the child".

Would I? Possibly. Don't know enough about your life to decide.

Make a list of your own life goals and plans and then the pros and cons of the US move and how it impacts your life. Then look at the pros and cons for your family (DH and children equally).

I was an expat for well over a decade and had children in a couple of different countries. It can be challenging and exhilarating moving countries. Was it a good decision? Absolutely! Would I do it again? If the offer was good, yes.

I wouldn't if you paid me. We have got it so good here in the U.K.

We've been on the west coast for the last 5.5years

Not a huge amount to add to what's been said by people who live in the US but really so much depends on the kind of job and how much money you have (same considerations if you were moving to most places I imagine really)

RE holiday my DH was initially offfered 2weeks, negotiated 3 but after a year the company (tech start up that grew very quickly) decided to create unlimited PTO and give everyone 2 weeks over Christmas. They also give 2months paternity let alone maternity so it really depends on the company.

We live in a very expensive city but in tech jobs are paid incredibly well, DH would be on half the salary he is now in London and while our cost of living would be lower, it wouldn't be half.

Having said that I don't want to be here permanently, I miss home, I miss Europe, I have feeling so far away from the rest of the world.

I wouldn't due to having dc, nothing to do with politics, food standards but what happens in a divorce situation.

On reflection I see what has haplenedd to my contempories with their relationships post 45. Only around 50% have survived.

I live in North Jersey. Property taxes are insane at $15k for a smaller home and $23k for our bigger home. Food wise, we spend 1000 a month not including booze for a family of 5. We spend a lot on booze!!!

Really think through your move. It needs to be worth it.