To think the police are a bit of a let down? (Lots of swearing inside)

[DuckAndPancakes]

Yesterday afternoon, I went to go to the supermarket with my friend and two children (1 & 7). As I went to pull into the supermarket, a car came around the round about, not indicating. I braked and in frustration, threw my hands up.

The car in front stopped dead in front of me as I pulled in to the car park and the passenger, a middle aged woman, came up to my window and started shouting and screaming at me.
I said that I was frustrated as they hadn't used their indicator on the roundabout and that it's possibly going to cause an accident for someone.
She told me I was "a fucking joke" "ducking disgusting" "who did I think I was". At this point, I interrupted her and said that there was absolutely no reason to be shouting and swearing at me, especially in front of my young children. She then said "I don't give a fuck about your fucking children, you fat fucking cunt". Then walked off and got back in her car and drove off.

Relatively shaken and upset, I went and parked my car and got my children out. I had my 1 year old son in my arms. As we walked into the shop, my friend pointed out that the car was parked (on the double yellow lines right outside) and to get the registration. I'd left my glasses in the car so couldn't see without getting much closer, so took a photo of the car that I'd be able to zoom in on.

Was genuinely scared of going into the store knowing they were probably in there. Ran in and hurried everyone along to be able to get out asap. Went to the self checkouts and was scanning items, where this woman ran up to me, taking pictures of me and my children and telling me to smile for the camera. Shouted at me that I was pathetic and I was disgusting etc. She then came around into the self service area and was extremely up close, continuously berating me. I remained calm the whole time, didn't shout etc. She continued to go off at me right til I was walking out of the shop when she then told ME to leave her alone and I responded with "I haven't done anything, you sad old woman."

Hurried back to my car with my children and burst into tears and phoned the police to report it.

And they're going to do absolutely nothing. They won't contact the owner of the car (who was obviously her partner/husband) because "he will just deny knowledge of who she is or how to contact her". Despite the fact there's CCTV from her getting out of the car and coming and shouting at me, despite the fact there's cctv of her taking pictures of me and my children and berating me in self checkout. Despite having my friend as a witness as well as staff from the supermarket.

I just feel so .... let down. It's not even like I was going to go after a prosecution, but knowing that this woman has completely got away with this without even having a talking to from the police.

My 7 year old is completely shook up as she was scared of what this woman could or would do (though bless her, kept telling me I wasn't fat I was just cuddly).

I wish I hadn't bothered to stay calm.
My poor friend feels awful because she didn't want to start saying things to her and make it look like we were ganging up on her.

I'm just so frustrated that the police aren't even going To try. All I've been told is that the number plate is logged with the crime and that if it flags again then it will "paint a bigger picture" but at this time it's not know to them (6 month old Mercedes).

I feel completely and utterly downtrodden and down today.

Well thanks to the government the police are more stripped back and cut back than ever so yes they have to pick and choose what to respond to i doubt a lady been verbally abused and shaken in a supermarket is a serious as a murder or child sex ring etc resources and officers themselves are sparse on the ground and shouldn't be misused

^ What lost said

Oh and purits do your research. Or come out with me for one shift. I currently have 4 burglaries in my tray and am single handedly investigating every single one, in between going to emergency calls. So thanks for that.

Lost - I did actually post the information from the CAB about what constitutes harassment etc earlier on in the thread.

And as far as prosecution goes, my attitude was kind of one with the polices of time and money to pursue. Getting the CCTV evidence of her behaviour, getting witness statements from people in the supermarket (staff) etc etc. As they'd traced the car (which okay to be fair I only ASSUME is her partners) I thought (wrongly) that they could have approached them with regards to potential dangerous driving and the passengers verbal assault.

And no OP that would make no difference.

I went to pull into the supermarket, a car came around the round about, not indicating. I braked and in frustration, threw my hands up.

Did you pull out in front of her on a roundabout? Who had right of way? Sorry don't understand from above? If someone isn't indicating I was always taught not to pull out until their intentions are clear.

There was no need for the rage, further involvement from either of you, and subsequently wasting police time, just trying to workout what triggered the whole sorry incident.

They were coming around the roundabout, no indicator on and looked like they were getting off at previous turning, I went to go and then they turned and came towards supermarket. I stopped again, possibly ever so slightly over the give way lines, and threw my hands up as I said to my friend "funny how these brand new expensive Mercedes don't have indicators on them!"
And then turned into the supermarket AFTER them. They stopped abruptly in the road in front of me, leading to me having to stop my car, at which point the woman came around to the driver side window and started the shouting, swearing and insulting.

Also, ffs I'm sick of people saying waste police time. This is Mumsnet where "ring 101!" is said for everything and anything. Yet I ring it because I've been verbally assaulted, had my child scared that we are going to be attacked and upset that she heard such horrible things whilst in the car and THEN approached face to face AGAIN inside the supermarket to further rant and rave and scare my child and make me wonder whether she was going to punch me with my son in my arms... and I'm wrong.

I'm sorry I was scared. I'm sorry I was worried for myself and my children. I'm sorry I did what I thought was the right thing by reporting it. I'm sorry that I am upset and frustrated that this kind of behaviour is just something that I should expect.

as a minimum the car should traced and the owner made aware there is CCTV evidence etc to give the woman a good shake up

The police don't go round to the homes of women to give them a good 'shake up' on the basis of an unsubstantiated allegation. If the police had enough resources they might look for her and if found invite her to respond to the allegation that she had shouted and sworn at the op. The woman would almost certainly counter claim that the op had sworn and shouted at her. What are the police supposed to do then?

It's not even like I was going to go after a prosecution
Why would the police investigate such an allegation when the 'victim' (quotation marks used because some people are offended by the term)has no interest in supporting a prosecution?

having a talking to from the police
The police don't go round giving adults a 'talking to' after a heated supermarket argument. Can you imagine the resources the police would need if they did?

One incident at a supermarket does not constitute harassment, harassment is an ongoing pattern of behaviour.

Of course it's upsetting. But thousands of arguments happen every day, between members of the public.

Getting the CCTV evidence of her behaviour, getting witness statements from people in the supermarket (staff) etc etc. As they'd traced the car (which okay to be fair I only ASSUME is her partners) I thought (wrongly) that they could have approached them with regards to potential dangerous driving and the passengers verbal assault

Have you any idea, how long this would take? And what serious crimes you would be diverting officers from, whilst they did this?

Just chalk it up to experience. You threw your hands up aggressively. You started to photograph their car. They responded aggressively. As some people will.

The Police don't have the time or resources, to send Officers out to minor altercations such as these.

Sorry! I'm not trying to labour the point! My phone sent it twice, promise!

If she does this again to someone and causes an accident or gets violent, the car etc is known to the police so they can compile more evidence against her.

All to be recorded in the mythical 'log' that mumsnetters believe is kept by the phone in each police station and is used to record people looking 'a bit shifty' in the street or children's footballs coming over the fence.

What crime do you think has been committed? How would you go about proving you were the injured party and not the instigator?

Husky I did say that I understood all of that would take time and effort and that they had told me they'd traced the owner of the vehicle etc and if they'd have been able to speak to them , even if they bloody denied it, might have made them think twice about doing it again. Rather than making the police track down all the other information to be able to pursue some form of conviction in the "he said/she said" manner of things given there's no way of proving the verbal.

Boys - I was told BY THE POLICE OFFICER that they had logged the incident and that it was associated and forever would be with that car and the number plate. Maybe the police lied to me.

Screenshot of public order act attached by the way with regards to legality of what she did.

"Section 7 defines a course of conduct as being on at least two occasions."

"the courts have ruled that it is not just the number of incidents which make up a course of conduct, but whether those incidents could be said to be so connected in type and context as to justify the conclusion that they could amount to a course of conduct (see Lau v DPP [2000] Crim. L.R. 580 and R v Patel [2005] 1 Cr. App. 27)."

"The PHA (Protection from Harassment Act) does not specify what period of time should elapse between occasions. Arguably, therefore, so long as the behaviour complained of ceased, even for a short period of time, and then resumed either in the same or a different form, this can form a course of conduct."
From CPS.GOV.UK

One protracted argument does not constitute 'two occasions' or a 'course of conduct', op your incident was clearly one occasion and does not, therefore fall under the Protection from Harassment Act. What happened to you falls under Sec 5 of Public Order Act - alarm harassment or distress.

Sec 5 Public Order Act is only punishable by a fine, it is considered a fairly low level offence.

duck Yes the incident you reported will be recorded on the command and control centre as are all incidents that the police are informed about.

But I highly highly doubt any of this minor incident will be passed to PNC or ANPR for the data to be logged on their system as that is usually for drugs, serious crime, outstanding suspects etc. Not arguments with passengers of vehicles.

I am sure it was not a nice experience for you... bit really I don't think this is a police matter. If the police dealt with everyone that was a rude twat to someone then they wouldn't ever do any serious police work. I am not condoning her actions, but I think relatively this is a minor altercation and you need to just move on. She sounds awful but the police aren't going to do anything.

I'm sorry OP. A middle aged man did shouted and swore at me for a good 30 seconds a couple of weeks ago. It really scared me. I'm in my twenties but look much younger so he easily couldn't have been doing it to an 17 year old but he didn't care. He had kids with him too! Arseholes of the roads.

The police wouldn't act when a colleague and I were repeatedly sent very threatening texts and emails by an ex-client with MH issues and a history of violence. They logged the incidents though, in case things escalated, so that there was a record of it all.

Although I wasn't happy, I entirely accepted that they are inadequately resourced and that they have to prioritise more serious matters.

The client was sectioned a few weeks later, just a couple of hours after the last threatening text she sent me, when she attacked her former CPN in the MH team's car park. Thankfully, the CPN wasn't hurt, but she was very shaken and upset.

There might be a counter complaint about someone driving without due care and attention. Hopefully the police won't have the resources to investigate that too.

That is a good point actually. Op, don't rely on indicators or lack of on a roundabout. You were in the wrong by not giving way to traffic already on the roundabout and pulling out in front of them. You should probably have said sorry rather than throwing your hands up!

You're missing my point.... i have read the thread and I don't need to make my reverse thread "better" who cares what my reverse says, my story can be anything we weren't there so no-one actually knows what went on...... neither do the police....

I didn't pull out in front of them. I barely moved my vehicle before realising that their intention was to come around and in front of me, thus me stopping. I didn't get in their way nor pull in front of them. I never rely on people using their indicators on roundabouts or anywhere else for that matter.

If anticipating another drivers intention when not following the Highway Code is driving without due care and attention then blow me down.

I'd like to reiterate that I did not pull out in front of them, I was at a roundabout, I was waiting to go, I went to go (as in foot off break, on accelerator and clutch coming up) as I realised they were coming around and I stopped (foot on break and clutch down) at which point I threw my hand up and exclaimed to my friend about indicators not being installed on posh new cars.

Not sure how they'd have been able to stop in front of me if I'd have pulled in front of them.

I gave way on the roundabout. I was exasperated at people not using indicators when they should be used, as I always am and as most normal people are.

I am relieved and in fact very happy that the police batted away this kind of silly nonsense.