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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

Are you a feminist?

999 replies

NoLoveofMine · 06/08/2017 02:03

Yes or no...

OP posts:
JacquesHammer · 07/08/2017 15:49

I believe feminism is for middle class women who are still upset Daddy didn't buy them a pony when they were 8. They ride rough shod over the backs of the working class women and not two fucks are given to how much worse we have it in life, let alone BME women and their problems

My parents were both feminists.

get that promotion?- patriarchy You do realise that this isn't quite how it works. Didn't get a promotion because you weren't the best candidate = acceptable. Didn't get a promotion because you're a woman = not acceptable. I got told not to go for a role in sports journalism because "they won't hire a woman love so don't bother"

Poor choice in life partner? Don't know. Not made one. Both my ex-husband and current partner are feminists and advocates/involved in programmes for encouraging women into STEM*

Not happy or fulfilled? -patriarchy Well that depends - if you're not happy/fulfilled because of opportunities denied to you because youre a woman......

I must admit I find your diatribes hard to read but my GOD the overreaching impression is you really hate women

CherryChasingDotMuncher · 07/08/2017 15:49

mum

I understand consent a lot better than you. Do you think that women automatically consent to condoms being removed at the man's discretion, without her knowledge? If so, then how is it different if she chooses not to take the pill? Both would be decisions that one of the couple has made based on their personal preference, no?

CherryChasingDotMuncher · 07/08/2017 15:50

You seem incapable of actually reading my posts where I stated my position several times on removing condoms

But you haven't!! You haven't stated your point once!

ANewAlias · 07/08/2017 15:52

BertrandRussell

@But I can't really comment until you tell me what feminism "now means to the majority of people".

I can't say with any form of authority. What I can do is note the statistics which say that most people don't like the label feminist but do believe in equality of the sexes. Even the most dimwitted (and I don't count you among them) must understand that such a disparity means that (working backwards) most people don't agree that feminism = equality.

Mumof56 · 07/08/2017 15:53

@cherry But you haven't!! You haven't stated your point once!

ok dear

(I have, the last time 1 page ago)

BertrandRussell · 07/08/2017 15:53

If a woman lies about being on the pill there may be a pregnancy which the man may or may not want, but which he may be oblged to contribute financially to. The pregnancy will have no physical effect on the man and he can prevent this happening by using a condom.

If a man lies about using a condom there may be a pregnancy which the woman will have to deal with either by carrying a baby or by having an abortion. Both of which can have huge physical and psychological effects. She is also exposed potentially to STIs.

SophoclesTheFox · 07/08/2017 15:53

I also await with baited breath the rush of posters who don't want to be known as feminists, but who must surely now be keen to distance themselves from the anger, bitterness and general not being niceness of freddy's post?

Because if the reason women don't like feminists is because we're mean...and nobody likes a mean girl...and being angry is bad...and sweeping statements aren't fair...

then what?

Also, funnily enough, I actually blame feminism and not Teh Patriarchy for my bad first marriage to a total bellend. It was my feminism that made me think it wouldn't matter if he was a layabout, because I had a good career. Damn you, feminism. You were wrong there.

CherryChasingDotMuncher · 07/08/2017 15:55

I think if you asked every who identified as a feminist to say what feminism means to them, you'd get an endless variation of answers. Like people of faith, what their faith means to one person is not what it'll mean to another. It may not be the dictionary definition, but don't get too hung up on that as the dictionary is only allowed one definition which usually encompasses everyone's beliefs as best it can

CherryChasingDotMuncher · 07/08/2017 15:57

mum you have not answered what I have asked several times - do you think it is ok and consensual if a man secretly removes his condom before intercourse with a woman? Because your posts suggest you do.

BertrandRussell · 07/08/2017 15:58

And I have to say that the misogynist media have done a bloody good job at deriding feminism. I am old enough to remember them doing a similar job on "woman's lib", with the bra burning myth and so on......

Freddystarshamster · 07/08/2017 15:58

Just like you're all so keen to distance yourself from merchants post about me having a breakdown? Not one comment there. I'm sorry I'll go back to knowing my place. Can't have the commoners getting too uppity now can we?

Mumof56 · 07/08/2017 16:01

herryChasingDotMuncher

mum you have not answered what I have asked several times - do you think it is ok and consensual if a man secretly removes his condom before intercourse with a woman? Because your posts suggest you do."

i'll just copy and paste from my last post, especially for you

Both (either lying about condoms or taking the pill) are both dreadful deceits that remove the consent given

Now in what way does that suggest I do?

Original poster
NoLoveofMine · 07/08/2017 16:01

The most active feminist group near me is a working class, BAME women's group who do a huge amount of work locally and beyond. I've chatted with some of them a few times, they're magnificent.

OP posts:
CherryChasingDotMuncher · 07/08/2017 16:02

So you agree removing a condom in secret is rape?

Can you explain how a woman not taking the pill is rape please?

Mumof56 · 07/08/2017 16:03

*@ cherry

Auto correct I'm not sure what it did to your name there in my last post

Mumof56 · 07/08/2017 16:04

@cherry

It removes consent. What is sex without consent?

Original poster
NoLoveofMine · 07/08/2017 16:05

I think if you asked every who identified as a feminist to say what feminism means to them, you'd get an endless variation of answers

Indeed Cherry. I became a feminist at 14 due to male violence (to someone else who was the same age but the impact was significant) but have continued to learn and there are many reasons for it, with that the most important to me personally.

OP posts:
CherryChasingDotMuncher · 07/08/2017 16:06

The definition of rape is forced penetration with a penis. It is not rape to lie about taking the pill. It's deplorable, but it's not rape.

The fact that you equate actual rape with a woman lying about taking the pill, speaks volumes about how you see women's bodies as not really that important.

DioneTheDiabolist · 07/08/2017 16:07

I find RL feminism so much more inclusive, productive and kinder to women than online feminism OP.Smile

CherryChasingDotMuncher · 07/08/2017 16:07

And it does not remove consent. It removes the agreement that a woman would take precautions to not become pregnant. That is not the same as consent at the point of sexual contact.

Mumof56 · 07/08/2017 16:07

@cherry

please show me where I have used the term rape

You won't because I haven't. Stop making stuff up, it's making you look deluded.

Mumof56 · 07/08/2017 16:09

@Today 16:07 CherryChasingDotMuncher

And it does not remove consent. It removes the agreement that a woman would take precautions to not become pregnant. That is not the same as consent at the point of sexual contact.

It doesn't remove consent it just removes the agreement

Confused You really don't understand consent, do you?

CherryChasingDotMuncher · 07/08/2017 16:10

Jesus wept mum

You said (on me asking if you think not taking the pill is rape):

It removes consent. What is sex without consent?

Is the answer not 'rape'?

Ergo, you said you believed not taking the pill removed consent. Therefore is rape. Some fucking good mental gymnastics you got going on there.

SophoclesTheFox · 07/08/2017 16:11

I didn't pick up on Merchant's off-handed comment to you freddy, because I don't think a one off comment is the same as writing off an entire political movement as supremacist and making extremely unpleasant remarks about feminists being losers. Her comment was directly to you as a result of an exchange you were having. Yours was to all feminists, everywhere as a result of...well, I don't know what. But you seem pretty angry about it. They seem different to me - obviously not to you though.

CherryChasingDotMuncher · 07/08/2017 16:12

Are you shitting me right now mum? You are the one who can't decide what consent is. I've explained it very clearly.

Are you a feminist?