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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

to have said she's raising psychopaths.

568 replies

OohMavis · 05/08/2017 19:22

My friend and I have fallen out.

She has zero empathy for any type of animal or living thing other than herself and her children, basically. I find that utterly baffling and quite upsetting, and I don't think I'm unreasonable in that respect, but I might have overstepped a mark a bit by saying this, and I want some opinions.

She was here yesterday with her two children so our children could play together. They were playing in the garden, we were sitting out with them, chatting. DD came running to me, excited, saying she'd found a really big beetle, asking for me to come and see. She's 3 and obsessed with mini beasts. My friend's children overheard and came to see too. They ran ahead of me and my friend followed behind, by the time we'd arrived her son had STOMPED on this beautiful stag beetle (I think) and killed it Angry

DD was so fucking upset. Honestly, it was just such an unecessary thing to do. The kid is 7. It's inexcusable. I reacted, raised my voice a bit and said "Why did you do that?!" he just laughed and said he wanted to stand on it. I said that's a really nasty thing to do. Then bent down to see if he'd 'popped its head off'. He had, he was quite pleased with himself. His mother said nothing, I looked at her for a response and got a half-shrug.

DD was in tears by this point so I took her back to where we were sitting and friend joined me. I was comforting DD. She said, "I think they get it from me, they just don't like animals"
I replied, "well that's fine but they shouldn't kill them"
"Well it's not like it was a cat or something"
And this is where I got a bit angry and said "yes well it starts off that way doesn't it, with that attitude you're raising two psycopaths"

She was obviously offended. Sat there for twenty more minutes with a look on her face before making an excuse and leaving, awkwardly. Got a text later saying she thought I was completely out of order calling her kids psycopaths, kids step on insects and I'm overreacting. I didn't reply. She texted again telling me I'm a hypocrite since I'm not even vegetarian Hmm and she doesn't think she'll be coming again.

WIBU to mention the word psychopath. I was angry, it may have been over the top, but I still think it.

OP posts:
RB68 · 05/08/2017 20:27

Aren't stag beetles protected?

FlyingFox95 · 05/08/2017 20:28

I can think of a list of other things to call him that would get the point across

PoorYorick · 05/08/2017 20:28

They are protected, yes.

littlebird77 · 05/08/2017 20:29

I am a strict veggie and I can not ever condone killing a small creature for pleasure, and would be very sad to see any child doing so...
Your friend should have explained the value of life at that moment and she didn't, so I am not surprised you were angry.

However calling a child any name is really not good, and if you had felt comfortable using that term you wouldn't be on MN now. If it were me I would be sending a text back saying your choice of words were not ideal(with or without an apology) however you were/are so upset that this has happened in your home. Hopefully she will apologise and you can move on past beetle gate and she will no better next time Wink

littlebird77 · 05/08/2017 20:29

no - know

PoorYorick · 05/08/2017 20:31

If using the word 'psychopath' was wrong (and in this context I don't believe it was), it pales in comparison with what happened to provoke it.

FoodArtFreak · 05/08/2017 20:31

Psychopath comment was OTT (not that I don't agree in theory) but I don't think there's any shock to her taking offence to it and the friendship being ended there.

Honestly we've all stepped on spiders on purpose or swatted a wasp... the worrying thing is that something that was non threatening and bringing happiness to someone else in its own environment is what he wanted to kill. He had no fear of it... just wanted to squish it for giggles. Her not addressing that behaviour is worrying.

If my DS stomped on something he was panicking about... I wouldn't be concerned (if an insect) but if he chose to for enjoyment... I would be rather upset

It's sad the friendship wasn't able to last long enough for OP to help her friend see this, but calling someone's snowflake a psychopath isn't likely to make them want to listen much further

NiteFlights · 05/08/2017 20:32

YANBU OP.

Psychopath is a strong word and it sounds as though you succeeded in getting across to the mother, who in the past has dismissed your concerns (e.g. re the pigeon), just how wrong you found both her child's and her own behaviour.

I don't think you should apologise. She wants to think her child's behaviour is okay - it clearly isn't - and she doesn't want to be challenged on her views. If you apologise you enable her to think it's all okay.

You did the right thing. I am sorry you and your daughter had such an unpleasant experience.

OverTheHammer · 05/08/2017 20:33

Yanbu her and her psycho kids sound like twats. You're well rid, you don't want twats like that around your kids.

From a fellow animal lover and proud vegetarian

PoorYorick · 05/08/2017 20:34

I don't think you can make someone listen when they have that little regard for life. All you can do is let them know just how low you think it is, and make it clear people like that are not welcome in your home.

And do let her know stag beetles are protected, even if they aren't cute and furry with big eyes. As for not rescuing the pigeon or putting it out of its misery, and letting the kids watch...dear God, that's monstrous. The thing that is supposed to elevate us humans above other animal life is our ability to reason and show compassion and act in a way that doesn't necessarily benefit us, not to be ruled entirely by instinct.

Supposedly.

Original poster
OohMavis · 05/08/2017 20:34

Mending things isn't an option for me, I don't think we, or our children, are compatible as friends. If that makes me a dickhead I'm ok with that at this point to be honest.

OP posts:
DandySeaLioness · 05/08/2017 20:35

reading your post made me feel all queasy inside. What a nasty little brat. Well done for showing your daughter that this is no way to treat a living thing, no matter if it's a beetle, a cat or a human. The psychopaths comment was spot on Grin

PoorYorick · 05/08/2017 20:36

It doesn't make you a dickhead and if it does, better a dickhead than a sadist or a psychopath.

SpikeGilesSandwich · 05/08/2017 20:36

Little psychopaths sounds about right to me, that's disgusting behaviour and your friend should be ashamed of herself for thinking it was acceptable.

Painfulpain · 05/08/2017 20:37

I cut off a friend dead, for her families attitude to animals. I'd known her for 10 years. I just find it repulsive and not something I am ok with. I wouldn't worry about whether she is offended or not. Stay well clear.

Bluepansies · 05/08/2017 20:39

Stag beetles are a protected species. Personally I wouldn't mourn the loss of this friendship, they sound like awful people.

barkinginessex · 05/08/2017 20:41

I agree with you, children should be taught empathy and compassion to all creatures, no matter how big or small. I doubt you'll be able to salvage your relationship but at least your DD won't learn any poor behaviour from her kids.

Serialweightwatcher · 05/08/2017 20:41

It is a harsh word, however lots of psychopaths start off enjoying hurting living creatures so who knows? I would have gone mad if my children had ever hurt anything purposely, particularly if they enjoyed it - I think you've given her food for thought though and she needs to stop being wishy washy and teach them decency and kindness

FlyingFox95 · 05/08/2017 20:41

Sounds like a little shit. I wouldn't give them a second thought OP.

Efferlunt · 05/08/2017 20:42

I would be disturbed by what he did too, and the fact that his parent clearly isn't concerned is awful. Hope this will shock her into changing her behaviour but she sounds like she has very little empathy sadly

Awwlookatmybabyspider · 05/08/2017 20:43

YANBU. As an animal/creature lover. I find it completely incomprehensible how anyone could dislike and hurt them, and get joy from it. Her kid is a psychopath and she's an even bigger psychopath for egging him on.
I mean what will he be doing in a few setting fire to puppies. Sounds extreme, but That's what it could lead to.
You're well shut of this cruel woman. You don't want yourself and your dd around her or her children.
I actually feel sorry for her children.
They're clearly not being given any guidance or parenting.

LoyaltyAndLobster · 05/08/2017 20:43

YANBU

MyWhatICallNameChange · 05/08/2017 20:44

Fuck off with the "he's a boy" comments and even "it's what kids do" I've managed to raise 5 boys and none of them have deliberately killed an animal. They would be absolutely appalled if anyone did something like that - and actually one of my sons was very upset when his friend found a birds nest in a bush, pulled it out and stamped on the eggs. I definitely thought he was a psychopath in the making.

neveradullmoment99 · 05/08/2017 20:45

I think the psychopath comment was a bit much but..
She needs to teach her children respect for living things.
There is no excuse for allowing this behaviour.
Maybe it will make her think twice about how she is raising her children.

Scaredycat3000 · 05/08/2017 20:46

Nasty little shit, got no hope with a bitch of a mother like that. Can I come and sit on the dickhead bench with you please Mavis, I've been branded too for not ignoring my niece attack my DCs for years, DS2 wasn't even 6 months old when she started, MIL is training up her own replacement Confused