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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

to have said she's raising psychopaths.

568 replies

OohMavis · 05/08/2017 19:22

My friend and I have fallen out.

She has zero empathy for any type of animal or living thing other than herself and her children, basically. I find that utterly baffling and quite upsetting, and I don't think I'm unreasonable in that respect, but I might have overstepped a mark a bit by saying this, and I want some opinions.

She was here yesterday with her two children so our children could play together. They were playing in the garden, we were sitting out with them, chatting. DD came running to me, excited, saying she'd found a really big beetle, asking for me to come and see. She's 3 and obsessed with mini beasts. My friend's children overheard and came to see too. They ran ahead of me and my friend followed behind, by the time we'd arrived her son had STOMPED on this beautiful stag beetle (I think) and killed it Angry

DD was so fucking upset. Honestly, it was just such an unecessary thing to do. The kid is 7. It's inexcusable. I reacted, raised my voice a bit and said "Why did you do that?!" he just laughed and said he wanted to stand on it. I said that's a really nasty thing to do. Then bent down to see if he'd 'popped its head off'. He had, he was quite pleased with himself. His mother said nothing, I looked at her for a response and got a half-shrug.

DD was in tears by this point so I took her back to where we were sitting and friend joined me. I was comforting DD. She said, "I think they get it from me, they just don't like animals"
I replied, "well that's fine but they shouldn't kill them"
"Well it's not like it was a cat or something"
And this is where I got a bit angry and said "yes well it starts off that way doesn't it, with that attitude you're raising two psycopaths"

She was obviously offended. Sat there for twenty more minutes with a look on her face before making an excuse and leaving, awkwardly. Got a text later saying she thought I was completely out of order calling her kids psycopaths, kids step on insects and I'm overreacting. I didn't reply. She texted again telling me I'm a hypocrite since I'm not even vegetarian Hmm and she doesn't think she'll be coming again.

WIBU to mention the word psychopath. I was angry, it may have been over the top, but I still think it.

OP posts:
Icewindfire98 · 09/08/2017 03:49

Op just text your friend the link to this thread.
Her behaviour wasn't ok. Your dd was upset and her son was unnecessarily violent.
Def you are better off without them.

Collidascope · 09/08/2017 07:11

Your friend ought to have told her son off, both for squashing the beetle for the fun of seeing it die and for upsetting your daughter who was excited about it.
I think it's interesting though, OP, that you say you recently stopped being vegetarian and feel guilty about that. I think in this country we have some really contradictory ideas about animal rights. People are quick to see the horror of animals dying when it comes to hunting or whatnot (Cecil...), but they're less keen on seeing the horror of animals dying when it comes to them having their burger for tea. Of course you can argue that taking actual pleasure in something dying is evil, but I think an awful lot of evil also happens because people are too selfish and too passive to stand against things that they know really are wrong but are too convenient for them to give up.

Original poster
OohMavis · 09/08/2017 09:59

Well I have to say, I don't even feel a bit bad anymore.

This morning she texted me telling me I can go fuck myself, her kids might be a louder than mine but that doesn't make me a better mother, at least they know how to play. Oh, and that my son will turn out to be soft in the head and a 'bit gay'.

Not the full gay, no no. Just a bit Grin

All's well that ends well!

OP posts:
Original poster
OohMavis · 09/08/2017 10:04

She sent another text after her first one, asking me if I was ignoring her. I sent her one yesterday saying that I think it's best if we don't see eachother anymore, don't think we're really compatible as friends. That ^ text was in response to that.

OP posts:
Original poster
OohMavis · 09/08/2017 10:06

It's a shame because the kids got on really well before they started school, and I found her much more reasonable then too.

OP posts:
StrangeLookingParasite · 09/08/2017 10:09

But I'm afraid the extremism on this thread is extremely worrying and ironic considering how much the UK taxpayer has been paying out every year to kill people in Afghanistan, Iraq and Libya.

Nice straw man. How utterly irrelevant.

And OohMavis, I think you are very well shot of her, she sounds amazingly unpleasant. 'A bit louder' - is that what you call taking pleasure in killing things? Ugh.

PoorYorick · 09/08/2017 10:34

Goodness, imagine a woman who doesn't care about the suffering of living beings turning out to be an anti-social, potty mouthed dickhead. I just cannot contain my surprise.

PoorYorick · 09/08/2017 10:35

I forgot "homophobic " too. Unless gay people also don't count as living beings.

RiverTam · 09/08/2017 11:16

Well well well, what a surpriseGrin.

BlatheringOn · 09/08/2017 11:43

Ooh Mavis, fwiw you've got my full support. She is a nasty woman. I sincerely hope her kids turn out better.

BattleaxeGalactica · 09/08/2017 12:11

Her definition of 'playing' is loose to say the least.

In an ideal world I'd be tempted to text back and tell her I'd take gay over psychopathic any day of the week but there's no point in going head to head with people like that. Just count it as a lucky escape, OP.

LaContessaDiPlump · 09/08/2017 12:40

Shock Not a 'bit' gay! They are the worst kind!!

Hmm what a fucking idiot. You are well rid op!

OfficerVanHalen · 09/08/2017 13:04

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

OfficerVanHalen · 09/08/2017 13:06

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Gottagetmoving · 09/08/2017 13:18

I don't think you should have said that, no.
You could have said you think it's sad that she wasn't teaching her kids to be kind and respect the life of any creature. That would be a fair comment and your opinion.
I think lots of children do kill insects and may even like to do it but it doesn't mean they will be a psychopath.

PoorYorick · 09/08/2017 13:20

I'd probably respond simply "Dear God" and leave it at that, although I know you should not respond at all.

Atenco · 09/08/2017 13:48

You are indeed well rid of her. She has a weird and horrible concept of manliness

Hygge · 09/08/2017 18:50

Grin A bit gay? Like, only gay at the weekends, or between four and seven on a Thursday?

Ignore her. You've obviously touched a nerve by mentioning the way she raises her children, but if she equates stamping things to death and laughing about their heads coming off as "knowing how to play" then there's something wrong with her.

Mayhemmumma · 09/08/2017 18:57

The child was wrong and did a horrible unnecessary thing. But he's a child who perhaps got a bit carried away. To insult his mum's parenting and him in front of all the children really wasn't on. You should apologies for your choice of words. And won't it make it unpleasant for the children in school together?

Coffeetasteslikeshit · 09/08/2017 22:58

I'm a bit late here, but I have at least finally read the whole thread and would like to say well done OP, you're well shot of her.

And for the record, my DS aged 12 was also disgusted by this boys behaviour. Come on folks, let's all teach our kids empathy.

EugenesAxe · 10/08/2017 00:53

YANBU. I think a 7 year old should have the moral compass to be responsible for this behaviour, personally. I have one - a few months after turning 7 we were out at a local tourist destination and he picked a dandelion for me and said "I nearly picked a daffodil but I knew it would make you cross".

OK, DS has got these morals because I get a bit militant about things like that, but the point is that by 7 I would expect every child to have received enough social guidance from somewhere - home, school, society - to make this call between right and wrong achievable. It pisses me off when people absolve kids of behaviour like this 'because they're only 7' or whatever. I would stop a child of mine at 1 or 2 if they were doing something antisocial and societal rules can be learned that young.

Also she may have been picking her battles - arrrgggh! - I HATE that pathetic excuse for not correcting antisocial behaviour.

You can pick a battle about whether your kid goes out in his pyjamas because he refused to get dressed, or whether he has honey on his spaghetti - these experiments only affect him and letting him direct his path of discovery is healthy. You fight EVERY battle when not correcting the behaviour will, ultimately, send an incredibly destructive message to the child about their place in the physical and social world. This woman really sent a bad message.

LogicalPsycho · 10/08/2017 01:12

You do realise, do you, that in saying this you are equating your friend's son with such as Robert Thompson, Jon Venables, Mary Bell?

You do realise, that before they went on to murder children, Mary Bell strangled pigeons, and Robert Thomson attacked the family pets?

Wayfarersonbaby · 10/08/2017 01:24

Good for you, OP. A 7 year-old doing this and enjoying it has clearly not been taught any respect for living creatures. My DD similarly loves mini beasts and would have been horribly upset (in this rainy weather she keeps trying to relocate all the poor woodlice who trundle under our back door not realising they will dry out on the carpet....) As a smaller child we were very hot on disciplining any cruelty to insects or animals; we tell her that they are creatures just like her, and they just want to be left alone to enjoy their lives too. To my mind if your (ex)friend can shrug off her child killing a creature with enjoyment then she is teaching him a psychopathic trait: I would expect any mum to be a bit horrified by this even if she wasn't that fussed on creepy crawlies. And the overlooked aspect of this is that the boy killed the creature your DD found because he knew it would upset her, too - and that shows bullying tendencies and a delight in cruelty towards other children, too, not just insects. Horrible. You're well rid.

cambodianfoxhound · 10/08/2017 02:00

Thank you whoputthecatout - "they had a life and it was the only one they had - we should all think very hard before we deprive them of it". This brought a tear to my eye, the poor stag beetle. If only everyone thought like this, how different the world would be.

Expat38matt · 10/08/2017 02:05

We have a place we go too which has lots of lovely nature for my city kids including huge dragon flies
Recently friends came too with their bratty kid who is almost 8 and my DS is 4
I came across a dying dragon fly on the step and said oh no what happened
Bratty kid told me my DS had stamped on it
My DS was extremely upset by what he'd done- transpired bratty kid who my DS looks up too said he hated it and my DS should stamp on it
Obviously my DS shouldn't have done this but was following an older child that he (for some reason) wants to please. My DS was very distressed and sorry for what he had done and I know would never do something like that .
Point is it crossed my mind that bratty kid has a touch of the psycho in training and not for the first time. His dirty reaction to seeing a lovely dragon fly was to kill it. Thank god we didn't show him the newly hatched ducklings !!