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Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To think a double masectomy for a 13 yr old girl is child abuse

298 replies

AssignedMentalAtBirth · 28/07/2017 12:01

twitter.com/peepartist/status/890693730126188544

All the adults in this girl's life have failed her.

It's truly sickening

This is Texas, coming here soon

OP posts:
MyWhatICallNameChange · 28/07/2017 12:43

It's terrifying. I hated being a girl growing up, I was a boy. I went through puberty pretty early - my periods started at 10, I was wearing a bra at 9. I hated my breasts. They proved that I was a girl and in my mind I wasn't! If I'd had been asked if I wanted to get rid of them, have my periods stopped etc I would have said yes. Definitely yes.

Thankfully I was born in the 70s so I wasn't given that choice. I grew out of it. I can't say I like my breasts, I'm pretty indifferent to them, but they have done their job of feeding my children. And obviously having periods has meant I could have those children.

If I'd have been born now would I have been pushed into being transed? It's a scary thought. I'm a woman now, a heterosexual woman. What the hell would have happened to me if I'd have chosen mastectomy and puberty blockers and then realised I was actually a woman? It's awful to think there are kids out there that are going to come to realise it was just a phase, like it was for me. It may have been a long phase but it was still a phase.

Why is it so prevalent now? I know 0 people from my year at school who have changed gender. My oldest has a whole group of trans friends (he's gay, so they stick together, though even he has said he doesn't really understand it.)

Serialweightwatcher · 28/07/2017 12:44

I really do think the world's gone mad with 'rights' - surely no such procedure should be considered until someone is an adult

PovertyJetset · 28/07/2017 12:47

I just looked at the Instagram feed and it's horrific. Actual brutal. Not for the weak stomached.

TabascoToastie · 28/07/2017 12:49

Gosh I saw the subject heading and thought it was going to be about the breast cancer gene.

13 is ridiculous. I've known a fair few teens believe they were trans and come to the decision later in life that they were not. No one under 18 should be making permanent decisions, and I'm saying that as someone very pro-trans.

The TRA movement is abusive and has no connection to the millions of ordinary trans people.

VestalVirgin · 28/07/2017 12:49

What is wrong with these parents?

I don't think the parents are to blame, necessarily. I blame the parents of transed toddlers and pre-puberty children, but teens can go on tumblr and find all the nonsense there.

And from then on, all the "experts" will have told the parents their daughter will commit suicide if they don't allow her to have her breasts cut off.

Texas is really bad; they already had women complain about being made to share showers in prison with a male. So must have done the forcing women to be naked in front of (fully intact, bepenised males) bit for quite a while now, as I suppose the complains wouldn't happen immediately, and make it into newspaper articles even later.

I wouldn't be much surprised if parents were being forced to go along with the mastectomy and sterilization, or have their child taken away, in Texas. Though I don't know the way things work in the US (and whether there is any authority that can take away children from their families; they're so big about the rights of the individual patriarch), but it would totally be in keeping with other news one hears from there.

VestalVirgin · 28/07/2017 12:54

Gosh I saw the subject heading and thought it was going to be about the breast cancer gene.

The irony is, if that child had asked for a mastectomy because she found out she had the breast cancer gene and was scared, then she would have been denied the surgery.
Probably even at 25.

Adult women are denied sterilisations routinely, just on the off chance that they possibly might change their minds (even if they are 38 and have four children) but if a teen says she feels male, her reproductive organs are ruined without a second thought.

It is really horrible.

AssignedMentalAtBirth · 28/07/2017 12:56

Vestal
Texas is really bad; they already had women complain about being made to share showers in prison with a male.

In prison? Fuck. It's just a nightmare

OP posts:
BigDeskBob · 28/07/2017 12:58

Most of us don't like our bodies at one time or another. For girls, puberty is very often one of those times. Adults, especially doctors, know this, that's why this is wrong. We are allowing children to consent to something when they do not have the life experiences to know what they are consenting to.

I would say more about the fuckers who facilitate this shit, but I fear I would be banned.

Me too.

Cailleach666 · 28/07/2017 13:06

I feel there is a steady erosion of Christian values and helpless to do much about it.

I am glad that many "christian values" are being eroded.

Stoprightnowplease · 28/07/2017 13:07

I don't know what to say, how was this allowed? Do they have such vastly different child protection laws in America?

Sallystyle · 28/07/2017 13:08

Disgusting. That poor girl.

According to a new thread on Site Stuff we should have a place on MN to spread our hatred so others don't have to read it.

If people read this and still can't see why some of us have such a problem with the way this is all going then I guess they will never see it.

cuirderussie · 28/07/2017 13:09

Look at Jazz Jennings fgs - not even an adolescent.

isupposeitsverynice · 28/07/2017 13:13

Instagram is rife with teenage girls having their tits hacked off. It's depressing as hell. What really shocks me is that a lot of them undergo hysterectomy BEFORE mastectomy. And a grown woman can't get a sterilisation because she doesn't want more/any children? It's like a massive practical joke, only it's not at all funny.

FrancisCrawford · 28/07/2017 13:13

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

hackmum · 28/07/2017 13:15

That's so worrying. I wonder if she understands the implications - she will never have the body of a man or of a woman either. She won't be able to have children. Adult life is going to be difficult, to put it mildly.

Mumof56 · 28/07/2017 13:17

YANBU The doctors involved should be struck off immediately.

Mummyoflittledragon · 28/07/2017 13:18

Wtf. That child (born a girl) may have had a hysterectomy. Madness.

VestalVirgin · 28/07/2017 13:18

I don't know what to say, how was this allowed? Do they have such vastly different child protection laws in America?

Genderism is official government policy in Texas. If they have child protection laws, those laws are currently being interpreted to declare it "abuse" if parents want to prevent children from mutilating their healthy bodies for genderism purposes. Don't expect help to come from the government.

It's like a massive practical joke, only it's not at all funny.

Yeah. That sums it up.

Gileswithachainsaw · 28/07/2017 13:19

Is a hysterectomy even safe?

Given they are still growing?

What about the hormones eye wouldn't that affect hair growth and bone growth etc?

Women need hrt after then don't they?

Cocolepew · 28/07/2017 13:21

Thanks Vestal.

DioneTheDiabolist · 28/07/2017 13:22

Many girls to whom this is done are from Christian extremist families.
Can you provide your source for this Vestal? Shock

elevenclips · 28/07/2017 13:23

Whilst I generally disagree with radical surgery at such a young age, this person is clearly extremely happy with the results. If they want to marry a woman and become a father they can do this with donor sperm. In this particular case, I think it will turn out well but I do not think it should be commonplace due to the extreme changes teen minds/bodies have and the potential for irreversible harm to a confused person. This person doesn't seem confused though. They seem thrilled and happy.

Datun · 28/07/2017 13:23

The question I would like answered is this. Puberty blockers are the first stage of medicalisation, and they arrest the development of your sex characteristics.

So for a boy, his penis won't grow. (I'm not exactly sure how that looks with a girl, because I can't remember, and I only have sons).

The dea being that you don't go through the puberty of your sex, as that is irreversible. So they arrest the development and then give you cross sex hormones to encourage a puberty of the opposite sex.

And only after that will they perform surgery.

The question I would like answered is what else do puberty blockers suppress? Do they suppress any brain development? Serious question. I don't know if anyone can answer. Decision making skills?

This girl will have the genitalia of a prepubescent girl. Always. Unless she wants surgery. The surgery is useless, the new penis is non-functional unless a mechanism is attached to pump it to make an erection. (I skim read an article about steel rods, but couldn't finish it). Needless to say, very few women ever have genital surgery.

Jazz Jennings (now 17) a transgirl from the TV programme I am Jazz has been told that there is not enough penile material in his prepubescent penis to make a neovagina. It seemed to come as a surprise to him (which is another issue entirely).

He has the face of a girl, the body of a woman, through artificial hormones, and the genitals of a prepubescent boy.

He has little or no libido. I don't understand the science, but if your genitals don't develop, maybe your libido doesn't either. There's not enough material to make a neovagina, so they will have to use other parts of his body, traditionally the colon. They can't use the penis head to mimic the clitoris.

So his sexual function is compromised along with his libido (which could be a blessing, which ever way you look at it).

He would also have to dilate his neovagina regularly for the rest of his life because otherwise it would close as the body thinks it's a wound. He'll be on hormones for the rest of his life and is permanently sterile.

This decision was made when he was 11 years old. Furthermore, his family maintain that he made it.

He is the 'poster child of trans'.

Whether you believe in the trans-ideology or not, this is part of it. The notion that your body must be drastically changed, despite the negative fallout, to match your identity.

Instead of therapy.

Gender dysphoria is distressing.

I find it scandalous that funds (and there are a lot of funds), are not being immediately diverted, along with resources and research to find a cure.

Instead of promoting this in all our schools as a a normal part of life. To be accepted questioningly, and even celebrated.

ChiefClerkDrumknott · 28/07/2017 13:25

Mastectomies, hysterectomies, massive injections of unnecessary hormones Sad I can see this all backfiring on these poor kids in 15/20 years time (perhaps sooner). It really is the enforcing rigid gender roles and erasing gay people, isn't it? We've been banging on about this for a couple of years and now it's all coming true

VestalVirgin · 28/07/2017 13:28

I don't know whether hysterectomies on growing girls are safe, but I would rather guess that medicine doesn't have a fucking clue, because this was never done prior to this madness spreading. (And if, then only in girls who had cancer or something, so it had to be done regardless of impact on health)

Women need hrt after then don't they?

Only after the ovaries are removed, I think.

But the ovaries will have to be removed, as the testosterone will damage them.

They'll stay smaller, and they will become as hairy as men (the latter being intended, the former not so much), have an increased osteoporosis risk and suffer male-type hair loss.

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