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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

Charlie Gard 6

999 replies

CaveMum · 13/07/2017 10:10

New thread so that we can await this morning's hearing.

Let's try to keep this one as sensible and measured as the past 5 threads have been.

Fingers crossed that this can all be resolved today and that Charlie and his parents can find peace.

OP posts:
Thread gallery
8
flatbreads · 13/07/2017 14:38

I don't think that there are vile posts on here but not sure about the criticism of the parents, none of us know how we would act surrounded by people egging us on in the way the sister and CA clearly have been doing.

That said I would imagine MN are following all the threads very closely and they would be deleted if became too defamatory.

GabsAlot · 13/07/2017 14:38

*expertise

flatbreads · 13/07/2017 14:39

Lapin is this live now? GOSH counsel speaking?

OhUnpretentiousSpud · 13/07/2017 14:41

Gosh say they've tested about 1000 with mitochondrial diseases. CA getting upset because he 'only 1 of like 16 in world!' So they're lying apparently Hmm

Clearly they don't realise that there are many types of mitochondrial disease and GOSH are not referring solely to Charlie's type. The .CA are so apparently invested but yet clearly know nothing. Wow

OhUnpretentiousSpud · 13/07/2017 14:41

Treated*

drivinmecrazy · 13/07/2017 14:41

I'm maybe being a bit dim, certainly I am befuddled.
The tweets coming about GOSH court position statement, is Joshua quoting from a written submission while the live video evidence is being dealt with?

WankYouForTheMusic · 13/07/2017 14:41

Hmm. There have been some vile posts about sunglasses and the like, and I accept there's a discussion to be had about the donations. I don't actually mind them getting money myself, but can see how reasonable people would feel uneasy.

However, I think it's also legitimate to point out that however much one feels for the parents, they have also done some objectively awful things like defame medical practitioners, possibly contribute to the incitement of violence and invited pro-life filth into the UK (and I don't mean common or garden not keen on abortion types: the pastor and the lawyer are literal human excrement). And most importantly, that it doesn't appear their actions are in their son's best interests.

There is a balance to be struck. One can sympathise with things a person is going through whilst also objecting to some aspects of their conduct.

LapinR0se · 13/07/2017 14:41

GOSH court position statement: “GOSH will act in accordance with Charlie’s best interests and its duty of care to him…”

Sluttybartfast · 13/07/2017 14:41

flatbreads these are from GOSH'S written position statement. Rozenberg now has a copy of the position statements submitted by both sides. Armstrong is currently questioning the NY doctor via video link.

Laiste · 13/07/2017 14:41

twitter.com/JoshuaRozenberg?ref_src=twsrc%5Egoogle%7Ctwcamp%5Eserp%7Ctwgr%5Eauthor

Joshua Rozenberg tweeting live from court.
(in case earlier links were missed)

bostonkremekrazy · 13/07/2017 14:42

My own experiences as a young person in ITU - ventilated on life support - is that it is confusing, scary, overwhelming, painful, and with the ventilator in a sore throat is very uncomfortable - I could not imagine it for months - weeks was difficult enough. The morphine itself made me so itchy, I could not communicate this to anyone - it was worse than the pain.

However, 'beyond experience' implies that little Charlie is unable to consider his surroundings, or feel anything due to his brain damage - the oramorph is being given 'just in case' as a kindness to keep him comfortable.

Bless little Charlie. May he find peace soon.

LapinR0se · 13/07/2017 14:42

GOSH: “It will continue to provide him with the highest quality of care … and to honour Charlie’s rights as his own, unique human being.”

GabsAlot · 13/07/2017 14:42

so coz hes growing that means hes well-CA

so stupid

BaldricksTrousers · 13/07/2017 14:42

Can anyone tell me if a the ventilator being used on Charlie is similar to the ventilators used for adults, as in, there is a tube that goes down the throat?

My father was on a ventilator in the last months of his life. I didn't get to see him for some time and when I didI could tell he was suffering. He was severely brain damaged and couldn't communicate, but the clues were in how his body responded. He couldn't sleep properly, he lost a tooth, he just looked tortured. I made the decision to have the tube removed and when it happenedthe look on his face was pure bliss and relief. A look that by all accounts he shouldn't have been able to make. But I saw it, and I will never forget it.

He fell into a deep sleep and died a day later. I am so glad I took him off the ventilator and only wish I'd been able to relieve him sooner. He had "friends" around him that wanted to leave him on for months longer, just in case!

SomeDyke · 13/07/2017 14:42

I think it is the written position statement from GOSH, that Joshua Rozenberg was tweeting the contents of??.........

Yes, position statements filed by various parties, Joshua quoting from them in his tweets. Not live oral testimony.

littlebrownbag · 13/07/2017 14:43

No, it's the written statement from GOSH which the press got after the lunch break. Joshua Rosenberg is reading and tweeting it while also listening to the expert witness

pasanda · 13/07/2017 14:44

The mice had their lives extended and there was evidence of the effectiveness of the nucleosides in their brain function.

That from the USA bod

Sirzy · 13/07/2017 14:45

I thought last week they said the treatment hadn't been tested on mice?

GinSoakedTwitchyPony · 13/07/2017 14:46

I thought the same, Sirzy. It said that in the letter from the Rome hospital.
Either someone is mistaken or they're not reporting this clearly enough.

pasanda · 13/07/2017 14:46

New evidence since April apparently

FreezerBird · 13/07/2017 14:46

It will be the same Baldricks - but obviously with a much tinier tube. DD has been ventilated several times for am after surgery and it can knacker her airway.

FreezerBird · 13/07/2017 14:46

for *and after surgery

pasanda · 13/07/2017 14:47

I think!

GabsAlot · 13/07/2017 14:47

gosh bing accusd of not caring for him but killing him

Gobbolinothewitchscat · 13/07/2017 14:47

I think the comments about the legal process etc should be allowed to stand. The comments about the parents should be deleted

I've been involved in two end of life cases - one involving a baby and one a teenager. Everyone on the legal side from the judge downwards will understand and - to a certain extent - expect this behaviour from the parents who are misguided but genuinely doing what they think is best for their son. I suspect there will be a general feeling that if acting like this helps the parents to cope, then the legal teams and court staff etc have broad enough shoulders to cope. I don't think perhaps it is understood just how,heated standard child welfare hearings which are not held publicly and are not dealing with withdrawal of lifesaving treatment can become on a day to day basis. This is not unusual but understandable