14 year old son wanted to go to a pride event today, DH says he was too young! Was he BU?

[ChangingThatName]

Is DH being unreasonable?

Our 14 year old asked me if we could go to a pride event today. My DH quickly interrupted with a 'definitely not' and tbh, I didn't see much of an issue with it, but then began to wonder. Is he a bit too young to go to a pride event? Was DH being unreasonable?

I confess I haven't read the full thread, but I echo those who say it depends on which city you're in. I took my six-year-old to Hampshire Pride earlier this year, and it was a fairly chilled out day.

Yes, there were trans* folk, drag queens, and a few people in leather/masks, and I braced myself for awkward questions, but on the whole a "that's what some people like to wear" was sufficient.

I think it's really important to show my daughter that she can use her privilege in a positive way to support others. She has recently decided that she'd "quite like to be lesbian" but I think that's because boys are yucky.

Thank you to the poster(s) discussing how straight people are 'taking up space' at LGBT+ events - it's an interesting learning point, and something I will consider if and when we go again. :)

SilentlyScreamingAgain

I agree with several of your points, however, I believe it's equally important for heterosexuals to be aware of issues within the LGBT+ communities and be able to signpost friends and family to relevant organisations who may be able to help. LGBT+ people, particularly young people, are usually in diverse friendship groups where the majority will identify as heterosexual - to remove knowledge of resources from heterosexual people can actually, and has done perviously, further isolate young LGBT+ populations - this is why sexual health charities tend to work on peer to peer education across all sexualities now for instance = they have realised the danger with limiting their knowledge and information just to specific groups of people.

I don't mind seeing the march limited to LGBT+ only, but I think the event itself should be inclusive and promote diversity and tolerance which it set out to do; that includes welcoming heterosexual people.

I have a gay young teen. None of us - siblings,parents,grandparents are the slightest bit bothered and as such said son is very comfortable with his sexuality.

I know how high depression etc is amongst gay teens and due to this I have played down the whole gay pride thing ie not steered him towards it. So far he has had no reason to think he should feel anything other than pride and I don't want him to start feeling he should feel crap about his sexuality. Don't think he is aware of how bad homophobia was here and is in some countries yet. No idea if this is a right/ wrong stance but there you go. You get zero advice anywhere re raising a gay child. Stonewall is crap.

Kigali04

Hi! Just wondering if you let your child go to any public event, as you know, you say there's a risk of child exploitation? Or do you just reserve comments like that for events where there's a majority LGBT+ attendance?

It has become a zero sum game. As I explained earlier, this year there was a limit of 26k people in the parade and not every LGBTQ* person who wanted to march, was able to because so many of those places were taken up by hertosexual people.

I think that this is something that Pride in London are planning to monitor. I take your point on the spaces in the parade being limited. I wonder if changes will be made in coming years when it comes to how the event is run, and how on earth this would be managed.

Have you sent your feedback to Pride in London?

As such depending on life experience I think 14 is too young.

It's not equally important for heterosexuals to be educated about issues that are pertinent only to the LGBTQ* community. It's nice but while resources are limited, they should be directed to those who need them most.

I remember years ago, some genius decided that all attendees at a conference needed to be issues with condoms suitable for penis in anus sex (they are thicker and more expensive than the regular ones). I'm not sure if the lesbians were more pissed off at the waste of resources or the gay man at being rationed so the lesbians could get their 'fair share'.

SilentlyScreamingAgain

Actually, it is equally important, because other wise we risk isolating vulnerable members of the LGBTQ+ communities - particularly those who are young and may only be accessing information via heterosexual peer groups.

This is well understood now within support services and why most of them are happy to promote their services and explain what support they can offer with anyone regardless of sexuality.

Is your DH scared he is going to 'catch the gay'?

Agree with your husband. Put the nature of the even aside. It's a red herring.

I'd maybe have told him I'd drop him off and pick him up as a compromise

I wonder if the op's DH said why he thought it was unreasonable?

If any support service feels a need to hand out their resources to not just dozens but hundreds of straight teenagers on the off chance the information lands in the lap of the single teenager in the UK who only receives information from his peer group, I think they are having targeting issues.

When that single gay teenager gets a bit older, would you advocate giving his large female support group testicular cancer checks, in the hope it would encourage him to turn up?

Silently I agree with many of points, although a couple seem to swing too far the other way as a reaction to what is happening.

The amount and type of people marching should reflect LGBT community, and not over run with bandwagon jumpers.

The charity stall struggling to get there messages out there is more difficult to address though.

Your comment about wanting straight people to see themselves as tourists for the day, and to respect, they are there to support through observance, is a good one.

I was sad and cross to read this when it popped up on FB page. I think becuase Hull is the city of culture this year commercialisation has taken over.

m.facebook.com/LoveFuelHull/posts/1549073671809448:0

Let me tell you a story..

One year I went on to Pride with a mate and her mum. The mum was straight, the daughter wasn't. The mum was there because she loved her daughter, was proud of her and wanted that message to be heard. She'd made a banner and everything. And whilst she thought it might be nice to be in the march itself so everyone watching, the majority straight crowds who often line the event, could see her message of support she felt it was far more important to be one of those people lining the event so every gay person marching, could see her message.

She wasn't remotely interested in giving her message, that it was possible to support, love and encourage a gay child, to straight people. She wanted that message to go to the gays marching. (I seem to recall she needed up being anointed by the Sisters of Perpetual Mercy but that's another story and a gay specific reference in case you're wondering.) One man came up her, hugged her and burst into tears because his parents didn't accept him and that message from her meant the world.

Some of you might not see the difference, some of you might think it's a daft anecdote to make a point but I think it perfectly encapsulates how to be an ally. Because we really do need allies. Still. This thread and some of the attitudes in it, proves that.

Her whole thinking was ‘what can I do to help?’. And she asked her daughter, and asked me too. Because we were gay and she wasn't and this was our day, not hers.

The tipping point argument is a perfect one to explain this. Is it helpful to the gay community for an event, or a club or a meeting or a space that is safe from all outside homophobia to become so inclusive that it loses its meaning?

Of course it's important that isolated gay people can bring straight friends for moral support to actually enter somewhere but when straight people decide they want to come to a gay space because they're an ally or it's great fun or a nice night out then you end up with a space that's so diluted that it becomes meaningless. It becomes a reflection of the outside world and every other club and whilst some of you might think that's just dandy, the notion of a space where it's not only ok to be yourself but you're also surrounded by others just like you is important.

Most of you who are white would understand this if we were talking about black spaces or black culture but it's different when it comes to the LGBT community.

I've mentioned this before on here but for lots of straight people there is an entitlement about Pride. A ‘I'm accepting and tolerant and therefore supportive, in return you must be grateful for that and give me a lanyard’. Most of the people who do that don't even realise it and all I'm asking is that you take a moment to think about how you can be an ally.

Now, the gays know that family is important and we have lots of straight allies and also we'd best not alienate them so most prides have family events. Look out for them, or go to Pride and look around and if you think the crowds or the events are mostly straight people then think about whether you're contributing to that and whether that's the right thing to do.

And yeah, inclusivity is a lovely idea and I'll totally embrace that society is fully inclusive when a day comes when not one crime report mentions homophobia, or the helplines fall silent. That day isn't coming any time soon.

Pride is pretty much a family event anyway so 14 is not too young. My ds went to his first pride at ten months.
Thebeast it's about identity not sex, plenty of gay parents take their kids because they enjoy celebrating their love for one another. The real judgement call op would be whether he was allowed to go alone because it does get very busy and there is a fair bit of drinking going on, going with him but keeping a low profile could have been a compromise?? Dh was unreasonable in my opinion because at 14 he should have discussed it with him properly and looked for a compromise.

I just can't understand how in 2017 being LGBT* is still such 'a thing' and causes so many problems. I blame Disney for ingraining heterosexuality in such a young age.

Pride belongs to the LGBT* and it's supporters, but it's everyone's job to make sure that children are getting healthy and inclusive messages from day one.

I don't agree with everything Silently writes, but she is correct in that Pride is probably the one day of the year that gay people + can safely hold hands and kiss in the street and I understand why she wants to protect that.

Freedom is the message surely that pride events want. That is part of this nation, but equally people are free to disaprove.

Good Lord, isn't it bad enough that Pride is riddled with heterosexuals without sending your children's along too? ...leave Pride to the gays. Please.

There's a guy (gay activist, Tom Daley's husband) on John Pienaar's politics show arguing exactly the opposite. (He reckons) The point of Pride is to celebrate diversity & so of course heteros should be welcome. He bemoaned that some Pride events were overwhelmingly gay white men. He said he goes to Pride events all over the world & gave a big thumbs up to the genuine diversity of the London event.

I don't want to get jumped on > but here goes.

On any other thread, if a 14yo boy said he wanted to go to a party with friends, where it would be 90% adults, a bar, a dance tent, copious amounts of alcohol, high levels of fun and excitability within the crowd, leather- clad submissives on leads, and quite a few almost naked adults dancing around them, the resounding answer would be Not a chance in hell.

I'm not sure why the cause of the celebration means it's guaranteed to be okay for young teens. Exploitation of minors is not purely a heterosexual problem, and we'd be naïve to presume it was.

That being said, I love Pride Weekend, and have attended with friends for years. DD1 now comes with me, DD2 I judge to be too young (younger than your DS).

Ironically my DS says he wouldn't go to Pride until he's left school. And he is gay. He just doesn't want to go there, be seen by somebody he knows and be subsequently Outed (he has Asperger's and has enough issues at school without giving people something else to single him out over).

Perhaps your DH, rightly or wrongly, thinks if people see him there, they'll presume DS to be gay?
That obviously says more about DH than it does about DS if so.

If I'm totally honest I was a bit freaked when I went - I am in no way homophobic but there were too many people with dog masks on leads. I'm with your dh.

Yes, exactly.

Say about heterosexual weddings what you want (and I certainly have a lot to say against the patriarchal origins and traditions of it all), but you don't usually see people advertising their BDSM fetishes there.

(There might be weddings like that, but I wouldn't go there and certainly not take any children!)

Sorry genuinely curious I feel people just don't read people's OP? The DS asked the OP if "we could go to a pride event" - where on earth does it mention him going on his own?

There's a guy (gay activist, Tom Daley's husband) on John Pienaar's politics show arguing exactly the opposite. (He reckons) The point of Pride is to celebrate diversity & so of course heteros should be welcome. He bemoaned that some Pride events were overwhelmingly gay white men. He said he goes to Pride events all over the world & gave a big thumbs up to the genuine diversity of the London event.

Mr Tom Daly is an excellent screen writer called, Dustin Lance Black, he wrote the screenplay for Milk, which is well worth seeing. He is, of course, entitled to his opinion but he very idea that the LGBTQ community needs straight people to be diverse is just strange. I mean, look at the length of that acronym, does anyone even know who or what the asterisk represents? Many things can be said about the LGBTQ community, but a lack of diversity isn't one of them.

If I'm totally honest I was a bit freaked when I went - I am in no way homophobic but there were too many people with dog masks on leads. I'm with your dh.

Totally agree.

Homosexuality has been normalised. Job done. No need advance this agenda any further.

Look. The men on dog leads. I get it. I really do. I can see how that would be a bit off putting. I mean, I hardly know where to look or whether to get out a dog biscuit or say hello.

But. And this is important.

It's not a show of how kinky gays can be, it's not done in a live your kink out loud kind of way. Well, it is, but it isn't.

Manchester Police's Operation Spanner back in 1987 (gay men getting arrested for engaging in BDSM) led to a House of Lords case which ruled that consent is not a legal defence, which means that essentially kink is illegal. Particularly gay kink because similar heterosexual cases have been allowed to use consent as a defence. The men arrested were sentenced for up to four years in prison.

This is still the case, legally. There have been ongoing legal battles on this issue for decades. It's still being reviewed by the European Court of Human Rights. And the gays are still fighting this.

Now, you might wonder why they feel a need to 'parade' themselves (your inflection, not mine) but my interpretation and speaking to some of those who do, their reason is that it's an important reminder and a political statement about the criminalisation of consensual sexual practices.

Like, homosexual sex used to be.

So, next time you see the boys on the leads with their rubber masks be grateful that they are there, they are still fighting and they are still making a statement. Because of them you can, if it's your thing, go home, read Fifty Shades and get your husband to give you a spanking, safe in the knowledge that you're probably not going to be prosecuted for it.

Homosexuality has been normalised. Job done. No need advance this agenda any further.

Homosexuality hasn't been normalised, it's been recognised by decent people to be normal.

Talking of decent people, are you aware of how offensive the phrase gay agenda is, did you almost use it by accident or were you being deliberately bigoted? If it's the former, can you tell me what you imagine this agenda to be?