to not want DF's autistic son at our wedding?

[majordilemma]

The whole day is just going to stress him out. Unfamiliar environment, crowded, noisy, totally out of routine.

DF and I feared he would have a meltdown and made the decision that he would not attend. MIL and BM are now making noises about the decision and DF is thinking about changing his mind.

I am really stressed out with this idea now. MIL can't handle him when he has an outburst and I don't want DF to be outside the venue for hours on end calming him down etc. Obviously his son would be very anxious all day as well.

Help!

Well if you post under AIBU you either realise thats a posibility, or you post elsewhere surely? The answer is as able to be yes as no to that title.

Apart from being able to use Makaton he sounds very similar to my son. Frighteningly so- my son spent a year refusing to get out of cars, (or go into various buildings). There are threads on it on here, so I fully understand the problems that particular challenging behaviour brings. I suspect I have better idea than most of what crawling around on the floor screaming actually means- and I agree that it would be entirely unreasonable and unfair to have that during the ceremony. None of the other behaviour mentioned is remotely unusual for a severely autistic child, it's just daily behaviour. I'm taking ds1 swimming tomorrow- we'll almost certainly have a to do where he wants to do something inappropriate (climb somewhere dangerous, walk in on someone in the shower etc) - and he'll repsond by kicking off, lying on the floor, hitting himself and screaming. But we don't stop going swimming, because he gets enjoyment out of it- even if the dealing with the whole affair is very difficult for him.

DF has to collect and deliver because the son won't allow anyone else to drive- not because the mum is being unreasonable- I already suggested that either she drives (presumably he allows her to drive), or that that behaviour is worked upon (really I do think that is something that needs to get tackled because it is way too restrictive- there may be time to do that before the wedding, maybe not). Most children attending special schools go by transport, so maybe even his escorts could be paid to bring him in a taxi. DS1 would love that (and probably the escorts would as well!). I see the DF needing to pick him up etc (becuase that's what he usually does) as something entirely work aroundable. Just one of lifes little challenges when dealing with autism.

op if you do come back are you american

well, as the mother of 2 autistic sons, i wouldnt be at all offended if someone thought of them and the things that set them off and cared enough to say they thought it might be too upsetting to them to be in a certain situation. it shows you care - and that you know them and understand them.

No I'm not American....why do you ask?

Came back to update and thank you all for your comments, thoughts and opinions. DF and I have spent most of the weekend thrashing things out and trying to come up with a workable solution.

Unfortunately its not all gone so well and I am at my parents house for now. It seems any option other than there for the day is what is being demanded by both MIL and his M and DF is so desperate to please and desperate for recognition he is a good father from them (me saying he is is apparently not enough).

It is interesting many of you are saying we should work with stretching his sons boundaries as this is what I have been saying for years with no avail. Son is not excluded form social situations, he excludes himself and his M has always been adament (and DF to a lesser extent) that allowing son to remain within his comfort zone and trying to maintain comfort zone has always been the way. DF has put off having a child with me for nearly 5 years as he is afraid it will upset son so much. His M (apparently) will not be having children with her new partner (incidentally he has 2 daughters who are only 'allowed' to visit there home when son is with us).

I have always been sure we would have a child and DF has always said we would have a child but this wedding arrangement debate seems to have brought everything to the surface. DF seems to think I would take our child to my parents on the occasions son was visiting...which honestly had never crossed my mind.

I know his son needs to expereince more social occasions but I do wonder why our wedding seems to be the occasion where M seems to think he should there.

I have given so much to our relationship and his son. I have said to DF that whatever he decides about son will be ok but I can't help feeling a tinge of resentment at the fact ex and MIL have more control over our wedding day than me. Despite everything DF still feels son would be better off not attending, and particularly the ceremony but just can't 'put his foot down' I suppose.

I've come to parents as need some space to think. I feel desperately ssick at the thought of our wedding day.....seems to symbolise all I will be sacrificing. Not sure what I want anymore.

My parents know something is up and I feel awful as they've spent thousands on this day. DF keeps trying to ring me........what a mess.

Its a month away - should I even marry this man?????????

oh dear

no just something about your posting style made me think you might be american

it sounds like you could all do with some professional input

in all areas

What a weekend - good that you have talked such a lot, even if you are not at peace.

The way you have described your df makes me see him as someone who is really caring. He is trying to accommodate everyone's views somehow - I hope he and you find a way out of this mess of wedding arrangements, as he really comes across as being a lovely man.

My gut feeling is that the responses of your MIL, DF and his ex towards his son could be prompted by guilt - not so much about the wedding but from years back. Guilt is a complex emotion and I don't think your DF, the ex or your MIL have recognised or dealt with it properly. I may be way off course, but in a very different way, I have seen something of this type of dynamics in my husband's side of the family.

I will watch this thread with interest - hope you get advice that clarifies things for you.

md, poor you. So hard and nnone of it your fault. I think it's really important you got to talk to him about when you have your own children with him and if it flushed out that topic it was worth all this coming about. Of course you can't take your new baby and other children when you have them away when his son visits. The son would have to get used to the new children which I'm sure could be worked out.

I think you should just agree that the son can be there and leave the lot of them to sort it out. Not your issue and if others see the son being noisy etc so what - it's these kinds of things which make family events interesting rather than some kind of fake perfect magazine type wedding from a TV film. Just laugh it off and have fun.

read your message again - have you considered this as a possibility:

Have the boy at your wedding. Your MIL, his mother, you and your fiance making it work somehow. Then hope that this special day with you all gathered together will have special significance for your fiance. It could show him that his son can go out of his comfort zone.

This could be a great lesson to learn. It could also benefit you a lot.

Seeing how a new family grouping can work, how things can be flexible, just might make your fiance feel better about you and him having a baby sooner rather than later.

I know there is absolutely no guarantee that this will happen, but it is just a thought.

TBH it all sounds awful. I can totally see all sides here nd I know you can too.

IMHO the MIL is totally out of order and is not being sensible at all, the ex is also being unreasonable and doesn't sound like she wants any compromise or to help things be easier for everyone.

Your poor Fiance feels totally caught in the middle, and it has brought up a load of other issues.

I would try to sit down with your fiance and try to discuss things rationally with him, if necessary have a mediator so you can talk without throwing words at each oother IYKWIM I am not saying you shouldn't marry him at all, but do try to get some pre wedding councelling which should help resolve the issues you have with him.

These won't resolve the issues of thw day, and I think although you are the bride and therefore are the most important person on the day, it sounds like you have to be the bigger peron here and allow your dream wedding to be a little different than you expect. If it means a wedding where you and DF spend most fo it apart - well so be it, you have 5 days of him to yourself!

Oh MD what a mess.
I think you have to now sit down and tell your DF that you will not be bullied in to having his son at the wedding because his stupid mother and ex see it as a way to cause problems,
I bet they are rubbing their hands together with glee that they have caused you problems, your DF needs the back bone to tell them that the two of you have arranged YOUR wedding and you did it around his son and what you thought was for the best and your wedding day IS NOT the day to try new boundaries for his son.
MIL cant look after him and his mother wont, they are being totally unreasonable.
Your much nicer then me because i would have told them ALL to piss off by now.
You and your DP seem to be better parents then this childs mother, as she and MIL seem to me to be using him as a tool to cause uset, not as a little boy with needs.

Put your foot down and have YOUR wedding.

ooooh So when M and MIL say he should attend - do they mean to the actual ceremony as well (barking barking barking if they do- and not fair on him at all, or you and DF).

Think you really need to sort out the siblings issue before marriage tbh. Your Df can't seriously expect you to take any child you have together to your parents every time his son comes to stay. That is mad. My son sounds really similar to your stepson to be - in terms of behaviours and severity (except that your stepson to be can use Makaton- ds1 uses PECS). Siblings are great for him. He doesn't interact that much with them (especially ds2 who put his nose severely out of joint when he turned up), but he does interact a little, bit and he no longer shudders when one of them touches him (!). He'll even let ds3 (aged 2) sit on his lap. Dealing with other children is part of life.

I do think autistic children need to be given opportunities- just always with an escape route. TBH I'd ask the mother how his safety is going to be ensured. She must realise that MIL can't cope with him, and that your DF is going to be otherwise occupied and unable to give him the 1:1 he needs, so who is going to do it? I do think whole day presence could work, providing there is someone next to him, 2 inches away from him, capable of dealing with any bouts of challening behaviours, and able to whisk him off out of the way at the first sign of trouble (then dip back in as soon as that's possible). Has there been any talk about who will manage him on the day- because it's that answer that will tell you whether it's going to work or not. TWO people from school could work brilliantly (2:1 ALWAYS easier for any tricky circumstance).

A huge wedding is not the place to practice social skills- you start small and work up OR you allow the child to have a very passive role with no demands on them (so don't sit them in the actual ceremony or on the room during the speeches) then let them dictate how they spend the day (that's what I would do- because I think for a severely autistic child a big wedding is always going to be too difficult to get "right")

There sounds like there are loads of issues to work through tbh. Courses on ASD may help you AND your dh- especially if you can find something aimed at severe autism (not AS- with AS it often is appropriate to take a very calming/removing of stressor approach/letting the child dictate a lot- not for severe autism because you end up living in one room controlled by the child- and it doesn;t make them less stressed!). Actually another suggestion I would make is that you and your dh have a consultation with donna williams she's autistic herself and very good at getting an insight into the individual. I remember one thing she said to me was not to let people make me feel guilty if I exerted control over some situations- she said people who told me to let ds1 dictate were confusing autistic culture with autistic conditions (or in ds1's case OCD) - she said that ds1 wasn't making voluntary choices- his obsessive compulsions were controlling him, and she wanted him to get to the stage of making voluntary choices but he needed me to take control in the meantime. This by the way was when I ocntacted her in June because ds1 wouldn't let me turn the calendar over from january. Her solution was to take it down and rip it up saying naughty calendar controlling ds1, ds1 in charge, goodbye calendar" - and it bloody worked!!!! Bit of a sidetrack but with some training it might be easier for your DF to have some input that isn't guilt driven iyswim.

Sorry long post- but your stepson sounds so similar to my ds1 this thread has hooked me in.

ALSO point out his EX is his EX and his mother will die, YOU are his future.

Tigermoth- nice idea, but really it won't work- unless there is someone with him to deal only with him, 2 inches away from him, there is no way it can work. And the bride and groom can't do that on their wedding day. I absolutely agree with majordilemma there. If it was my wedding, and my mother was going to do it I would be happy as I know she can cope absolutely with him, but absolutely no-one else in the family can- so I can quite believe that MIL can't.

TBH MD- I'd approach school see if 2 familiar people want to be employed for the day to act as escorts. They'll be great- make sure your wedding isn't ruined, will look after dss and no-one can complain. Ds1 behaved far better out and about with school people than he does with me anyway. It could work perfectly like that- they won't push him into situations he can't cope with.

I am getting more and more cross reading this.
Mothers partners children can only visit when the little boy is with you, oh FFS can someone PLEASE point out that special needs or not, not everybody's bloody lives need to revolve around one child.

for you

Dump him and find someone with out the baggage.

What have your parents said?

kimi- do you have any experience of severe autism? Personally I also think the mother is wrong to try and dictate that sort of thing, but I can understand how it happens. Severe autism is incredibly difficult to live with and if you live in fear of the next meltdown it can be very easy to end up in that sort of situation (one reason I got lots of help from SS was because when they turned up to assess us we were all sitting in the dark as ds1 wouldn't let us turn any lights on- they were horrified, but didn't realise it had only become an issue that week as the clocks had changed and I was summoning up the energy to deal with the meltdown that insisting lights stayed on would lead to). Generally its a sign that the family are in dire need of additional help. Unfortunately the question as always is who is going to provide it?

I'd really recommend outside training for MD and her DF so they can have a "valid" view on how to approach these tricky situations.

Wow, Gess,

Thank you so much for the advice. I have also come across some books by Temple Grandin which were so helpful in helping me understand some of his sons sensory problems. Will look at the Donna Williams website - looks fascinating.

On a sidenote, his son has a thing about me wearing glassess (need them for reading) - he always pulls them off, and doesn't like me wearing any hair slides/ bobbles etc. Don't mind normally but not sure I want my wedding tiara pulled off on the day
Any advice?

Seriously though, thanks for your kind words. It must be very hard parenting a child like my (hopefully) future stepson but it certainly gives you a different perspective on life.

I have recently attended a course for carers on the TEACCH methods and thought it would be a brilliant tool for him. From what I gather he understands limited Makaton but doesn't sign a great deal himself to communicate. Its more about behaviour or moving things/ people to get what he wants.

DF is texting, asking me to return this evening but I think I'll stay at parents tonight to really clear my head about the future.

I have had to really bite my tongue today and feel I need to stay to calm down abit or I might have said something I regret. I do love my DF and am sure he loves me....what I'm not sure of is whether I am strong enough to cope with this.

Kimi,

I haven't really gone into details with my parents...they know somethings not right but I'll perhaps have a chat with my Mum later.

I know what you're saying about life revolving around him - its kinda developed into that but I definitely think things need to change and if we have children in the future I would not be 'hiding' them away.

ds1 likes to look through my glasses - sort of peers in from behind and through the side. When he tries to pull them off I just gently touch his hand, shake my head and say "hands down". Works most of the time. I can imagine ds1 would be unreliable near a tiara! You definitely need 2 keyworkers from school - and to say to them beforehand- do not let him get near my tiara!

Does he use PECS? That really helps ds1 because it does give an alternative way too communicate. We are starting to introduce sign, but it's not eay for him and I think PECS will always be very important for him- they can be a pain because you need the book, and less spontaneous but much easier to handle in a way.

TEACCH can be effective- but its more a teaching tool for schools and hard to translate at home. An understanding of ABA/VB (or alternatively son-rise- completely different approach but kind of depends on the child) can make a huge difference in coping. I'd really recommend trying to get some sort of ABA training if you can because it really helps dismantle challenging behaviours and really teaches you strategies that can help get rid of them. It doesn't stop new ones arising, but it gives you the tools to deal with them when they arise. I recently went on this course when it was running in the UK. I don't think setting up a home program would be remotely feasable for you (!!) but the actual course was great for giving tips on how to deal with day to day life with an autistic child, what to do with challenging behaviours, and the type of strategies you can call on. They don't run very often in the UK, but PECS workshops do, and they're based on ABA as well.

It sounds as if the mum isn't perhaps coping that well (what's you view?). I can sympathise with that because it is very difficult when you're not coping (some behaviours arise and floor me- actually the not getting out the car one was dreadful- but that was before we had any behavioural training, now I would have strategies I could try- even if they didn't work at least it would be things to try!).

Give yourself some time out- asking you to take any child away for your stepson to visit would be utterly unreasonable- and it sounds like those are issues that need to be sorted before the wedding. Not how ss will cope (not now), just that strategies will be put in place so that he learns to cope with a baby at his dad's house. As for the wedding day, do contact the school- 2 willing volunteers might make it all very easy- offer them a good rate of pay, and a bottle of bubbly to take home or something, and they'll do a great job I'm sure. I would trust ds1's school staff absolutely in that sort of situation.

Mind you- you may find when you have a tiny baby that you're quite keen to clear off out of the way of a no sense of danger 12 year old severely autistic boy! It requires lots of supervision and no leaving alone together iyswim.

Gess, I agree about having one to one help in the form of a carer - that's what I meant but didn't actually say it. I was suggesting that MIL, DF, mum and OP work together to find a solution for the son attending on the day, not necessarily be the ones who are looking after him all the time.

BTW - have you changed your name? Are you who I think you are?

Thankyou Gess,

Your help has been invaluable. Will definitely ask DF to approach the staff asap.

Almost feeling relaxed about the prospect now

Will look into PECS.

Not sure how his M is coping. Tbh I think she tries to keep things as low key as possible so there's never any confrontation but inevitably its been one behaviour after another. Now he's 12 he's bigger and stronger I think she's (as are we) a bit daunted by the prospect of the future.