Is it unreasonable to have high expectations?

[EastMidsMumOf1]

My dh thinks Im a snob because I hate living in a shit area and having to send my dd to a shit school. I know kids dont care about these things and Im sure my dd will still have a equally happy childhood, but happiness doesn't conquer all. The school she is due to start in September has awful ofsted reports, none of the kids speak English(72% to be exact), there are students leaving every week and new ones starting as they are predominantly Roma Gypsy kids so always on the move and they only have an interim headteacher. I never chose the area I live in as I was in a hostel before hand so something was better than nothing, although it was never meant to be long term here I am after nearly 3 years stuck in a cess pit of an area and having to send my daughter to an equally cess pit-y school with the dregs of society. I just wanted better for her, is this so wrong and snobby?

Oh and do you actually know these 3 year olds personally??!

Like others, I think its ridiculous that someone not working and just out of a hostel looks down her nose at other people. A lot of other people might be thinking "oh god, our neighbour has just got out of a hostel, doesn't work and has MH issues - she's the dregs of society". You know that this isn't true. So how do you know that others on your street don't also have MH issues or other reasons for being hard up??
I currently live in a not very great area (Slough), and also suffer from GAD. However, I work full-time as a teacher and i'm working on a plan to save enough to move to a different area. If you aren't prepared to work, you won't be able to do anything about your situation

Me and DH set out a rough game plan for our life together, did you and your DH not do same? We know our values and ambitions are matched.

How far would you need to move to get away from the estate that you are on? can it be a distance to allow your DH to still be close to his family?

where we live people take short term rents and sign up to council tax etc in a house that will enable them to gain entry to the school, once they have done this for six months they move out back to cheaper houses out of catchment area. I am not saying this is right but I know it happens.

My dhs parents were immigrants and not criminals. I KNOW its not the kids faults, I know immigrants arent idiots, I never generalized anyone but these people Im referring to are awful and unfortunately make up a huge proportion of the local population. This is what I live with on a daily basis, its not safe, when I leave the house I get flashbacks as alot of the abuse took place in this area, Im paying for private EMDR treatment as NHS will only refer me for Pyschotherapy, Im not just some entitled pratty SAHM moaning about not living in fucking buckingham palace, Im just genuinely concerned for my dds future if we stay here.

Yabu to want better if you aren't prepared to do anything about it yourself. £500pcm for a better area is hardly too expensive if your dh works. And put the saving for a mortgage on the back burner until your mh is up to ft work. The truth of the matter is that the majority of us who have also experienced life at the bottom of society haven't just improved our lots by expecting better, it's involved effort too.

I don't personally think of people as 'dregs' but if you mean the sector of society that for whatever reason just can't move on from being on the bottom rung, then surely you are also just as much in this group to an outsider?

Fwiw traveller dc are just as likely to speak English as your dd, so if the school is full of them it shouldn't be an issue. Plus from personal experience don't judge the school yet. Dd went to one the majority would run screaming from and yet it did more for her than the majority of outstanding, over subscribed, desirable primaries would have done

"These people" meaning the ones who steal purses, break into gardens, climb through windows, leave needles around, vandalize cars and cause general havoc. If your taking what Im saying as "racist" or totally based on the English speaking side of things then your a twit.

There is nothing wrong with wanting better for your dd

but NO ONE will or should do it for you.

Get on housing lists for other areas? Apply everywhere you can. Take small, no pressure job that will fit around your dd. Have you thought about cleaning, taking in ironing, dog walking, 15hrs at a supermarket, local cafe? My sister does two hrs a day cleaning a local pub. Stress free, good exercise and a nice bit of cash in her pocket she didn't have before.

Look at renting a one bed flat in a better area? You and dh in lounge on sofa bed,. I did it when my dd1 was young. Totally fine. Loads of families in London do it in order to be in the area they want.

There are LOTS of things you could do, you just have to be proactive.

Ps Roma families can be lovely and their heritage is absolutely fascinating

I come from such an area(many immigrants, many gypsies). Was one of the kids who despite being born in the UK didn't speak English until I turned 7 (I spoke 2 other languages).

Within 3 months I was fluent in English. By 8 I had the top reading age in my year, and by 9 in the whole school. Took my maths and English GCSEs at 14 and got A stars. Rest of my As and A stars at 16. All of my siblings followed a similar path and went to uni where they got firsts (I didn't). The truth is in an predominately Asian/African area, immigrant kids will always perform better than local ones because their parents tend to support them and the school better. The gypsy kids were hardly ever around (winters mostly) but when they were they were pretty well behaved.

I don't think this is about 'high expectations' OP. This is about inherent prejudices and biases that you need to overcome. In the same way you make judgements about people based on immigrant status, others may judge you about your MH issues (how would you feel if kids were banned from yours because of them) - you should really try to get over your biases.

Im not talking about your run of the mill immigrant family. Its like half of you see the word immigrant in a post and automatically assume Im some racist fuckwit thinking theyre "takin' ova our cuntry" I encourage immigration, I wouldnt of met my dh otherwise! The children causing problems for me first hand are Roma Gypsys and the police turn a blind eye because of the area we are in! Im not saying the area is a cess pit because of them nor am I singling out Roma Gypsys as dregs of society. But would I be happy with my dd socialising with the kids that ARE causing problems? Would YOU be happy with your dcs socialising with them? Because the ones that are arseholes are the ones that attend her soon to be school THAT is my concern.

So what are you going to do about it?

I grew up with Roma gypsies. As I said I didn't experience any issues. Has your dd been bullied by one of them? If not what are you basing this preconception on?

500 p/m isn't a lot...what do you pay now?

Groupie did you miss the post where I said a child stole my purse at a park? The one were they tried to climb through my window? Or just missed the whole thread in general? They could be the nicest kids in the world to my dd, would I feel happy about her in the street with the rest of them causing chaos? No.

Im paying £420 pcm for a 3 bedroom house. The ones in a nicer area start at around £500 for a 1-2 bedroom flat but if you get lucky you might find a maisonette for a similar price, its just timing really with private renting.

I live just outside Derby. Good primary schools, lovely area. I've just checked and £600 would get you a nice little 3 bed house (renting).
Saving for a mortgage isn't the be all and end all. Get out of where you are and rent somewhere in a nice area.

(Despite being not far from you I don't know which area you mean!)

Hmm I think I've figured it out. If it's where I think, my auntie lives there. It's not the nicest. There are decent areas nearby where your DH could easily get a bus to visit his brother, though.

Op. Focus on making plans. MH problems may need tackling first if they are stopping you from going back to work. And do what you can to enrich your dd life with reading and knowledge acquisition for its own sake.
You've had some patronising posts on here and you have diverted people's attention away from helping you by some of the tough language you've used . In your shoes many of us might find our certainties tested.
I'm from an immigrant background and my family insisted on English language skills. Some people are bloody horrible whatever their background and it sounds like many of your neighbours fit this category.
Get yourself strong - easier said than done. And enrich your dd life as much as you can.

Most parents have high expectations for our kids, being upset the local schools are crap is natural because it sucks seeing how much the system isn't designed to help everyone - it's a major reason we're not touching them. Some of the best things a therapist told me is most people are doing their best no matter what it looks like to us, and feelings aren't facts - look at the numbers and what you can directly do to help your kid and yourself. That might be moving - though even if you move you can't guarantee the new area's problem will suit you better. That might be getting in the resources and finding after school groups further afield in your budget - Derby is full of stuff. That might be trying to connect with one of the community group trying to make things better. That might be home educating. Use your high expectations to go over all your options and see what you can do.

My point in previous post was that while we may be comfortable calling out the crap in our own area, we may get defensive when others do it & shouldn't be surprised in the lack of support when that happens. I'm quite fine with discussing my part of Derby as EDL blackhole where my 10 and 7 year old daughters have already had to deal with boys sexually harassing them (and none of the mums seem surprised when approached on this, even the ones who deny it's their son openly discuss their kid's friends do it) and teenagers follow adults around shouting abuse to the point I fear taking my kids to the big park by myself after having people in my face. I live near the biggest hostel in Derby, dealing with many drugged up young people having punch ups in the street (and we all know the lady down the street selling them shit, not even subtle anymore). My wheelie bin goes missing for weeks to be found damaged streets over and when we lost our back fence in a storm, our back garden became a magnet for people dumping rubbish. After football matches, the pavements are full of rubbish. There are signs on my road that this is an "arson reduction area" - my oldest son was a witness to an arson last month. And so on - I still defend it regularly, more often than not it's a nice, accessible place to live with mostly kind neighbour even with the rest of it which are far more spread out than any post detailing issues in my area could get across.

And I said, and as my username suggests, I am in Derby. The council has pretty much dumped all areas, the only ones thriving are the ones with enough to help themselves, and police keep taking cuts - even knowing the damage and thefts that happen during match time we've had police patrol here during a match once in my years here - however, the best state schools in Derby are in high immigrant areas (and 73% is not the highest for EAL students for a Derby primary) and the two worst, most violent schools in the city are in predominantly White British areas so going on about those 'dregs' who don't speak English & commit all these crimes doesn't match the numbers. The area dubbed 'the red light district of Derby' has crime rates on the lower side compared to the student areas or even my own mostly White area. I think trying to throw Roma children and others under the bus for the area's issues when it's been a dumping ground in the eyes of the establishment for decades and the White British kids around here statistically pull more crap doesn't make much sense and points rage in the wrong direction (you can call me a twit but it is how your posts obviously come across to quite a few of us). A lot of community groups have and are trying hard but it's an uphill battle when all the council and newspapers and such slag it off and use it to divide the city - that area gets anything and the newspaper hate on it as "throwing away money on PC culture" -- my area got bloody hanging baskets after some gardening group had campaigned for it and we got reports of only getting them for being a Labour area when we haven't been a Labour majority area for years (we're one of the least Labour areas inside the outer ring road). The whole thing is a mess, we have to fight for ourselves and support each other, not let them divide us and hate on each other.

£600 is too much for us right now, we have financial commitments that wont allow for more than around £500. Even if we could afford to Id still have to convince my DH to move as he still thinks Im being snobby about it, hes at work 6 days week so its me who deals with it day in and day out - he doesnt see how unbearable it is.

Nasty thread. Lots of mumsnetters berating a poster for moaning about stuff that they don't have to put up with. How many of you have DC who are at a school that has been SM/ RI for years? How many of you actually live in areas littered with needles as the op describes? As the saying goes 'walk a mile in her shoes'.

Well thankfully I don't. I think yanbu in must ways op, but MN is very liberal so the comments about gypsies and EAL were never going to end well.

OP are you in an area of Derby beginning with "N"? If so I understand how you feel although I wouldn't use the term "dregs of society", it's a horrible place and not somewhere I'd choose to live.

It is hard to private rent but I have a 2 bed flat in a decent area of Derbyshire for £425 a month. Honestly I wouldn't give up looking elsewhere.

YABVU, life doesn't get handed to you on a silver platter you have to work for it.

If you don't like your life, change it. Only you can improve your daughters life, if it meant that much to you you would have done something about it before she had to start school.

Many people have rubbish pasts and overcome them through hard work and determination.

I'll bite. My dcs went to a school with a similar demographic.
Children are children. In nursery the home differences are obvious, much less so reception through to years 1/2. And for all it's faults the National Curriculum ensures all children access the same syllabus. Be really engaged and supportive of your dc, have an exit plan for yr3+ if you must, but also be prepared to have your prejudices challenged. I'm currently tracking several of dc1's friends as they graduate from Russell Group Universities. I would never have envisaged them going to University seeing them in nursery- I was where you are now.