In thinking Dsis should put DN first.

[KungFuPandaWorksOut16]

Backstory :- Dn is one of 6. My sister was in a bad relationship last year which produced the 6th child. The relationship had a massive impact on all the children. DN is in year 6 and has suffered bullying (now sorted) and had problems with her eating.

My sister has announced to the family she is now pregnant with number 7. Came as a massive shock as we didn't know she had a partner, turns out she had the children lie. The baby bomb shell has upset DN, she feels completely pushed out and scared this relationship will be another repeat of the last one.

I am very close with DN since everything that happened last year she has spent a few days a week with me since, and my sister was ok with this. DN has expressed some concerns and has now asked can she live with me, I've told my sister this and she thinks DN is just being a mard arse and will come round too the idea of a new sibling and a father figure.

Her plan is to just let DN finish her "tantrum" and everything will be fine. I have disagreed with her and suggested maybe she has a heart to heart with DN. DSIS has refused because she believes that's playing into DN hands.

My sister is a lovely person, just at times she makes stupid decisions. She thinks with her heart most of the times instead of her head and I believe at the moment isn't taking DN fears and worry seriously as she is just so focused on her new relationship and baby. She has always wanted that happy ending and she thinks this is it.

Of course I want too see my Dsis happy but at the same time Dn isn't happy and feels ignored.

I honestly don't know what more I can say or what I can do.

Actually speak too her child and take on board her concerns. Let her know she's got Dn back. I'm not saying let DN dictate everything but at least make time for just her. I'd have the younger 3 whilst she went on a day out with DN. Just make her feel wanted And loved.

Nope. She refuses to engage as I said up thread as she thinks it's playing into her hands and it's a tantrum that will blow over.

I would let your DN live with you. You already know that there is going to be child 8/9/10 etc as your DSis cannot bear to not have a man in her life and thinks that getting knocked up will make him stay (though that strategy hasn't worked so far).

There is going to be less and less time for each of the kids and your DSis doesn't appear to care about their emotional needs as she won't talk to them about it.

At this rate she may well (though not physically) push your DN out into making a bunch of unsuitable friends who drink and take drugs and fail at school, so won't be able to get a good job in the future or understand how people should react with their partners.

She needs the stability that you can bring. Maybe her other siblings will be able to cope in the household with their emotional needs coming from the extended family, but your DN at the moment need that extra help that she just isn't getting at home.

Will it still be ok for her to get to her secondary school from your house? If so I would leave her official address as your sister's but suggest that she stays with you while everything settles down, without putting any expected end dates on that. Your sister is not attending to your niece's emotional needs (oblivious to the bullying and the eating issues) and someone needs to.

OP "the only decent one was number 3s dad, but she screwed that up by cheating on him"

I wonder if she is kind of sabotaging her relationships. I wonder if some counselling would help her.

You said house is ckean and everything done so she is very capable and able (my house is a tip sometimes). I just mean maybe she needs some help to make relationships work.

Pengggwn multiple kids by multiple dads may be some people's choice and that is up to them. What is the result? If it is happy, well adjusted kids who see their parents and have good relationships with them (even though not living together), great.

But that is not the case here. The case here is what we are discussing and this type of parenting is not the norm.

Once large families were the norm. And some are great. But I've met adults who resent having to look after younger siblings etc.

And the 13 year old seems to be going out to avoid duties looking after younger sibs.

I'm not making judgments on how families are created, but thinking about how they work out for the children in those families and not the adults.

Problem is you can't just take your dn away from the situation. What will happen when the 4&5yos get older and can say they arent happy & want to live with you too? Or the 9yo,13yo & baby, what about them? They might be ok at the moment but they probably won't be when they see what a better life they could have at yours..

For that reason alone I wouldn't do it. It'll ruin her relationship with her siblings and may not be best in the long run.

I would however report concerns to social services. Your sister needs some parenting classes.

Sorry about dreadful spelling and typos, phones playing up.

OP I see you have a one year old. please do think about that baby and subsequent children. Having a cousin living permanently with you who is going through the teenage years as you are starting school could be hard. I'd do as others suggest, keep it informal, keep it casual.

Your sister needs some help. She is going to lose her kids, emotionally, and maybe one day there will be no going back.

Peng I did not say I was a perfect parent!

I think the OP's sis is chasing a dream, and like most people with tunnel vision she cannot see what is under her nose.

Her kids need her. but she is happy to pass the older ones around wider family while she sets up home with a man she has known a year.

The children do not appear to be at all I'll treated, their physical needs are met.

I think that this would not break any barriers on abuse at all.

The historical abuse of a former partner could have led to the kids being taken into care. Luckily, not.

She, presumably, spotted the signs and got out in time.

But her situation is leading to the two oldest 'checking out', physically and emotionally. Her not spotting or not dealing with bullying and an eating problem for her eldest girl.

I don't want to demonize her, the mum, I agree with a previous poster, she is vulnerable. But vulnerable mums can make their kids vulnerable. She needs to break the cycle.

Whether this man stays or goes, she needs to break the cycle. IMHO as a non-perfect patent.

I know DN doesn't truly mean it at the moment. I think she just wants a break from the chaos and her mum too notice her , if that makes sense. She is doing it for a reaction I think in the hopes of her mum taking notice but my sister has just shrugged it off, which I don't think is the right way of going about it.

I think DN has genuine reasons in how she's feeling, it's not like she's asked to live with me because her mum has made her clean up. She's just frustrated at not being heard and like I said wary of the new man. The last man who lived with them became abusive. I have suggested that my sister puts DN in therapy for a little while but Dsis shot that idea down.

I'm just frustrated that she won't listen, because if it carries on how it is going I can't see them having a good relationship in years too come.

Seeing it through DN's eyes there is nothing more painful than your mother refusing to acknowledge that you matter.

OP,she shot down the thought of her dd seeing a counsellor after living in a home with abuse present, being bullied and having an eating disorder? I'm sorry but she has her head in tgrcssnd and doesn't't deserve to be patenting a vulnerable child!

The sand, head in the sand!

Much as you'd like to think your DSis is lovely, the evidence would suggest she isn't. She brings man after man into the home producing child after child with each. With all the chaos and instabilities that brings for those she already has. I'm sure she would like to believe that Baby Daddy is tru luv 4eva but let's face it, experience here does not bear that out.

And if any of the children has a problem with any of this they are not to be engaged with, they need to fall into line. I don't know how you've avoided wanting to shake some blood my sense into her.

Pengg, I never suggested therapy over a new baby. I suggested therapy after the abusive relationship that my DN witnessed and the bullying.

Your sister sounds like my ex and his wife, to be honest. My son hates spending time with them (18 hours a month, every other Saturday) because rather than spend one-to-one time with him, as a 12 year old boy who's growing up and away from both myself and his father... said father and paternal grandparents use him to look after his younger siblings.

I hadn't realised that this was happening until a week or so ago, when he said that he's not going there ever again. I thought he'd had a row, turned out that he's fed up with "looking after X and Z all of the time just so that Dad and Gran & Grampa can do their own thing without any of us!"

My ex is, likw your sister, OP, very selfish - and unfortunately set in his ways. Your sister probably is, too. If you try to talk to her about your niece, then chances are - she won't listen, she knows best, blah-di-blah-di-blah... but you do need to talk to her if you're going to drive home the message that her own child no longer wants to live/spend time with her, I'm afraid. Not to mention the fact that if you remove one child from that situation - what happens to the other 5, potentially 6, children still living in that situation?

My son's fortunate enough that here, in his actual home, he is the youngest. There are no little ones for him to be left in charge of. But I don't leave him in the care of his 21 year old sister, either - and never have. Not even when she was 11 and he was 3. Because there's this little thing called parental responsibility. It's not sibling responsibility. Not to mention the small fact that older siblings shouldn't be used as ad-hoc childcare for the younger ones, if only because (a) it's not fair on the older ones, and (b) it can destroy the sibling bond.

I feel very sorry for your niece, OP... and all of her siblings. They all need help, though, not just one of them. You can't play favourites and only help one. You have to help them all, somehow.

It is a very sad to see this and even worse when a parent minimizes the child's feelings. A friend of a friend had an affair when her dc were 4 and 5 and left their father, moved in with new DP and had a new baby within a year. Her eldest displayed some resulting behaviours and she felt he was selfish to be 'tantrumming' when "other children go through much worse and manage" I would have said that she was a good parent prior to this, but it seemed she was so loved up which blinded her to reality.

I would take her in

OP, does your DN'so school provide a counselling service? She might be able to access it without her mum's consent. My DN did as soon as she got to secondary and it was invaluable to her.