Acquaintance not paying her share - how to raise this?

[lanouvelleheloise]

I have two friends, A and B. Both have good jobs and partners with good jobs, probably household incomes of something between £70k and £100k.

However, they manage money differently. A is in a situation where she is well-off due to her partner's wealth (lavish house with no mortgage, several hundred thousand savings); B's circumstances aren't so fortunate, and are compounded by the fact she is constantly spending money, running up debts etc. (I don't know her that well, but I suspect there may be MH issues at work here).

A has constantly paid for meals out for B, at the most expensive places, where B does things like order £200 bottles of champagne. Sometimes, A has offered to pay for both in advance, but even when this was not agreed, B has 'forgotten' her wallet, vanished to the loos, or just refused to pay up. B generally feels that A just has more money and should pay for her as a friend. A is getting upset by this, but hasn't raised it with B. A complicating factor is that A tends to rely on B heavily for emotional support, and I think at some level B may feel the lavish food is a (rather generous) recompense for that.

I am C, and I am now in charge of arranging a celebratory event for A, at a restaurant, to which B is invited (there are only 5 guests in total). This is a day that is all about A, and she has made it clear to me that she will be very upset if B tries to duck out of paying - it's become symbolic. Practically, I'm concerned about this too - I can't afford to pay B's share myself. I know I need to say something in advance and am fully prepared to do so, but I'm not sure exactly what to say/how to handle this. As I said, I don't know her all that well, so can't just raise it bluntly as I would with a good friend. I'm aware she has some shit stuff happening in her life with family illness and job stress and don't want to sound accusatory.

I know someone on Mumsnet will have the perfect solution! Please help.

B sounds like way too much hassle to be friends with.

Who on earth goes out for a meal and forgets their wallet/expects friends to pick up the tab??

Rude, rude , rude - even if A is the richest woman in the world, why should she pay for B all the time???

I'd be direct.
B - make sure you have some way of paying for this meal - don't forget your wallet as you have done in the past, or else you'll be washing dishes all night! We will NOT bail you out.

Actually, I wouldn't organise this. Too much of a ball-ache. I'd go out with A and tell B to cling her hook.

Sling her hook!

So A is expecting you to do something she hasn't done i.e. stand up to B? That sounds a little unfair! Not that I think B is any way shape or form in the right. But expecting someone else to do something you're not prepared to do is a bit pants.

Why are you both friends with B?

If you want to be firm with B then I'd take the stance that either she pays for the treat or she doesn't come. would that upset A that much? and if so why?

Can you arrange for separate checks? I know its nicer to just all pay the same, but if you have individual bills then B not paying becomes Bs problem.

I don't really understand the full dynamic, since B is an acquaintance of mine only. From what I gather, B has hardly ever paid and yes, she's a friend not a sister. Part of it is that A is v generous (though increasingly annoyed), but another part is that B seems to see the meals as something that is 'owed' to her because of the amount of emotional support she gives to A, and A's wealth. B has an oddly entitled view of luxury food as something that the world almost owes her, too.

It's not really my invite list (just me doing the organising) so I can't uninvite her!

Pay the bill seperately.And just sit it out,let her get embarressed.I bet she will pay when push comes to shove.

Under no circumstances pay for her.Let her come to some agreement with the restaurant.

Raise a kitty well in advance - everyone pays the same - and whatever is left over is shared out.
If B chooses to order expensive fine wine, B should be required to pay for it there and then - speak to the restaurant to have your kitty bill set up and nothing can be added or taken away. Make it clear to B that the kitty only pays for dinner and one bottle of wine or whatever is agreed. It will not stretch to anything more lavish, she will pay for whatever she orders over and above this.

Buy A some flowers for the evening she deserves them!

I also dont think A should be more or less 'paying' for B's emotional support, that is called friendship!

I don't think sending a group email about paying will work tbh . If B has the brass neck to order £200 bottles of champagne, she's just as likely to pull a fast one after the meal and it would spoil A's evening if there's a hoo ha over the bill.

I agree you need to be blunt or don't invite her at all .

Are you bothered about being friends with B?

If not, I would just tell her that A is at the end of her tether with B not paying her way, and she is in real danger of losing her friend for good. If B wants to show that she is changing her ways, then she has to start by paying for herself at this dinner.

Also tell her that A will not be bringing her purse to the dinner, and none of the other guest will pay for B's share.

I would ok this approach with A first.

Also, make it clear to the waiter at the restaurant that each person will pay for themself so they need to be prepared to split the bill a time the outset. (You could offer to pay for A and A reimburse you later so B sees A is not paying for anything).

Agree about paying in advance. Also like imperials suggestion

I've started to think that A has kind of dropped you in it. Why is she involving you in this excruciating matter between her and someone you don't know well?

"I suggested via a message that B and I should pay for A's dinner and B replied 'She has more money than us, we don't pay for her'." This is supposed to be a treat - friends do that for each other, no matter how 'rich' people are (and a £70-£100k household income is not exactly mansions in Park Lane territory and nor would I have thought it covered £200 bottles of champagne). And her being better off is not an excuse to take advantage of her. I'd make that quite clear in any email (although I think it will fall on deaf ears).

Tbh given the snippet you've given of B's personality I don't think this is going to end well with her unless you don't ask her to pay. She feels entitled (for whatever reason) to sponge off A and challenging someone with a sense of entitlement is unlikely to work and will end in animosity. Why do you think A hasn't done it already?

I think if you make it clear in advance bill split five ways and get everyone to acknkowdlege , she's less likely to pull crap about ordering expensive stuff, as it impacts others. In addition she knows full well she's expected to pay. She might not come actually.

I'd be blunt she seems to think she's owed by A for some reason.
I'd message.
B unless you are prepared to pay your own meal and 1/5 of A's then there is no point in you coming, we aren't covering your share.
She will cry meanies at you then dis-invite her.

If you did want a diplomatic way of doing this , email / text B on her own and say "just wanted to check you would be ok to pay approx £60 for your share of the food on Sat? I owe A some cash so i'm going to get her meal for her. I know she sometimes subs you so just wanted to make sure that wasn't your expectation this time"

Yes, you absolutely CAN uninvite her. She's an absolute bitch to have sent you that message and you need to respond just as bluntly to her:

A will not be bringing her wallet to the meal. The rest of us will absolutely not be paying for you, so your only two choices are:

1. Come to meal and pay for yourself. Leave the rest of us to split A's bill amongst ourselves.

1. Come to meal and pay for yourself and contribute fairly to A's birthday meal, AS PER THE INVITE.

Rest assured A will be told by the rest of us if you chose option 1 and you can kiss your free meals with £200 champagnes goddbye."

If you can't organise payment in advance, then I would consider scrapping the group thing and take A out on your own and have dinner out together. I don't think I would have the patience for a 'friend' like B tbh

Reply to her that A still needs to be shown she is valued as a friend regardless of how much more she has than B! But buying the champagne between you is the next best solution. Let us know how it goes and whether B ends up paying her fair share!

I hate it when a group that has had the same courses / wine insists on paying seperately instead of splitting the bill.

BUT this sounds like a situation where that would be best.

I think i would check it is ok with the venue and then send a group message (you may need to prime the rest of the group first) saying that it's best if everyone pays seperately and venue are happy to run 5 tabs side by side to make that easy. Then you all pay your individual bills and it is between her and the restaurant if she doesn't want to pay.

"If not, I would just tell her that A is at the end of her tether with B not paying her way, and she is in real danger of losing her friend for good. If B wants to show that she is changing her ways, then she has to start by paying for herself at this dinner."

I thought about doing this. But I worry that it might drop A in it/be revealing a confidence because A clearly doesn't feel able to tackle B on this (though I think she should personally).

I do find this excruciating toptop, it's the right word for it. I was brought up that you pay your way, and I would be mortified at the suggestion that I wasn't likely to do so. B is both quite a lot posher than me, however, so perhaps it is different in her world? This is very much a "do" for A on a special occasion, which is why I'm not in control of the guest list!

What do I do if B 'forgets' her wallet or says 'Oh I don't actually have any money in my account'? (Both have happened).

Tell her she will have to make arrangements with the restaurant.

I think you're going to have to say something explicit to her, in private, before the event. Say that yo've noticed how generous A is by treating B, but that in this case, it won't be possible. And that no-one else can afford to treat B as well as A.

You must be able to have some idea about how much it's going to be, by looking at the menu online. You could then say to everyone (except A), that "In order to forestall A having any knowledge of the bill or any fuss over the bill, I'm asking everyone to pay £50 per head now to me. Then when we get the bill, if it's less than that with a tip, I will refund. If it's more than that, I'll let you know discreetly."

That way, if B does her usual act (which must be really annoying) you will have to cover her, but might only be down around £10 or so.

Adjust my figures in line with the restaurant's prices ....

But honestly, B's behaviour would really put me off socialising with her. I hate meanness.

We're all splitting this since it's As birthday(or whatever it is). This suits everyone so if you're not intending to cover your share either don't come or make arrangements in advance with the restaurant to be washing pots afterwards, we won't be helping you.

I know it's a horrible position to be in though, I had a mate for ages who was always forgetting to bring money/send her share/saying 'but you work you can afford it' AFTER she had drunk/eaten.

I don't think this will end well with B whatever you do , entitled people also tend to sulk or kick off if they don't get their own way. If you send a group email B will ignore it, if you bluntly tell her she has to pay for herself she may cop the hump with A for telling you she's stingy, if you leave it and hope she pays and doesn't , it'll cause awkwardness and spoil the meal .

You can plan all you like OP but your friend will end up paying for the non-payer.