to resent the 'mental load'

[newnameoldme]

i just read the mental load and it gave a name to what i always feel and complain of.. why I and all the other women i know, even those with partners who take on their fair share of parenting voluntarily - we still bear the responsibility of this weight of constantly having to think about everything.
why is everything only our concerns? I resent it both because it's on my back and in my head every minute of the day whilst men are me are largely unfettered by this mental load. I resent that freedom they have!
It's isolating to bear the burden of all this stuff and the resentment overtime poisons relationships.
Do women naturally care more or do we have no choice as men opt out of being bothered by the minutiae of life

men pretend not to know how to do stuff as they know women will whip in and do it if they act useless for long enough. I mildly said "do you do that to your dp?" "Of course!" He says cheerily, then seeing my face starts frantically backpedalling

what gets me is not that men do this (I knew anyway) but that he cheerily told you as if he expected that you would think it was absolutely fine for men to take the piss out of women like this, he thought you would chuckle along with him

it's as if he believes that women actually like doing all this fucking 'wifework'
as if pandering to men is a woman's raison d'etre

DP is generally very good at this - but then he lived alone for 15 years before we met. But we don't communicate very Effectively sometimes and both do the same task - we've ended up with duplicate cards and presents for the kids' friends' birthdays before now.

Wow. I thought I was the only one....
Huge relief off shoulders that I'm not 👍

YANBU, this annoys the heck out of me too.

DH & I have discussed it (I even showed him that cartoon to explain what I'm banging on about) and although he conceded I have a point it's proving a tough one to crack. How do you hand half of this stuff over to someone (especially someone a bit vague & passive who's used to just sorting himself out)?

Our attempts to get him to take responsibility for mental load have mostly resulted in DC arriving late for activities, or turning up at parties without presents, PE kits going to school with the wrong children, etc etc. Then I feel bad for the DC & others let down & inconvenienced, and stressed out about whether things will get done.

Wtf do we do to change things?!?

Reading this with huge interest. I definitely have mental load issues and debating it right now with husband. Feedback from the male side to some of the examples as he is saying he does do his share and giving examples of how much he does. For example I often leave pans to boil over as I get distracted and he says its my responsibility if I leave the pan to ask him to watch it if I need to go off. He says if he builds a fire he wouldn't just leave it unattended.

When we debated the Decision Fatigue issue (on the example given about waiting until I get home before deciding what to cook - his view was that he was afraid to get it wrong and that if he cooked the wrong thing then I would moan. And that is because fish fingers or takeway every night would be a nightmare for me personally and I would be fretting about the kids getting 5 a day as I know my 12 year old eats rubbish at school all day so needs at least one nutritional hot meal a day. I don't think he considers this - too detailed and fussy! The debate continues ...very interesting to see the true cause of my stress over many years - when I just thought I was going a bit mad

I had a huge sobbing breakdown at my DH last weekend about exactly this! Everything I was trying to explain is The Mental Load. I'm going to send him the article now.

I have found my people! Earlier today while I was doing the online food shop I was trying to imagine what it would be like to be my DH; not having to expend so much mental energy meal planning, doing the food order, and then cooking it. Instead just sitting down and having a (surprise) delicious meal served up every single night.
If he ever does cook it's like a pp described "death by a thousand paper cuts"; what dish should I use, how should I cut the carrots, does this look cooked, how long does it go in the oven for...and on and on, all while getting incredibly stressed and shouty. It's always a HUGE production and he expects a medal for it all.
So how do we share the mental load???

DH works away all week, I work part time. During the week the stuff around the house is my job as I'm physically here. He does stuff that can be done remotely, pays bills, organises holidays, insurance etc. On weekends and holidays it's a case of divide and conquer. I don't micromanage him, he's an intelligent, capable, adult, he just gets on with it!! Example, I went out to do my hobby for few hours, left him with toddler DD. Came home to house hoovered, floors mopped, roast dinner on the table and the fish tank cleaned. No prior instructions necessary and I wouldn't expect anything less. I didn't think we we're that unusual??

Peaceout, he's the nicest guy on earth but in some respects has been spoiled to death by the women in his family (the arrangement seems to be that they all get to criticize him and call him useless - his dw included - while he gets to not do housework and not cook proper meals.) I believe he does take his turn cooking dinners but it's always frozen pizzas and frozen burgers sort of thing, and he makes the kids lunches but its pepperoni sticks, yogurt pots, a bun and an apple. And he's amazed that their kids are fussy

Peaceout Agree. It's so deeply engrained that it's ok to laugh about it and it's expected that the females will laugh along, they maybe even crack a few jokes about men being useless and not being able to multi task. Ha ha how funny.

Marvellous that my physical and mental time is deemed so unimportant that it's funny if it's used up scurrying around after other functioning adults.

Women, eh. They must think it's cute picking up for the silly menz, it gives them a feeling of self worth and allows them a nano second of superiority.

No, YANBU. I only recently read about the mental load and it just crystallised everything I felt in a single newspaper article - tbh I felt better after reading about it because I realised it's not just me being 'whiny' which is how dh likes to describe me. I'm just tired, and tired of, being the one who makes the plans, makes the decisions, remembers where dD is supposed to be and what she needs to take. I'm the one who sorts the holiday club, books the afterschool, books the family holiday, books the boiler service, buys the milk, worries about wills, takes charge of the money, and I'm fed up shouldering it all. On top of working, shopping, cooking, cleaning and bloody laundry. And when he does 'help' it's so unhelpful it's easier to just do it myself. Eg. 'could you take the wet clothes out of the washing machine please?' 'yes, of course'. Next day I find the wet clothes in the basket beside the machine. Apparently the request should have been ' could you take the wet clothes out of the machine and hang them on the line to dry?

I'm single and only "casually" date due to time constraints.

It's not limited to marriage?

I've had a guy at work who try to "set me up" as someone who "organised social things that he could decide whether or not to come to" because apparently I'd enjoy that

He liked to come across as very affable and charming and socially laid back, but at womens expense ( when I batted this role away and focussed on my own shit and getting a job in a nicer department he got all passive aggressive and bitchy about me)

We were both identical ages and same time constraints and I was a respectful and supportive colleague ( he had a partner and definitely wasn't romantically interested in me)

but because I have a vagina "I'm spending my long weekend on a retreat or hiking or catching up on my coursework or going on dates to further MY life " isn't good enough: I should enjoy "organising the menz"

Also briefly dated someone who ( I work night shift and a mature student ) decided that I had all this spare time to basically "tell him what to do" and he'd just turn up at my flat (living apart, not financially linked, he'd instigated a)

It was like he wanted to be instructed what to do and get sex in return

What lay beneath this gentle "passivity"was terrifying : after weeks of jibes ( labelling me "eccentric" and "independent" and "solitary" ) he actually raged and whined like a deranged animal because I cut down my time seeing him ( it was

screaming about his he felt I "should" treat him as a "human being" (basically taking on this creepy Mummy role where I instructed him in everything and he then followed me around and got sex in return like some creepy little perverted boy)

Its actually stealing previous moments of my life

(Posted too soon but you get my drift!)

Ok, I have the flip side, full time work - (I am responsible for childcare, schools, finances, holiday activities, play dates) - but for a while I was not allowed to do neither shopping (you buy the wrong stuff, do not sufficiently check what we have before) nor cooking (god, too stupid too make porridge- what kind of pasta sauce is this) as I was not doing it too his exacting standards.
not great either,
Agree- working and looking after the kids is so very tough

Last year sometime my DH complained to me that we only ever go out, go on holiday & do family actvities etc with my friends & not his. I said that's because I organise it.

Cue a year later & DH declares we're going to go on a picnic with 2 of his male friends and their families. 'Great' I reply. 'I can help, shall I make something for the picnic?'
' Yes, that would be good'
I say 'what should I make?'
'Umm sandwiches'
Ok then
So morning of picnic I make lots of sandwiches, whilst he organises everything else (although I admit I did check we had enough nappies & suncream).
Off we go and have a great day ( despite one of the dad's disappearing to his car to get something and coming back a couple hours later presumably after having a nap leaving his DW with a 3 &a 5 year old).

On the way home DH tells me he's absolutely exhausted but he doesn't understand why. I reply because you organised the whole thing, it's tiring.
I know if the roles had been reversed and I was an average DH with a mental load bearing wife I would have thought what is she complaining about? it was only a picnic and I made all the sandwiches.

Also briefly dated someone who ( I work night shift and a mature student ) decided that I had all this spare time to basically "tell him what to do" and he'd just turn up at my flat
He thinks your ultimate goal is to entrap a man so that he commits to you and gives your life purpose

and then I can spend my days telling him what to do in return for access to my cunt. Oh, and he's the "perfect" partner because he "does everything to make ME happy like a little slave"

Can't think why I let that one go...

This is eye-opening. I feel like I have a generally equal & respectful relationship compared to some I read about on MN, but there are a few insidious little mental-load-type things that creep in anyway. Food shopping for bits & pieces is one. DP had a short car journey to work. I have a lengthier public transport commute. We each pass several supermarkets on the way home, but if DP visits a supermarket on the way it will only be to get something specific that he wants. He'll never pick up butter/eggs/store cupboard ingredients. He will text or call to ask me if there's anything we need, & I try my best to think on the spot (usually whilst finishing up the day's work too). But why? It isn't my job to keep a running inventory of whether we have cumin, vinegar & garlic.

He is not an efficient thinker. I try to be. I try to plan my life so it works to my advantage.

But this is socialised. It's not innate. I have learned to be efficient as an adult.

I agree with a pp who said she will never live with a man again, given the chance.

My dh got really defensive over the message. Removed his stuff from the ironing mountain!😁Would have been more impressive if he'd steamed through the mountain. He really just doesn't or won't see the point.
But it's a very valid one

I feel many here need this book : I realised a few years ago I had to do two things (1) ask my husband for help (2) not expect someone else to do things my way, just be grateful it is done. Example: on Wednesday evenings husband cooks and I go ride a horse. Some weeks I get pretty boring meals but firstly it's not going to kill me and secondly I didn't do it so I feel better net overall vs a healthy exciting meal I did cook but had no help with. You gotta let it go.

If something has to be done to a particular standard to make it acceptable to you then you have to do it. Or you accept that if someone else is taking responsibility for it, their standards matter more than yours.

www.amazon.co.uk/Drop-Ball-Achieving-More-Doing/dp/1250071739?tag=mumsnetforum-21

I do think this is a case of 'won't' rather than 'can't' for these top-functioning-in-every-other-sphere men. Of course they could do this stuff if they gave a flying one or someone else wasn't always going to catch the ball. Having children automatically puts the woman's arm up her back as it is the children who would go under or without plimsolls that fit. They know you aren't going to let that happen.

Feel slightly guilty that I enjoy these threads in a slightly sadistic way as it makes me feel better about being a divorced single parent. I no longer sweat any time wondering if anyone else is going to pull their weight. I don't have clear signs of contempt - wet nappies, dirty pants on floor, shrunken jumpers, carelessly broken stuff/no apology -left around the house. I don't have to have my hopes or expectations dashed as he gets in touch with his inner misogynist.

I do all of it. I feel sad that there is no back up and no shared happiness with man I loved so much that I chose to have children with him. Unfortunately he turned out to be a cunt. It is lonely sometimes. But it makes it so easy to divide up chores, know who is doing the bins, the shopping, the packed lunches, insurance, laundry, renewals, utility bills, dentist, gp, pe kit etc etc etc. I don't recommend it, but I no longer weep with hurt and frustration at someone else's failure to give a shit.

Typo: Not 'under' but 'unfed'

Or you could say that part of the problem is that people do keep on letting it go and they do carry on knowing things won't be done to a reasonable standard.

1. Ask for Help.

Well, that's the problem isn't it? Everything is being dumped on someone, then it's up to them to ask if they don't want to do every last tiny sodding detail. This involves planning and giving instructions, mental work is involved in the whole asking. The real issue is why the hell do they have to be asking to start with.

1. Not expecting others to do it your way.

Fine and it works for many situations but there's a difference between different way and doing a half arsed job. It doesn't work for many situations in family life.

Lets say both partners work and have children and we all know children should be fed a reasonable diet where possible. One person has to ask the other to cook 3 out of 4 meals a week, otherwise they will end up doing all of them. The partner then does things their way, to their standard. Guess what they take the easy way out so it's pizza one night, nuggets & chips baked beans another, ready meal lasagne makes up the last. What does this mean for the other partner? Yes, they can't take an easy unhealthier option because the other one has already grabbed them. So they get the heavier load of mental planning and physical doing for their 4 meals.

I've had all of this, with four small kids, SAHM since DC1, busy household and a stellarly-successful DH. The night I was out with friends and I got three texts about how to cook HIS OWN PIZZA (the last one was 'do I take the paper off the chorizo?' - answer: do you like eating paper?? - and this sticks in my mind five years on )

Readers, we separated (infidelity) and now he has the children approx 30%. His house is grimy, dirty bath, never hoovered, and he has scaled back his work because he can't cope with work and running a household by himself. He takes 8-10 breaks/holidays a year because he can't cope (he has academic-year holidays). He gets a babysitter when he has the children because he can't cope. He borrowed my au pair because he can't cope. His mother brings over dinner for the children because he can't cope and she hates seeing them have bangers and mash every day. He eats out all the time. He puts crap in lunchboxes because he can't cope. He had his girlfriend go out and buy the kids' bed-linen and spare clothes because he can't cope.

He is finally experiencing the demands of being an adult with sole responsibility for himself, and his response shows that he never ever saw how to manage a household budget, how to cook and clean, how to make decisions, how to how to keep on top of bills and dental checkups and compare insurance quotes.

My mental load is lessened in that I don't have to factor him in. His mental load has resulted in him reducing his income (knock-on effect on us all), spending more money on his down time, plus out-sourcing (£££) everything possible (but not a cleaner ).

I agree with what hillfarmer said:

Wifework actually seems very calculated to me, not just "poor naive bloke can't do right for doing wrong"

they CHOOSE to act this way and get enraged when their passive aggressive manipulations don't pay off.

What actually sucks as well is other women who ( often because they are martyish and enjoy the "I like being in control and don't value myself or my own time" trade off) who try to "shame" other women into feeling that "looking after the menz" is their responsibility and they are "princessy" and "don't live in the real world" for having any self esteem whatsoever.

Re; the workmate I mentioned in my pp, my (overworked at both work and home, never had any time for herself ) female manager actually indicated that she thought I should "be besties with x" and I was somehow lacking in social skills by not wanting to develop a friendship there.

because obviously as a single woman who plays sports/ has a life I need to make time to organise men

because that's my "job" and having a "charming" man in my social circle will Make Me Happy (more happy than all my shit little solitary interests" )

And this isn't even marriage but a potential fucking friendship . The sexist social rot sets in early IMO.