MIL.... AGAIN. PLEASE HELP.

[mumblebees]

PLEASE READ, THANK YOU SO MUCH

I've been having problems with my MIL for around a year now, it all started when I, for the first time in almost 7 years, turned around and said 'no' to her she lives almost 100miles away (I don't drive either) and kept going on and on and on and on about having my DD who is only 4 overnight for days on end. I politely kept putting her off but she kept going behind my back to my DH when I wasn't in and convincing him to basically make me change my mind. Caused a lot of grief between me & DH and finally I text her asking her politely to stop asking as it wasn't going to happen and to not go behind my back etc.

Many things have happened since, interfering, ridiculous amounts of FaceTime calls per week to DD on DH's phone, name calling to me over the phone (two faced cow, bad mother, bad wife, controlling, silly child....) because I've said 'no' and started being more assertive. It all hit a head again over Easter because she was asking what to get DD for Easter. I said an egg, just like everybody else, after all, when did Easter become about iPads and the like?! She got huffy and waned to spoil her (as usual and which we don't agree with as we want to bring DD up to be grateful and count her blessings).

I'm sure she does this to look 'better' than us as we can't afford named brands etc (not that I'd spend crazy money like that anyway). She always goes ridiculous for Christmas/Birthdays etc... making us look bad and her like 'the one that will get DD anything she ever wants' (sure this is deliberate ) anyway, I said no, just get an egg like all the other children in her school will be getting, a few days later we get a package full of clothes after me repeatedly saying just an egg will be fine. I contacted her about it and she said 'she will buy DD whatever she wants and won't be dictated to by me, a silly child' (I'm 21, studying for a degree with a PT job, training and a small buisness for goodness sake!) I said well I'm her mother and I'm afraid what I say goes but she wasn't having any of it it's almost like she thinks DD is hers IYSWIM?

When she calls she's not bothered about speaking to DH, just says 'where's my baby'?! I'm sick and tired of it and don't know what to do. DH has only just started backing me up, before he was to afraid to upset her it seemed, she's quite manipulative with him but I was getting really hurt in the process she also says things to DD on the phone so she'll pester me for things or to go somewhere. Like at Christmas I overheard whispering in a separate room asking DD whether 'she'd like to stay longer and if so, she'll have to ask mummy'. Clearly done secretly and not expecting to be heard.

She's due here on Wednesday and I really don't want her to come if I'm to be honest, I know she'll play mind games and do the things I ask her not to do (like take DD to the shop and not just buy her one or two things but the whole frickin' shop or want to go somewhere extravagant which again makes us look bad as we don't drive so can't really get to many extravagant places but we do do other things like country park outings, wood walks, parks, swimming etc...)

This is just a snippet of what's been going on

WWYD ladies?

I feel so anxious and depressed and am so worried for the future with her I can honestly see he turning DD against me with her manipulation or extravagant expensive gifts I've put up with this for 7 years now and only just started to stand up for myself but all that seems to be doing is causing problems and guilt

My children are not spoilt at all and really appreciate the special things they are sometimes given from grandparents. Sometimes they are given clothes.

However they also have very good values/morals and understand what really matters in life. They are very good hearted people

It's a shame they are impacting your DD. Can you work on making her see the bigger picture?

Squished I'm trying to but this doesn't seem 'normal' spoiling, it seems to go above and beyond IYSWIM, otherwise I'd be fine with it

It must make things very difficult. What sort of things is she giving over the year?

Does your husband have any sisters?
I only ask as i'm wondering, if she didn't have a little girl of her own, could she be jealous of the fact you had a little girl and she wishes she were her own? Referring to her as "her baby" is pretty telling she wants to be more than just a grandmother, and i wouldn't be surprised if she did ever get an overnight she played out some fantasy that she was her daughter.
Could she be trying to bribe your daughter with money and be bad mouthing you in the hope that some how, she WILL cause rifts in your relationship and gain a mother "mother" role in her life? Her calling you a child like she thinks you're too young to be a mother and she'd do it better.

Hicdraconis you've also hit the nail on the head there, I'm 99% sure she wants to portray herself as the #1 woman in our lives...

Squished always big gifts, hundreds of pounds etc which doesn't seem normal for a GM? Always seems to want to get the 'main' present too every year IYSWIM? Almost like she's in competition with us

Almost yes she does have her own DD but she wasn't into pretty dresses and things like that when she was DD's age whereas DD is.... MIL always said she wished her DD was into all that when she was younger so yes I do think your right. I'm so frickin' scared of her turning DD against me as she gets older, I can see it happening as she's just got that way of talking any ideas of how to stop that happening?

I'd say that your main problem was that MIL still thinks of you as that 15 year old girl she first met, she doesn't want to accept that you have grown up.
Your and DH's relationship with MIL has to take a leap forward, so that it stops being a child/parent relationship and becomes an adult to adult one.

Then telling her in a straightforward manner just what your rules are will be much easier. Of course at first she won't like this, no one likes change, and she wants to be in control.

Can I ask you what you call her? (In conversation, not behind her back!! )

Don't worry about her turning DD against you, that's not going to happen.

I agree with the other suggestions that you cut short any interaction that results in her bad-mouthing you, whether in person, or on Skype / FaceTime.

A few well rehearsed lines might stand you in good stead. For example:

'Well, it seems Grandma is starting to feel tired and cranky, so let's give her some quiet time.' Cue, cut off the line / remove DD from the room.

With gifts, just donate them to charity, and let her know. A bit harder to deal with if she turns up with gifts in hand, but you can always limit how often she comes to visit, and try to get DH to have a conversation about gifts with her beforehand.

For this Wednesday, don't let her take DD to any shops. Is that possible?

Totally agree Mumble - it's one thing spoiling grandchildren (my own parents do with DS and dnephew) but it's quite another going over the top to the point that a child comes to expect it.

Fwiw my paternal grandmother was a bit like this. Every time we saw her she would give us mountains and mountains of crap. Your thread has reminded me that my DSis and I just started to expect it (not look forward to it, but we knew what was going to happen).

I do wonder if it would be worth cutting down the contact via Skype etc. There is no point in facilitating a relationship with a woman who is so openly vile towards you. It won't help you and it certainly won't help dd. In the long run, your dd will understand that routine spoiling isn't on, and she'll probably just view her as nothing more than a cash cow with very little true affection there. Would that necessarily be a bad thing? It doesn't sound like she deserves to have a proper relationship with dd.

I've got a couple of other narc relations who are intent on trying to buy love and loyalty, even though they treat people like shit. Wonder if this is part of MIL's MO: I can treat everyone how I want to because I can buy their love and loyalty?

21 minus 7 is 14?

I started this year aged 32. I'll end it aged 33. Just saying. There's a good seven months left of this year for OP to turn 22 and make the math line up to the pedants' satisfaction.

Hi OP.

This sounds quite rubbish! I'm having a similar issue with my MIL re clothes and toys so I understand what you're saying. However my MIL is quite passive aggressive. I would put a stop to the name calling with something like telling her until she learns to control her tongue, access will be limited because ultimately, she is teaching tot DD that she can call people names and be completely disrespectful.
Re all the toys and clothes, perhaps get your DD to pack up some things she doesn't use and go along to the hospital/charity shop together and donate them then take her for a treat (ice cream or something) to reward her generosity and make sure MIL knows about it.

I wouldn't usually recommend this but I think you could get some use out of the Reddit community r/JustNoMIL .

It's extremely supportive of people in situations like yours and will help you to draw boundaries. But take it with a pinch of salt because a few prominent posters do make things up for attention.

The most important thing is to ensure your partner is on the same page as you in parenting decisions. If he isn't it's not the MIL that's the problem.

Could you implement a "one in, one out" policy and donate loads to a charity shop? "For the little girls who don't have as much"

Adacoleman I think you are right to be honest. It makes sense doesn't it. And I just call her by her first name....

Beryl she deliberately tells DD first that she's got her something more often than not or turns up with it, I think because she knows I wouldn't take it back if DD when it's already in her hands

Ohfourfoxsake you are right in saying she tries to buy DD's love, she has tried that with her own DD and now she is VERY spoilt, badmannered and ungrateful

Conehead we will have been together 7 years this year (November) I'd just turned 15 when we met. I turn 22 in October

Bailz sorry to hear your yet another with this problem. It seems a lot of MIL's are disrespectful and it's not on! Why can't they just enjoy family time and be normal?! That's a lovely idea and I will definitely do that, she definitely needs a clear out anyway....

Rhiwrites thank you!! I'll definitely check that out.

Wictional yes, I'm going to give that a go, thanks.

I'm pleased that you just use her first name, it's good not to be deferential towards controlling people.

Can you take more control of the FaceTime sessions? I'd join in with them, don't leave DD on her own to chat with Granny, after a few minutes shut the session down with comments such as "Tea's ready now." "Time for bed."

It might help you to read a book or two about being assertive, they would provide you with some useful insight into the games MIL is playing with you, and some techniques for dealing with her.

So OP. What are you going to do?

You have had lot's of advice so what is your action plan?

I'm in my 50s and looking back the one thing I really regret is not learning how to say 'no' earlier.
Because I didn't learn how to use that word I have ended up in some really crap situations with family because their expectations have become warped.
I'll give you just one example; both my DB and DM decided that I was no longer going to be invited to their houses because I had done something wrong. Neither of them told me, neither of them gave me a chance to apologise or put it right. They both just went on a years long sulk with me. I finally hit a wall (after about 10-15 years of this) and I decided to stop asking them round too. The outcome - I got it in the neck from everyone. All sorts of nasty stuff was said to me.
Whilst they were entitled to stop asking me round, I apparently was not allowed to stop asking them. I have some higher obligation to the family than they do.
I wish I said no to their bullshit years ago instead of carrying on as if everything was normal and trying my best to make it work/hope they'd like me.
So now I have stopped saying yes and started saying no - it's great. Massively liberating.

Ada can you recommend any good books? And yes, I've been trying to cut the FaceTimes calls short..

Snugglybedsocks (love the name by the way! ) I have decided that I'll let her come, but one thing out of line (because this has been going on ages now and she's been told more than enough) and I'm afraid I'll be telling her to leave. I'll also be saying that until she can be respectful to me, I want no contact but the door will always be open. Hope that sounds okay?

Skyblue you sound like me!! I have often avoided the word no in order to please people and so they'll continue to like me but actually it's done me no good because I've unintentionally become a doormat and someone to walk all over. So glad you managed to become assertive and are now happier, hopefully my time will come soon!

" I would much rather my DD love her GM for who she is rather than her gifts, to me, material things should not be the forefront of a relationship? She should want to see her GM because she wants too, not because she wonders what will be in her bag?"

But you can't control that. That is a relationship between two people, neither of whom are you!

Your MIL is not going to change. You say you want your DD to love her grandmother for who she is, but you don't seem to like who she is. So... what can you do?

You haven't addressed my point about "training" your child. It doesn't work that way. Of course there is nothing wrong with wanting your child to be grateful, but I still find it odd that the notion of "counting one's blessings" is so central to your parenting goals.

Deadgood well since I'm DD's mother and I don't dictate to MIL how to bring up her own kids, I expect that respect back so actually, yes I am part of that relationship and she doesn't have neither the authority or right to decide what she can and can't do with my DD, just as I wouldn't with her kids. Her parenting is her right and my parenting is my right. I'm not 'Training' DD at all, I'm instilling good morals and bringing her up to be a respectful human being just like I'm sure 98% of other parents are doing... are they training their kids too? Or just guiding them to be decent humans? I don't think it's odd to want your child to be grateful rather than be entitled and treat people like dog poo?

Deadgood also, your focusing on one small detail instead of the whole picture... this is just one thing that's been going on

She has no right to call you names, that's not on.

Re the presents etc, that's quite normal for GP and not necessarily trying to make you look bad. Often Grandparents have a good income, no dependants and a mortgage so they have a lot of free cash. They were young parents too once so they know how tight things can get. Rather than wanting to make people look bad it's often more a case of wanting to be able to get their grandchildren little extras their parents might struggle to. Ditto days out, if you don't often do them them then she's using her free money to give DD an opportunity.

The fact she has more free money than you is no reflection on you, it's just different life stages.

Could you programme whatever she FaceTimes on with one of those screen time apps so it just cuts out after a certain time?