To not know how to end this bloody difficult situation?

[TickingTimeBombx3]

Been meaning to write this post for some time now but it really hurts me to think of it and there's no easy solution to this. I have to make a decision about what to do and would like to know what people's advice would be. To cut a long story short DH and I met about 15 years ago and he chased after me for some time before we finally got together. Our different religious denominations has always been a sore point mainly due to family/tradition and what was expected of us actually, rather than our own beliefs as persons. I am more religious than he is but nevertheless we both thought we could rise above it and work through it. Wedding happened by having two separate services at the two different churches but there was some tension between our families at the time. Then the first child came and within days of her birth DH and I were arguing about how she cannot be baptised at my church it has to be his church as this is how he will retain the respect of his family/community. He said I should know when I married him this was the "done thing" and he also stated that could be a point that leads to divorce. I was very upset with him about this but didn't want to contemplate a divorce when we just had a baby. I could see that neither did he, he just said a lot of hurtful things as a reaction to the pressure he felt. I was broken. I really did want my DC to be baptised and never expected that it would come to this. After a lot of arguing without coming to a solution that would be acceptable to both of us he suggested that we shouldn't baptise her and stopped wanting to discuss it further. I was so sick and tired that I decided to keep quiet about this issue and work at getting the relationship back on track. I then did a terrible thing as I had my DC baptised at my church without DH knowing. I thought I would tell DH down the line when I had time to think if it and cleared my head.

Fast forward 5 years and we now have a lovely family, a stable relationship and another DC2 together who is a baby. I still have not told him the truth about DC1's baptism and not a day goes by without thinking of how he might react and how this could all brake our family/ happiness. I absolutely love our family and never wanted to put our happiness at risk. Now I would like nothing more than to baptise DC2 at my church but it would mean the same happening again as DH has reiterated he would not consent to having his children baptized. I know I made my own bed, but he also has never considered if I was happy with his decision not to baptise the DC and never tried to solve the problem with any of the solutions I proposed. When do you think I should tell him? I am so sad that I am faced with this awful situation and feel stupid that I didn't make sure we agreed on this issue before we got married.

DrSpouse Orthodoxy does not accept baptisms in other churches. Catholicism accepts orthodox baptisms.

Orthodoxy also doesn't recognise marriages in a Catholic Church. Catholicism accepts marriages in an Orthodox Church.

Don't tell him, and don't keep carrying the guilt.
As pp have said it isn't a legal thing, like need ing to be baptised to get a passport or something like that, neither is it like circumcision where it is a physical thing, so leave it well alone, and don't repeat the issue by doing the same with your second child. It isn't worth the upset, unhappiness and unnecessary conflict telling him might cause now, it really isn't worth it tbh.
As pp have said, if you really want to have your second child baptised, do it yourself
Most of us have baggage and maybe things we don't want or need to share with our partners, either in the past, before we met them or during the time together, so stop beating yourself up about this.

I am in a similar situation and TBH I believe that it's up to the child to take that sort of decision.
I agree with the fact you shouldn't tell him. Nor should you try and baptised your second DC.

Remember too that it's up to your child to decide which church they will want to go to. And they might well decide that they want nothing to do with them. Or they might decide to do for a very different religion.
The important bitvin a baptism is the fact the child is welcome into the community and will be raised within that community.
So I would have thought that the biggest issue wasntbthe baptism but how you are g oungnto raise your child, under what sort of beliefs/going to which church etc... so I'm surprised that this doesn't come as an issue.
If your are from two different churches that are actually quite close, I have to say, it doesn't make sense to me.....

I agree with cool. You betrayed your DH in a very minor way a long time ago. I think there is nothing but agro to be gained by confessing to him.

Someone put some water on your child's head. It happens all the time. They are still perfectly able to chose for themselves to be baptised when they are older.

I also think your DH saying he is proud he didn't cave to convention, is just him bolstering himself in the face of disapproval from family. It doesn't sound hugely important to him from here.

This is interesting... www.usccb.org/beliefs-and-teachings/ecumenical-and-interreligious/ecumenical/orthodox/pastoral-orthodox-catholic-marriage.cfm

Not sure which bit you're referring to, but SCOBA is just one group of its kind within Orthodoxy. Orthodoxy is much more fragmented than Catholicism, there is no pope type figure various branches and churches are accountable to. The conclusions of that article aren't representative of orthodoxy outside the churches associated with SCOBA.

@Gaelicsiog ooh you learn something every day. [How's your EOW and activity battle going on BTW? I've lost your thread]

Does Orthodoxy not accept Catholic baptism? Somehow I thought they did.

My post still stands in part - it's possible your DC1's baptism will be accepted in his church but frankly as you are doing it for religious reasons and he isn't, your wishes trump his.

Especially if his church's baptism will be accepted in yours (if that matters to you) then I would go ahead with that for DC2, and then drop into conversation that you've already had DC1 baptised and perhaps a joint party would be fun.

I guess from there the options are:
White lie for a quiet life - DC1 was baptised when he was busy/otherwise engaged/just recently as you thought you'd get it done and you'd forgotten the argument from before.

Full disclosure and telling him how you feel - he's being ridiculous, he doesn't consider your feelings, he's just going along with the sexist attitudes of his community and if that's really how he feels then perhaps you WOULD be better off apart.

Hoping he's changed his attitudes - tell him what you've done plainly and why and hope he says "well I was being a bit stupid wasn't I".

I'm doing my best to word this politely.

Baptise DC2 if it means a lot to you. Then you've done what you think is right and you've 'covered' their childhood.

There's no need to tell DH or DC. DH doesn't actually care about the baptism, only how it looks to his family. DC can choose what they want when they are adults.

You can't seriously believe a religious decision you make for them as children means they can't do as they please when they are adults?! So I'm sure if there was a god, he wouldn't care if they were baptised a second time as adults.

Baptise DC2 if it means a lot to you. Then you've done what you think is right and you've 'covered' their childhood As a non thiest dabbing some water on a babies head is a lot less worrying than the blood sacrifice of crucifying your DC on a cross. But its swings and roundabouts.

What would be more worrying for me as a parent would be the indoctrination into a cult where the child was brought up to believe in this stuff.

DrSpouse orthodoxy doesn't accept baptisms from other branches of Christianity, including Catholicism. Catholicism accepts orthodoxy- it comes down to different interpretations of the Holy Spirit. In Orthodoxy it's considered that unless you've had an orthodox baptism you won't have fully embraced the Holy Spirit, because of the lesser interpretation of it in Catholicism. Orthodox Christians can take communion in most Catholic Churches I believe, but most orthodox Christians wouldn't want to. Catholics can't take communion in Orthodox churches. The Orthodox Churches see themselves as the "true" church, whereas the Catholic Church sees the Orthodox Church as a sister church. I avoided this battle with my ex because she was baptised in my faith long before he decided he wanted access. Although I suspect we will have the communion row. In orthodoxy there is no minimum age limit for communion, so no first communion at age 8ish.

The activity battle is resolved- OW has announced her pregnancy, so they've agreed it makes more sense to have DD less. She told her own kids weeks ago and wanted DD to find out at a big family gathering when announced to everyone but we won't go there!

V interesting! (and virtual slap to your ex)

Which are you BTW?

As a very slight aside, we are CofE and at our old church children didn't take communion till after confirmation aged about 10. At our new church they seem happy to give it to even quite tiny children (there isn't really a prohibition - it's just not normally given to tinies - there's no first communion tradition either). But this confuses my DS no end because we prefer he doesn't receive it, he is used to not receiving it, yet a slight misplacement of his hands (or indeed DD who is just 3) means they give it to him, and they seem determined to give him the wine even if he keeps his hands down as he knows to do.

Op you say you feel guilt yet you say you want your second child baptised into your faith. I think this is a horrible big lie you have told. Your husband may start thinking what else have you not told me?

Barbarian Substitute the word "belief" and you may see it differently.

OP wants to baptise her children in her faith for reasons of belief.
OP's DH wants to baptise their children in his faith for social reasons and reasons of men-get-to-decide-due-to-tradition. OP's belief trumps his "it looks good" reasons.

My DB (with whom I don't agree on many topics relating to bringing up DCs) did not want to baptise his DDs due to reasons of belief i.e. he does not believe (atheist end of agnostic) and if his DDs want to believe when older he will in theory not stand in their way (but given who he is may shout at them a lot).
My SIL (who is generally more reasonable) wanted to baptise them due to social reasons - it's the done thing, it will keep her DPs happy, they can have a party (she's probably the traditionalist end of agnostic).
I'm with him - his belief triumphs her social reasons.

Wow - so your dh isn't even a churchgoer but thinks he and his family should have their way because he is a man and you're a mere woman? Bollocks to that!

Do I believe God would refuse my child heaven because she wasn't baptised? No. Do I want to take a chance? Hell no. I grew up in Ireland during the Troubles. I know this world can be dangerous.

Gaelic I notice you chose not to answer my question directly, but you've answered it indirectly, here. ^

So, unless I'm missing something, you are saying that an unbaptised child (or even a child who is baptised, but into some other branch of Christianity other than your own) may NOT be granted access to heaven if they are killed? Killed as part of living in this dangerous and troubled world you keep mentioning?

So this week, of all weeks, you can say on the internet, out loud (albeit in a slightly cryptic way) that murdered innocent children might not be granted access to heaven and eternal peace (assuming it exists and any of us get it) because not only were they not baptised, but they weren't baptised specifically into your branch of the Christian church?

So what's the alternative for those children then? Hellfire and damnation? Wandering lost and alone for all eternity? Trapped on earth in spirit form?

I thought God (at least the Christian interpretation of God, let's not go there with the Muslim one) was supposed to be more understanding and rather less pedantic and narcissistic than that, especially regarding INNOCENT CHILDREN who haven't necessarily made a conscious rejection of him, but let's just say that they just haven't had the benefit of proper 'enlightenment' yet, from the adults in charge. Hardly their fault, but are they not still God's children? God's creation? Or would he cast coldly them aside for such a small infraction that is totally outside of their control?

Whatever it is you are telling us you believe, at least do it clearly, without the veiled insinuations and smoke and mirrors nonsense of 'I'm not taking any chances.'

And why would you even want to worship a God that would vet innocent children at the gates of heaven?

TickingTimeBombx3 - what are you going to do about telling your children if they decide to follow a faith that requires baptism?

Will you tell your children they have already been baptised? or are you going to let them do a second baptism?

I'm Orthodox DrSpouse. I have relatives who came over after the Bolshevik Revolution, the rest are Irish orthodox and probably have been for centuries. Ex is from a typical Irish Catholic family. DD goes to church with me on my weekend and ex on his weekend. It gets complicated because his Catholicism allows for my orthodoxy, but not vice versa.

My faith states that children are not born sinful. It also states that baptism is not necessary for entry into heaven.

We have prayed for the dead this week, and for the injured and for anyone affected, and for an end to these awful attacks. We have prayed for their souls regardless of their faith, we have prayed they will be welcomed into heaven.

Baptism is the act of embracing the Holy Trintity. We believe you die, and then are born again knowing the Father, the Son and the Holy Spirit. I want my child to have gone through that because I believe it brings us closer to God. It's not the only entry route into heaven in my faith. But I want my child to know God.

Hmmm. The problem isn't the baptism, it's the deceit. That's what will cause the problem. As someone has already suggested, go to your priest/vicar/other and seek their counsel.

Much better to wait until they are adults and can make the decision for themselves.

I completely understand why the OP did it. I probably would have done the same. My child not being baptised would not sit well with me at all, especially in the dangerous world we now seem to live in.

Do I believe God would refuse my child heaven because she wasn't baptised? No. Do I want to take a chance? Hell no. I grew up in Ireland during the Troubles. I know this world can be dangerous.

Right. So you didn't mean those things up there then? ^

Jesus wept.

Gaelic getting into your heaven sounds like some sort of airline loyalty scheme where the more points you have the better chance of getting an upgrade on the plane. You might get lucky even if you don't have loads of points, but it's all a bit arbitrary and the person at the check in desk decides on the day.