To not know how to end this bloody difficult situation?

[TickingTimeBombx3]

Been meaning to write this post for some time now but it really hurts me to think of it and there's no easy solution to this. I have to make a decision about what to do and would like to know what people's advice would be. To cut a long story short DH and I met about 15 years ago and he chased after me for some time before we finally got together. Our different religious denominations has always been a sore point mainly due to family/tradition and what was expected of us actually, rather than our own beliefs as persons. I am more religious than he is but nevertheless we both thought we could rise above it and work through it. Wedding happened by having two separate services at the two different churches but there was some tension between our families at the time. Then the first child came and within days of her birth DH and I were arguing about how she cannot be baptised at my church it has to be his church as this is how he will retain the respect of his family/community. He said I should know when I married him this was the "done thing" and he also stated that could be a point that leads to divorce. I was very upset with him about this but didn't want to contemplate a divorce when we just had a baby. I could see that neither did he, he just said a lot of hurtful things as a reaction to the pressure he felt. I was broken. I really did want my DC to be baptised and never expected that it would come to this. After a lot of arguing without coming to a solution that would be acceptable to both of us he suggested that we shouldn't baptise her and stopped wanting to discuss it further. I was so sick and tired that I decided to keep quiet about this issue and work at getting the relationship back on track. I then did a terrible thing as I had my DC baptised at my church without DH knowing. I thought I would tell DH down the line when I had time to think if it and cleared my head.

Fast forward 5 years and we now have a lovely family, a stable relationship and another DC2 together who is a baby. I still have not told him the truth about DC1's baptism and not a day goes by without thinking of how he might react and how this could all brake our family/ happiness. I absolutely love our family and never wanted to put our happiness at risk. Now I would like nothing more than to baptise DC2 at my church but it would mean the same happening again as DH has reiterated he would not consent to having his children baptized. I know I made my own bed, but he also has never considered if I was happy with his decision not to baptise the DC and never tried to solve the problem with any of the solutions I proposed. When do you think I should tell him? I am so sad that I am faced with this awful situation and feel stupid that I didn't make sure we agreed on this issue before we got married.

[AlmostAJillSandwich]

How can you lie to your husband for 5 years, knowing exactly how he would feel about what you've done?
Him expecting you to do things the way of his religion once you were married because he's the male is completely wrong, it should all have been 50-50 compromise decision made between you. But what you've done is equally wrong, if not worse.
You've done EXACTLY what he was proposing to do, which you were adamantly against. You've gone behind his back deciding your religious denomination and desires were more important than his, lied to and deceived him and continued to do so ever since.
Fact is, your husband thought you had an agreement, that you decided mutually to not baptise the child instead of choosing one denomination over the other. If you weren't happy with that, you should have told him, not gone behind his back.
If it really was something he saw as grounds for divorce, you've risked your ending your marriage and breaking apart your family over this.

Who knows about you baptising the child? Are you planning on telling the child one day that they are baptised? It will come as an even bigger shock to your husband to find out later, and you'll only do more damage if you go behind his back and baptise the second child in the same way.

You really need to tell him, and be prepared that it causes irreparable damage to your relationship.

[nooka]

Those who don't think it's a big deal / would have done the same, how would you fell if you suddenly discovered that one of your children was unbeknownst to you a Catholic, Anglican, Orthodox Christian etc?

My parents are Anglican/Catholic and it was a massive deal for them for all their lives as religion was important to both of them. They got married in a Catholic church so my mum had to sign us all away to both baptism and a Catholic education, which made her very sad.

When I in turn got married in a Catholic church I had to promise to bring up any children as Catholics (I didn't) but dh didn't have to do anything (and wouldn't have, the church service was a concession to me because I thought it would make my father happy).

OP didn't the priests/vicars at the churches that married you (religious ceremonies only, or was one a wedding and the other a blessing?) talk to you about potential children?

[GaelicSiog]

My child is one of those. She attends a Catholic Church with her dad on contact weekends. I was never serious with him so we never had the children talk, and he wasn't around the first few years to object. But if he'd said I couldn't baptise her I would have been down there fast as I could. Plus I would argue given my religion does not acknowledge baptisms in his but his acknowledges baptisms in mine, the solution is clear. I could live with generic baptism. I could not live with none.

[Legma37]

It must be handy to have a religion where you can be selective in your approach. I imagine most major religions preach tolerance and mutual respect rather than lies and deceit. Is what you have done rather hypocritical of your religious teachings?

[Motoko]

When my ex and I had a child, he wanted him baptised into the Catholic religion, as my ex's mum was from an Italian family and she felt very strongly about it, even though my ex wasn't religious.

I wanted our son to make his own decision when he was old enough to understand what it meant. So we left it.

When son was about 6, he went on holiday with ex and his family to Greece, and when he came back he told me he had been baptised. He described what happened as best as he could and I believed that his dad had had him baptised.
My ex never mentioned it, probably because he knew it would make me angry that he had gone behind my back, to appease his mother.

I never told him that I knew what had happened, but to this day I'm still pissed off about it (our son's an adult now) because of the sneaky way he went about it and because it wasn't that he believed our son would go to hell if he wasn't baptised, but his mum.

So OP, I suggest you keep it quiet, because if your DH finds out, he's going to feel so betrayed.
And I suggest you don't do the same with your 2nd child. Let your child decide when they're old enough, and then they can also decide which particular branch of religion they wish to be baptised in, if any.

[SilverOnToast]

Meh - I don't think it matters really. I only just found out I was baptised. My mum never told my dad as she thought he'd disagree. My dad never knew and is now dead, and it makes no odds to me as I'm an atheist anyway.

As long as it gave some random comfort to my mum back then, who cares? All irrelevant to the child anyway, who'll believe whatever they like in due course...

If I suddenly found out that, unbeknownst to me, my DD had been baptised by my DP, I wouldn't then think "my child is now Catholic/Anglican" or whatever. I'd still view them as a child. And although I'd rather my DP were upfront about it, I'd still respect my DPs strength of belief (whilst simultaneously pushing my own Darwinist agenda).

[LaLegue]

I completely understand why the OP did it. I probably would have done the same. My child not being baptised would not sit well with me at all, especially in the dangerous world we now seem to live in.

What on earth do you mean by that? I think I know, but if it's what I think it is then your God is not the God I though he was supposed to be.

[NotISaidTheWalrus]

f I suddenly found out that, unbeknownst to me, my DD had been baptised by my DP, I wouldn't then think "my child is now Catholic/Anglican" or whatever

YOU wouldn't. You;re not a competing religion, and its not something that matters to you. To OP's hsuband though, its very different. Which she knew and did it anywya.

[NoncommittalToSparkleMotion]

Well, I think it's safe to say the both of you haven't been able to "rise above" your religious differences.

I'm an atheist also married to an atheist, but I'd like to think that, if I had a faith, I'd have more respect for it than to enter my child into a sacrament I supposedly value under dishonest pretences.

You really need to talk to each other.

[Atenco]

I had an uncle and aunt from different Christian faiths. They opted for the girls being brought up in her faith and the boys in his faith.

[Mummyoflittledragon]

You are more religious than he and he has been extremely unkind. He sounds very controlled by his family. There is no solution to this and if it doesn't sit well, I'd do the same again with dc2. Although as others have said, he likely has done the same behind your back. I would not tell him. He is may divorce you and then your children will be exposed to his family and his families religion, which doesn't sound good. Once divorced, he may become fully back in the control of his family, and there is the potential that he could seek solace in this religion after the divorce. Personally I think you are in a dangerous place.

I would not have agreed to two weddings. This set an unhealthy precedent. Do you each celebrate different wedding dates?

[sofato5miles]

Fuck's sake. Religion.

If my husband baptised my child I would divorce him.

[Out2pasture]

Have the same type of ceremony with your second as you did with your first IF baptism gives you peace.
Don't bother sharing this with your husband who sounds controlling.
Being unknowingly baptized (as I doubt you'll be chatting about this at the dinner table) will not affect their religious choices in future years.

[Wallywobbles]

I'm stunned that your church allowed you to baptise your child without the fathers consent. My practicing catholic ex husband tried to do this after our divorce. I'm a non practicing Protestant. I rang every priest until I found who he'd been talking to and made my feelings clear on the subject. The priest said that it couldn't be done without my consent. Maybe it's different here in France.

You being "more religious" than him is a shitty excuse. You children cannot be baptized into another religion without denouncing your religion. It's not necessarily a simple thing. Why couldn't you wait for your child to make their own choice? Very controlling thing for you to do.

[Wallywobbles]

What are the religions involved? I think many people here would not be best pleased if their daughters had been baptized into the mormons or a religion requiring their daughters to wear a Burqa.

[artycakemaker]

i think that the advice of wise MNetters could be better tailored if we know the exact denominations involved.

FWIW, I am Jewish and DH is Cof E. We had the Dcs baptised because it meant alot to him, but I found it hard. I've had to come to terms with it, but that was something that I had to do before the event itself. I'd take a pretty dim view if he had done it behind my back - which is why I am wondering if your 'different denominations' is in fact completely different religions- but I don't know much about Christianity so may be wrong.

[P1nkP0ppy]

If he brings up wanting dc2 baptised you'll have to tell him because he's likely to say he wants both done at the same service.
I'm presuming you're from very difficult religious backgrounds not just, for example, RC and C of E.

[TickingTimeBombx3]

Thanks all for your responses which I appreciate. One of my proposed "solutions" at the time was to have two baptisms as neither of us have huge objections on the other's denomination, but he had turned that idea down. He thought family / community would still know about the baptism in my church and that would not go down well. He said to me if roles were reversed and I was the husband and him the wife his family would not have a problem with the baptism in my church as the wife should always follow according to their old fashioned customs. I detest this idea and the meanings it confers to our children. I told my DH this is such a backward idea to expect me to oblige to esp as he is hardly a church goer and that I would not like our DC to feel the obligation to follow this rule in years to come. It has created so much unnecessary grief for us, why put it upon our DC too? If we lived in a place away from family/ community that would probably not had been an issue.

The priests never asked me where father was when we went for the baptism as I guess there are many single-parent families out there and maybe this happens more often than we are aware of.

I don't think he had the baptism in his church in secret as I spend much more time with the DC than he does and he also now says he is proud that we didn't baptise them as he feels they should be able to choose when they grow up. I don't disagree with the choice issue, I just don't want them to find themselves in the same situation as we did thinking they have to do things a certain way just to please us. Also I would not feel at ease with myself if I didn't have them baptised at all.

Smitff I accept the points you make - when we got married I was thinking stupidly and romantically that if 2 people love each other so much there will be a way to work it out. We didn't at the time have the courage to say to each other that the baptism issue would be a deal breaker. I know that I made lots of mistakes and wish could have done things differently but it does take 2 to tango...and all that.

There are no approachable priests where we live to talk to, though I have also thought about that and wish I had someone to go to. Not sure that they would want to be part of advising me to do something that could potentially break a happy family and I don't think it would be fair to put anyone in that position actually - religious or not. I saw a marriage counselor back then who thought I was just trying to get approval for what I did which was not the case and I didn't really find the whole experience that helpful.

[SnoutFish]

Same situation here. DH RC, me not. We decided on the no christening and let them decide when older route. My family were not happy until I suggested baptising RC and they pretty soon dropped it. If god punishes children for the decisions of the parents then he's a tosser who doesn't deserve to be worshipped. If he doesn't, then it doesn't matter as he's all knowing and all forgiving so the kids will be fine anyway.

[BalloonSlayer]

The trouble with that wombling is baptism is an unrepeatable sacrament. You can't do it more than once.

I am not sure this is true. Baptist churches will do a "full immersion" baptism of adults and it doesn't matter if you were baptised as a child.

[NellWilsonsWhiteHair]

I am wondering if your 'different denominations' is in fact completely different religions- but I don't know much about Christianity so may be wrong.

I'm assuming it's Orthodox Christianity and Roman Catholic, given OP's reference to a 1000yr difference.

OP, I don't know what to suggest. I really sympathise. I think I'd probably regard the guilty secret of DC1's baptism as just punishment for the deceit, but I also think in time you're morally bound to tell DC1 themselves. I would probably avoid creating the same issue again with DC2 by not baptising at all. But that's easy for me to say - I'm Anglican, but I'm not keen on infant baptism.

[NellWilsonsWhiteHair]

Oh - just realised OP didn't say 1000yrs, that was another PP speculating. Sorry.

[PoppyFleur]

I think both you and your husband need to look into the underlying reasons behind your respective viewpoints because I'm struggling to understand how 2 people can hold such strong beliefs and yet have failed to discuss it before marriage and children.

I attend church, DH is an atheist. He was christened CoE (but is clearly lapsed), I am of a different denomination. We discussed how we would deal with all of this before we married.

At the very heart of any relationship is respect, trust, friendship, love and ultimately compromise.

I don't believe religion is the issue here, I just think it's the blunt instrument that the two of you have used in a power game. He declares after the birth of your 1st child that it's my way regarding baptism or it's divorce (which I personally think is disgraceful and would struggle to forgive). You then compound matters by abusing all trust and secretly baptising your child.

Why are 2 people who love each other doing this?

I believe religion is important to you OP however it sadly appears that not losing face to his family and the community is more important to your DH.

[NotTheDuchessOfCambridge]

I wouldn't tell, it's not like the baptism will make any difference. Your DC 1 won't grow up more attracted to one religion because he/she is baptised in that religion.
All religions are much a muchness anyway. God, love, sin, rules, churches

[icanteven]

I agree with the posters above - you can and should just do it yourself.

There is nothing to be gained by discussing it with him and causing another row, as it's clearly a flashpoint in your relationship, and while I would never normally advocate lying to your spouse, in this particular case I think it would set your heart at rest and do him no harm.

Is your parish priest any good? Would you talk it over with him?