DP has just ended our relationship on holiday...AIBU?

[Distressed2005]

As title.

Currently on holiday in Majorca, 4th day in. Have gone out for dinner tonight, walking along the beach front and a man tries to get us into his restaurant. He did the same the other night and was quite pushy, DP walked away, but I was too polite so kept nodding and smiling whilst trying to slowly and politely back away.

Tonight, we were walking along the same stretch and this man is outside the same restaurant and does the same thing, I say 'No thank you' and DP shouts 'No, FFS we had all this last night, not again' to which the man replies 'Well you have to be classy to come in here anyway, so whatever' DP the shouts over his shoulder, 'oh whatever, piss off'

Everyone was looking and I was embarrassed. This isn't the first time DP has done something like this. I said 'Couldnt you have just walked past and ignored him like everyone else' and he said 'No I couldn't, he was being an arse and I believe in standing up for what's right'

We ended up having a row and he has ended it, saying he needs to be able to 'stand up to arseholes and do what's right' with my consent.

I said what if he had turned aggressive, we're in a foreign country, I'd have been on my own etc, WTF would I have done if it'd have turned nasty?!

In our 4 year relationship, there have been 5 instances of things like this happening. Once, he (stupidly) IMO started arguing with a drunk guy (who was in a massive group of guys) over a chair. In fairness, the guy had nicked the chair from one of our friends when he went to the toilet. That night, I said to DP, just leave it, it's a chair, I'm not getting into a fight over a chair. He was like 'No, he's being a dick, that's XXXs chair' and started to argue with this guy, who went absolutely ape shit at DP and his friends were holding him back. DP almost got aggressive back, but was stopped by my friend's husband. I sat there mortified and scared with some of my girlfriends.

It's just things like that. I understand that people need to stand up to bullies etc in life, I do. But sooner or later he's going to get hurt and I am a really anxious person who hates violence, I'm worried he's putting himself and me in danger.

He did something like this about 8 months ago now and we had a blazing row and he said if I ever questioned him again when he was 'Standing up to arseholes' that would be it.

So, tonight, he said that was it, were over.

I walked off back to the apartment really upset, he followed me and said I can't walk back on my own, I said just leave me, he's ended it anyway.

I'm devastated. I honestly don't know what to do, we're meant to be out here until Saturday.

I feel really hurt that he can't seem to see my POV and angry that he is willing to end a 4 year relationship because I asked him not to get arsey with a restaurant guy on holiday.

I don't know what to do, if we're over then I need to get on a flight home. He's said 'can you really not understand and support my POV?'

AIBU here?!

It's rare that I would be accused of having low expectations of men

That would depend on the expections of the people around you.

Never been taught to kowtow to anyone, but I know how to behave and I know a twat when I see one.

Swearing at people in the street is not ok. Didn't mention violence.

Atenco just for the record I would not want to get into a fight over a chair either. I think it is a kind of gamble, a lot of life, you can let others walk all over you or you can speak up but of course speaking up may get you into a fight. If I were in another culture I would be super careful as I would not know what to expect etc. But there are dickheads everywhere so when the OP's bloke said no about the chair maybe he had no idea the guy would get arsey. So yes, it can be risky. But I am not a risk taker generally.

Navy "Italian I think your normal stance on men's behaviour is being blinded somehow with this guy, possibly because he acted in a way you might do in the same situation?"

In that I might shout at a tout? I shouted at some kids who were badgering me to buy stuff, once, I think if I remember rightly i nearly fell down the hole, and then I shouted! I think lots of people might do that actually. You should meet my sister!

100% agree with Gabilan at " Wed 17-May-17 21:39:50"

I think also sometimes being too willing to kowtow to others can also get us into trouble! Ironically, women can sometimes be so willing to stop and talk to total strangers, give directions etc, be in situations where they are pushed into doing things or accepting things that are not good for them. I have been very lucky in that my willingness to be 'nice' in the past has not got me into really risky situations but I know in the past i probably did take risks and was too nice to people, too willing to accept the situation and not make a fuss.

Anyway OP I am out now for the time being as I feel I am posting too much and in danger of derailing.

I do genuinely wish you all the best and hope you will work out what is best for you. You are the one who has to look out for you here, so who agrees with your take on things or not, in the end you must do what will make you happy and safe. All the best.

I know how to behave

Well there's a statement that's loaded with cultural expectations

and I know a twat when I see one

Or in this case, heard about one from a second hand account on the internet. I just wouldn't be that quick to judge one way or the other.

I've posted enough Navy. And made it very clear what I think is and isn't aggression, so let's leave it. Or I might shout at you! !!

(Navy if you know me in real life I am the biggest wimpy cowardly custard ever ) [looking for a custard emoji]

Hugs OP.

Italien, (are you Italien?!) by full scale response I meant in general terms and relative to the situation.

OP's partner went from saying nothing the first day straight to For Fuck Sake we're not interested blah blah. I just meant it's going straight into an extreme reaction relative to the situation.

It's not crime of the century but it's a more extreme reaction than is warranted in the situation. So maybe I mean a more extreme reaction rather than full scale.

In itself I don't think what he did was that big a deal, he was being an arsehole and I think we can all be arseholes at times but it's the emotional reaction to OP picking him up on it that is an unacceptable extreme reaction and shows he is really struggling to maintain proportion and needs to deal with that if he wants to save the relationship.

Italian not Italien!

Or in this case, heard about one from a second hand account on the internet. I just wouldn't be that quick to judge one way or the other.

Technically, it's first rather than second hand as it happened to the OP herself, & you are equally quick to judge but in the other direction.

Tolerance of twats is not uncommonly billed as non judging on here, see also forgiveness, 'he doesn't do it intentionally' and 'but I love him'.

As someone whose friends boyfriend was killed with one punch over a tie I dont think YABU. You dont need that aggression in your life, you must be worried when he goes out without you I know I would be !!

Technically, it's first rather than second hand as it happened to the OP herself, & you are equally quick to judge but in the other direction

To clarify, I was defining it as a 2nd hand information because none of us on this thread (as far as we know) were actually there.

I've hedged my bets rather than passing judgement. Thus:

Telling someone to piss off does not make you a violent arsehole. Of course some violent arseholes do tell people to piss off so on its own it's not decisive evidence one way or the other

I don't see this man as a hero but then neither do I think, from what's been said by the OP, that he's a violent, aggressive thug. I suspect like most of us he's a flawed individual who sometimes stuffs up

Many women on here recount experiences that make me think "really, why do you put up with that shit?" (yes, I know, that's victim blaming but I do wonder).

However, in this case, I think they're ill suited as a couple and I can't tell one way or the other about him as an individual.

We weren't there but the OP was so it's a first hand account.

I have never said this man is violent or a thug so you're arguing with a straw man. And creating a false dichotomy of violent thug vs flawed individual. You can be a knob or an arsehole without being violent.

You have judged him to be 'flawed' rather than a knob. You may choose to bill that as 'hedging your bets' but a judgement is what it is.

A man who swears at people in the street, is volatile, gets inappropriately aggressive, dumps his gf on holiday in the circumstances described, is more than flawed in my book, he is a knob. I wouldn't have put up with one of the episodes described let alone several.

If you think that kind of behaviour is ok that's up to you. Just accept that other women don't.

Nancy, as far as I can work out, you're now arguing for the sake of it. I'm quite happy to accept that some women wouldn't like this behaviour. It's why I've said I don't think they seem compatible. I've also, from my first post on here, said that whilst him telling a tout to piss off wouldn't bother me I don't find him dumping her on holiday acceptable.

You can keep going round and round this all you want. I have no problems with other people having different opinions. Just stop misrepresenting mine. To me, a judgement of somebody is a definitive statement. I've explicitly said that I don't want to make a definitive statement on him. I've said some of what he's reported as doing wouldn't bother me. Some of it (the dumping) would. But that's about his behaviour as reported by the OP, not about him fundamentally as a person. I've never met him. I only know what the OP is saying about him so I'm not going to pass judgement on him as a person.

Nancy, as far as I can work out, you're now arguing for the sake of it

That's precisely what you're doing and I've accepted that. I could have ignored your repeated posts.

I have never misrepresented your opinion. In fact, your previous post entirely misrepresented mine, I don't think you'd read my posts properly.

Very rarely has anyone ever met anyone discussed on these forums. Nonetheless posters read a thread, form an impression and make a call. It's not true you haven't made a judgement about this man, it's just that you've made a different judgement from other posters, and for some reason you don't like it to be characterised thus. That's not misrepresentation it's just a different interpretation. If you're ok with different opinions why do you keep arguing?

How are things this morning?

I'm so sorry you're going through this, distressed. It's clear that we all have wildly differing opinions on whether or not he was aggressive to the tout, a lot of which has to do with culture, upbringing and where we all currently live. For me, it is something I find very difficult to accept, and much more so when the person is just trying to make a living. I know that my tolerance is perhaps greater after ten years in Asia, but frankly this tout sounds like very mild harassment. I was like you when I first travelled round the world and embarrassed if my partner got annoyed. However, I now realise that, in some situations and countries, a kind but firm no, with minimal eye contact, is most appropriate. There are places where any hint of wavering will lead to being followed, possibly for hours (because some people can and do give in and buy just to get some peace). I understand how it can be wearing and feel like a micro-aggression. For people with a very short fuse, it may be better never to visit certain countries (and where I live, your partner's behaviour could indeed cause a fight, where half the street would pile on). People get killed for less, and the short-fuse expats here have had to learn self-control if they want to stick around and stay alive/unbruised. I couldn't be with someone like that and am thankful that my partner was not too bad, and has largely conquered it. If you are able to accept his behaviour (and possibly consider avoiding certain holiday destinations), then this could indeed be a matter of incompatibility as many believe.

However I agree so much with the people who have said the ending it was more serious. I have been with my partner for many years, and his calling card was to threaten to leave when we argued. It eased for a long while, after I called him on it, then started again once we had a young child (so, tired, less sex, new things to argue about such as parenting, discipline, whether or not to stay calm with the small child or to let rip). I cannot stress enough how utterly soul-destroying it is. Somehow we held it together long enough to get to the therapy that we should have got 2 decades ago when these situations began to crop up but you know, it was only two or three times a year. I can't even say that we are out of the woods but somehow the therapist was able to get through to him and he changed, drastically. But not only did he change, I changed. I realised that the threat of him leaving was utterly meaningless, but that I wouldn't tolerate it ever again. That it was entirely his anger problem. Him repeating what he heard Daddy say. That anyway if the alternative was being controlled whenever we disagreed, I was better off that way. If I had to go back to 20 year old me, I would have left the first time he threatened it. We have spent the past few years rebuilding our lives from scratch - intensive therapy for both (and yes, we were certainly codependent), parenting classes, and constant reminders that we both need to exercise self-control. Ours was a dynamic, and it took a lot of tears and hard work to change it.

I'm not saying this is definitely how your relationship will go. But ask yourself - is it worth it? Is he worth it? Can he change, is he willing to? And if so, you both attend therapy. And if not, you go alone (and yes I know it isn't really what we do. But i think we should).

If this is where you are after 5 years, where will you be after 20? After kids? When one of you becomes ill, or has chronic pain?

Sending you so much love. You get to choose your life, and how you want to be treated. Xxxx

I think it is rooted in our cultural ideas about masculinity and he's bought into that hook,line and sinker, and uses it to justify this aggression.
That may also explain why some women find it very appealing.it resonates with what we are taught that manly men are like. I would hate it.
But. Does he really think that no matter how aggressive he gets in these incidents, he has the right to name it 'dealing with assholes' and that naming means that you are not allowed to question it ever at all, on pain of the whole relationship ending? Really? No matter what he does? That's nuts. And there are assholes everywhere. You don't want to live with this maybe kicking off anywhere , any time. If he won't discuss reasonably and hold off, won't consider whether maybe he might be the Ashlee to make that demand of you, I think you're better off without him, frankly. What if one day your teenager acts like an 'asshole', what then?
Perhaps he should go help the op on the thread about the crazy neighbours and the easement...

Guess I don't type asshole enough to not get it changed to random names on this ipad. Apologies to the Ashlees of the world.

Fairly new hereabouts. What is the shortest time between the last OP's post, and a current new post does it need to be, to be a ZOMBIE
thread?

I don't mind getting a bollocking. Just asking.

Well I guess if the Zombie alert comes up then it's a zombie thread - but that disappears after a couple of new posts anyway.
I don't think this time period would qualify for the system to label it zombie, but I think that the OP has probably long since stopped checking it!

I never see zombie alerts on threads anymore, even when they're VERY old threads (a couple of years). I could have sworn there used to be a pretty prominent image/graphic at the top of old threads saying "this thread is a zombie" and a quick explanation of what that meant, but I don't see them anymore at all. They were very useful!