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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To want to counter these lies?

315 replies

MrsRuby · 10/05/2017 20:48

AIBU to want to counteract the lies I keep reading on here?

Jeremy Corbyn is unelectable/ a shambles/ can't lead.

He's been an mp for 34 years, always voted on his principals, never been involved in scandal, claims a pittance in expenses, lives in his constituency, voted in as leader of his party by a large majority twice, has been responsible for a huge surge in party members, elicits genuine interest and support from the public, can debate and speak publicly without scripted answers.

The NHS is too big to be saved/where is the money coming from.
Conservatives bailed bankers out with 180 billion. 30 billion is needed to 'save' NHS. The money is there and can be costed through taxing top 5% of earners (see below). That's only people earning over 80k (not 40k or 55k or any other number I've seen on this site. Anyone earning over 80k - again that's just the top 5% of earners in this country) will have to pay a LITTLE bit more tax). Here is a break down of many other policies and how they will be paid for;

✔️Labour will reverse the Tory Party cut in Corporation Tax saving the UK Taxpayer £64 billion over a parliamentary cycle (OBR)

✔️Free School Meals for children aged 4-11, costing £900m which will be raised by placing VAT on Independent Schools which will raise £1.1bn+

✔️£10 per hour Minimum Wage for all over 18 years benefiting 5.5m workers, paid for by the private sector firms, and savings in reduced Working Tax Credit payments

✔️A 17% increase in the unpaid carers’ allowance worth £500 a year, paid for by reversing the recent Inheritance Tax cut
Renationalise the Railways, which will cost nothing because we’ll take railways into public ownership as franchises lapse

✔️Halt the tender of NHS contracts to private health, phasing out the £48bn given to private health since 2010. This will save taxpayers between £3.5bn-£5bn in reduced profits paid to private health

✔️Build 200,000 homes a year, half from the private sector at zero cost to the taxpayer. The rest would be Council Homes paid for by giving Councils the power to borrow against existing assets. Consequently, the UK’s £12bn Housing Benefit bill to private landlords would start to fall.

✔️Introduce 4 new public holidays per year that BoE say would be cost neutral due to increased expenditure by the public on those days off, £2.3bn.

✔️End Zero Hour Jobs by guaranteeing any worker on regular hours a contract. This carries zero cost to the taxpayer.

✔️A ban on companies based in tax havens, or those who pay their CEOs more than £350,000, bidding for government contracts. This carries no cost to the taxpayer.

✔️Halt the opening of new Free Schools and new Grammars which will save the taxpayer money as NAO says Free Schools cost double what was originally intended.

✔️Ban ‘sweetheart’ deals between the HMRC & Multi-Corps and make the big firms publish their tax returns. This will increase tax revenue because it becomes harder for firms to hide profits.

✔️Eradicate the Gender Pay Gap by making firms publish their pay differentials between men & women. This will increase UK tax revenue from higher wages.

✔️Labour will cut Business Rates for small businesses by £1.5bn, and end Multi-Corps paying SMEs."

Iraq war.
Historic. Not Jeremy Corbyn. He voted against it.

IRA.
Historic. JC publicly tried to broker peace talks. Same as Thatcher (who lied and said she wasn't but did in secret).

What else have you got?

So AIBU and how?

OP posts:
makeourfuture · 15/05/2017 09:23

Is that the new name for a ministerial, chauffeur-driven limo?

You know....it was either that or:

"Ohh and he wears a pinko commie cap...."

Can I go back and amend?

AllThePrettySeahorses · 15/05/2017 09:30

Thing is, make, Corbyn is sadly reinforcing that stereotype himself now.

PigletWasPoohsFriend · 15/05/2017 09:40

Should I write in and suggest they run the office staff by you? I hear Darlene in accounting has a Wiccan tattoo.

Don't be stupid. I like many others don't like the idea of the Labour party employing someone from the Communist Party who praises North Korea.

If The Tories employed someone who was from the BNP or Nazi Party I guess you would be cool with that?

Puzzledandpissedoff · 15/05/2017 09:42

Crashing people out of their current education setting quickly doesn't seem desirable to me

I take your point, but don't necessarily believe the actual physical "setting" would be changed

Personally I believe that, were they to win, they'd attempt to bring all private schools under state control ... their class warrior mindset really does seem to be that entrenched

ChesGuitarra21 · 15/05/2017 09:46

Seahorses - why was the LSE study flawed? What, specifically was wrong with it?

Also - can you direct me to the parts of Hansard record, where Corbyn calls for the bombing/killing of British soldiers by the IRA? I've spent three years looking for this and not found it but I stand to be corrected.

Can you also provide me with evidence as opposed to baseless assertion, that he supported the IRA in using violence to achieve their aims?

I'll wait.

NoLotteryWinYet · 15/05/2017 09:47

of course Corbyn can be incompetent and Stalinist in tactics. Crushing dissent doesn't imply you've got the right answer about anything, quite the opposite, it means you've failed to win people round by consensus politics, vis what's happened to the PLP.

Puzzledandpissedoff · 15/05/2017 09:49

Just been looking up Andrew Murray's background and career to date

Have the party completely lost their minds??!!! Shock Shock

NoLotteryWinYet · 15/05/2017 09:52

I don't see how they can do that puzzled because presumably most private schools will try and carry on even with the 20% hike and see what the impact turns out to be - I imagine any parent with a DC at secondary school is going to try and struggle on at least to GCSE.

I don't think it's desirable to stress any parents this much - in fact, why can't they just say the VAT is payable on new admissions from 2020? That would mean people could make a fully informed choice and have time to change course properly.

makeourfuture · 15/05/2017 09:52

If The Tories employed someone who was from the BNP or Nazi Party I guess you would be cool with that?

I'm not sure it would change my opinion of the Tories one bit.

NoLotteryWinYet · 15/05/2017 09:55

it's been obvious since the McCluskey-Coyne debacle to me and the increasing talk about Corbyn 'not getting his message across' and the MSM and pushes on social media to 'share if you're voting labour' name and shame that JC etc are resorting to more and more marxist tactics.

JC is only losing because he's not in control of the means of communication - this is something Lenin said in 1917.

NoLotteryWinYet · 15/05/2017 09:56

of course, it's not a correct analogy - the tories don't have any BNP/Nazi subscribers in key positions, do they? Whereas 'labour' does.

AllThePrettySeahorses · 15/05/2017 10:01

ChesGuitarra21

Briefly about the LSE study:
The bias of the authors is clear in their inflammatory, pro-Corbyn language. There is no neutrality whatsoever, as there should be in a credible investigation. That's the first warning sign. Consider their statement that Corbyn's voice is absent - it hasn't crossed their tiny minds why. How can his voice be reported when he says so little? In fact, Corbyn's main utterances tend to be pro-IRA etc, which brings us to the next problem. Corbyn's words are apparently misrepresented - but if the few things he has said are so vile, exactly how would they like it to be portrayed? Lying? Corbyn has explicitly associated HIMSELF with terrorism throughout his time as an MP. Should it be covered up? Pre-election, that was all he wanted to be known for. Considering Corbyn's dire personal ratings from the very start, if only 30% of letters etc are against him then this is a worrying pro-Coryn bias. The authors seem to expect positive coverage when there is no reason for any.

Corbyn's IRA stuff is in his own editorials from London Labour Briefing in the 80s. Easy to find. Although, given this has been put out there, www.thetimes.co.uk/article/jeremy-corbyn-was-arrested-at-ira-demo-brighton-bomber-solidarity-protest-old-bailey-labour-gd3tnhmrt?CMP=Sprkr--Editorial--TheTimesandTheSundayTimes--News--Imageandlink--Statement--Unspecified-_-FBPAGE&linkId=37571289 it may not be the least of it.

Puzzledandpissedoff · 15/05/2017 10:01

Ches plenty of links have already been provided showing JC's attitude to the IRA. As I'm sure you're aware, Hansard records what happens in parliament, and parliament isn't the only forum for discussion

presumably most private schools will try and carry on even with the 20% hike

I'm sure they will, but what I was pondering was the possibility of Labour actually trying to disallow private education. Goodness knows how they'd do it, but if the will exists and all that ...

AllThePrettySeahorses · 15/05/2017 10:02

And autocorrect has put tiny minds for minds! You can guess the tone of my messages Hmm

makeourfuture · 15/05/2017 10:08

JC etc are resorting to more and more marxist tactics.

No look, if we are talking about clear messaging....it really doesn't make sense to call Jeremy Wolfie Smith on one page and Vladimir Lenin on the next.

There is absolutely no danger of a red guard kicking in doors in modern Britain - it just isn't going to happen.

But what is a clear and present danger is a Conservative government continuing along faulty ideologies of austerity.....wrecking healthcare, education, university research, provisions for the elderly and disabled.

One is a bogeyman....the other is happening as we speak.

NoLotteryWinYet · 15/05/2017 10:13

i wonder how Coyne feels about that make? Or any of the sacked Blairites? Or any of the people worried about losing their jobs, homes or businesses if Corbyn got in?

I agree it's unlikely a red guard is going to kick in people's doors - my point is that the way he talks and his political tactics are vintage Lenin, not that we will get communist violence, as was clear, I never talked about a red guard or violence.

And as I said at least twice now, you can definitely be both stupid and dangerous!

lakehouse · 15/05/2017 10:14

What do we want? Free stuff
Who's going to give it to us? Corbyn
What don't we understand? Economics

whatcanIdo1 · 15/05/2017 10:39

not that we will get communist violence

Angela Eagle/

Fettuccinecarbonara · 15/05/2017 13:24

I am a childcare provider.

Raising minimum wage in my area to £10 per hour (not in London) would result in childcare fees almost doubling because of the impact on wages, utilities, rent, food, consumables; not to mention pension contributions.

How is this right? How does this sit with his other policies? What would the media say?!

ExplodedCloud · 15/05/2017 13:25

Current Conservative plans have the minimum wage rising to £9 ph.

NoLotteryWinYet · 15/05/2017 13:27

the tories are talking about raising it linked to rises in average earnings though, not just putting it up to £9 ph - unless you've seen something I haven't exploded?

ExplodedCloud · 15/05/2017 13:33

It was in a George Osbourne budget.

NoLotteryWinYet · 15/05/2017 13:37

well the latest plans are:

The Conservatives will also commit to increase the “national living wage” each year in line with average earnings over the course of the next parliament. That is likely to be significantly less generous than Labour’s pledge to raise the minimum wage for all workers, not only the over-25s, to £10 an hour.

www.theguardian.com/politics/2017/may/14/labour-and-tories-set-to-woo-working-class-voters-with-new-policies

I still don't like the fact that the minimum wage is being directly set by politicians and not the low pay commission as it was when it was introduced, I hope they know what they are doing...seems doubtful in either the labour or the tory case, although the tory policy is being introduced more slowly and linked to av earnings growth so seems the better of the 2 options.

ExplodedCloud · 15/05/2017 13:40

From 2016:
Mr Osborne said that there was an ambition that the National Living Wage should continue to increase to reach 60% of median earnings by 2020, subject to sustained economic growth.
It is that calculation that leads to the aim for the National Living Wage to be more than £9 by 2020.

ExplodedCloud · 15/05/2017 13:41

And yes I agree that minimum wage should not be solely in the hands of the government