To be surprised by this level of overprotectiveness!

[IrishTwin]

My colleague at work just told me she doesn't allow her 9 1/2 year old son out alone in their back garden!! I actually didn't know what to say! Her son hasn't got any additional needs or problems,is Nt ( Neuro-typical) and goes to a mainstream school Im actually pretty shocked at this! Am I wrong to this this is is beyond overprotection!

Just seen your last post, Dallas. Flying alone as a young child doesn't actually involve any independence: it just means another adult is looking after you instead of your parents. (I take it he is still taken to the gate and looked after by an air hostess). From the pov of independent decision-making he might as well be at nursery.

DS is 6 and not only plays in the garden by himself, he takes himself off on his bike cycles along a single track road and goes to friends houses. They then head off to play in fields and go between the different friends houses. We have trained them to pull onto the verge when a car or tractor comes and they are meant to tell an adult when they are leaving to go play at someone else's garden.

And yes of course I would send him on a transatlantic flight by himself - those kids are highly supervised.

I find it very odd that people won't let there 9&12 year olds play in the garden alone, totally understandable if your neighbours have killer dogs though.

Of course we can't do anything about the fact that some parents suffer from anxiety. But that does not let the parents off the hook if their children are adversely affected by it. Anxiety can be treated.

"That is abusive?"

Don't be so bloody ridiculous. Of course it's not abusive. You obviously have no experience of what being abusive to a child actually is.

I would say it's weird, but as she has mentioned the gate and him escaping, there could be reasons (although surely a lock would solve it unless it's a low gate). My garden is mainly enclosed but there is a narrow bit where they could 'escape' from. I was concerned at first but now I leave them to it. I think they are fairly sensible, but not all children are and I think their parent is the best person to judge them, not someone else who has totally different experiences with their own children.

MissDallas No I wouldn;t let my child fly alone...she's 12 (and tiny like your son) but she walks a mile to school and back on her own and goes shopping in our large mall alone.

The reason I wouldn't let her fly alone is because I don't think she'd like it at all...she gets sick on planes. I'd let her catch the train into the city alone though...we live ina rural Australian town.

Cory, you say that, but who exactly will confront the parent?
The school? The HV? No one has that authority.

Also MissDallas does your son go to high school? How does he cope when his friends are meeting up to go to the cinema and things at weekends??

I let my almost 3 year old DS potter around the garden on his own for 5-10minutes at a time, which some would probably gasp at. But we have a fully enclosed garden and all he does is go round and round on the slide for hours at a time. (He's never out of earshot)

Our old garden had a gate that led straight onto a main road, I wouldn't let a child play out there without having an eye on them. Mind you, when it's sunny I quite enjoy sitting and having a cafe in the garden while DS fills his wheelbarrow up with pebbles :D

I was going to ask if the garden had high risk factors such as streams flowing through the bottom (I have a friend with one of these) or perhaps a piranha pool - but otherwise, I can't see why she'd be quite so protective of him.

Unless there are hidden issues that you know nothing about, of course. But if there is a risk of him escaping out the gate, then a decent padlock should put paid to that.

Other than that - ridiculous. I let my 4yo out into the back garden alone now that I know he can't get out the main gate onto the back lane (used by cars) - he knows where he can go and where's not a good idea (spiders/snakes etc. cos we're in Australia) and he's pretty good at being sensible. My 9yo is no issue at all (although I still prefer him to stay within the garden, just in case he has one of those "moments" on the back lane and a car happens to come along. He has his head in the clouds a lot of the time.

Ime of having teenagers, by the time they are 15, they will almost certainly (however nice and leafy the area) be invited to parties that feature copious amounts of vodka. They will be expected to make their way to and from school and (even in the nicest and leafiest of areas) there will be local dealers somewhere in that vicinity. If they want any social life at all, they will be expected to go into town with their mates and there will probably be dodgy areas and dodgy people to avoid. They will have to make decisions.

Even before that time, if they go on a school trip abroad, the school will expect them to be able to make their own way around a foreign city for an hour or two, because that is a normal expectation of a 13/14yo.

I know that children are all different. But I also think most children (barring SN) respond to expectations. If you expect them not to be able to think for themselves, they are likely to live up to that, unless very independent thinkers.

I have to say...this is all very weird to me. We live in South Australia where snakes and proper, scary "kill you" spiders proliferate. They see them at school!

There was a brown snake in my yard just a few weeks ago...there's no WAY my 12 year old OR my 9 year old would consent to being not allowed outside!

It's very, very odd.

My relative did not let her non SEN son go to parties at 15. Literally the only out of school activity he did, was going to the church youth club. But at 18 he simply left home and moved in with some friends. So no over protectiveness does not always lead to children staying at home until they are in their 40s, too afraid to do anything.

my XMIL doesnt go into her (bare plain all grass no plants) garden - she saw a rat in it in 2004 and hasn't been out there since!

blah thank God I'm not the only one!!
Mine is usually with my mostly sensible 6 year old but she has been out alone.

Oblomov17 Thu 11-May-17 10:32:11
"Cory, you say that, but who exactly will confront the parent?
The school? The HV? No one has that authority."

Sadly, I don't think you can. But I do think it makes a difference what we do to the general cultural climate of childrearing: how these matters are discussed on MN, how we talk to our relatives about it, how we talk to our friends.

It is a well known fact that British children consistently come very high in surveys of child unhappiness in the West, and that they also come high up in surveys of risky behaviour such as alcohol, unprotected (and early) sex and drugs. Of course a lot of that is down to poverty, but I suspect some of it may be because there for many children there are no legitimate outlets to feel that they are taking risks and testing themselves in a useful and controlled manner.

So very heartening to see the responses to this thread.

Cory I agree. It's one of the reasons I left the UK. When my DC were smaller, I always felt this sadness that they didn't have any local friends to play with.

None of the other kids were allowed out to play at all. We lived in a nice cul de sac with large, grassy areas but not one child came out...

We moved to Oz for many reasons but the way of life here for kids is certainly close to what I knew in the 70s. They play out here...they all ride bikes and scooters to school, or walk...alone from about 8 onwards.

They go fishing in the stream at weekends. It's lovely.

My children go out in the garden alone and they are 6 and 4 - we have a lock on the gate so they can't get into the street. I didn't have an especially free-range childhood, but would have been very frustrated at 9 if I couldn't go in the back garden without an adult! I think I used to do little things like going to the post box or shop alone at that age.

I'd be curious to know what the gate led onto. I think a lot depends on that. In our current garden, I don't think I would let a 9 year old out [particularly one who was immature or wasn't appreciative that actions had consequences] play out without keeping an eye on them either from outside or inside.

We have three gates (back gate, side gate and front gate). Back gate heads onto parkland that is known for some fairly dodgy individuals (flashers mainly), side gate onto a road and front gate onto a busy road. Our gates are not secure at the moment.

That said, if we had gates that were higher and had high locks that we could operate from the inside only I would be more at ease.

I'd be more comfortable with a child playing on busy parkland or street than in a garden alone with a secluded street and open area with dodgy activity behind the house I think.

I left my 6 month old in the front garden yesterday while i had a wee and made her bottle.... just sayin'.....

I, admittedly am the other end of the spectrum. the 'benign neglect' end

Oh 3 year old ds2, have you been out in the garden for the last 3 hours, whilst I was watching GoT and Mn'ing? You want some lunch? Yes, I better make you a sandwich. Oh you've been stung? . Oh well, that'll teach you not to go near those again. At least no one died.......

It is a well known fact that British children consistently come very high in surveys of child unhappiness in the West, and that they also come high up in surveys of risky behaviour such as alcohol, unprotected (and early) sex and drugs.

Do they indeed? I didn't actually know that.
That makes me really said.
I think ds1 has a good life: riding around on his bike, me driving him to the astro to play footie with his mates, having a Thorpe Park pass that he used most days in the Easter holidays - going with 6 of his mates.

What are the Dutch, French, German, kids doing that makes them so much happier, than our children then?

Bullying at school is the reason that British children are unhappier compared to their peers; that's what the survey found. It has nothing to do with outside play supervision.

Getting to play independently with friends? I think in Britain this is way under rated.

It does seem that humans need a certain level of risk in their lives. If we try and take it away, then they find other kids of risk instead.

Why is bullying more prevalent in British schools?