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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

to buy my elderly neighbour wine and cigarettes

198 replies

gta · 22/04/2017 07:21

She's 76
She has emphysema and a condition which makes her discs in her back crumble away basically
Her only son died last year of a rare cancer and since then she's asked me to get her 40 cigarettes and 2 bottles of wine daily
At first I refused until she told me she's 100% definitely going to die of her conditions and she just wants to enjoy her life and if I didn't go to the shop for her she'd walk herself and end up being in immense pain and breathless on her nebuliser for the rest of the afternoon!
My partner thinks I shouldn't be aiding her , but I felt so bad watching her hobble to the shops I thought if she's gonna do it anyway , I might as well make it as easy as I can for her so aibu???

OP posts:
Questioningeverything · 22/04/2017 08:11

I had similar but with a neighbour who drank white lightening, was housebound due to her size and breathing issues. She was a diabetic though. Would get pissed on her mattress in her front room (couldn't get anywhere else cause she was a hoarder in the truest sense of the word) smoking and setting fire to herself cause she'd fall asleep smoking. She'd tap my door every day to get her more. She was only in her 30s and had so many health issues she could have sorted if she'd been well enough to.
Anyway I ended up saying no when I realised her friend was round every day bringing her the same stuff she would send me for. So she was on 80cigs and 4 litres of the stuff a day that I was aware of.
I couldn't help her kill herself. I was only 18.
She passed away in the end, her friend told me she'd fallen into a diabetic coma and rescue services couldn't get to her. The one time I went to stay with friends 😔

Sorry for rambling op. I'd do it in your case, but no other. If she's dying anyway and has no family then yeah she deserves something in her life that she enjoys or that helps her pass the time of day

Nospringflower · 22/04/2017 08:13

I agree, she is an alcoholic and her choice to drink is like any alcoholic choosing to drink. Although she says she's going to die of her conditions she could go on a long time like this.

Not sure what I would do - maybe persuade her to get a social care assessment? It doesnt sound a very happy existence at the moment.

Ginmakesitallok · 22/04/2017 08:14

I'm a bit torn on this. Dp's gf was an alcoholic- his carer used to bring him whisky. Fine- he was 92 years old, his choice etc. BUT - would carer have bought alcohol for a younger alcoholic who couldn't get out of the house? Gf would get drunk, fall, get admitted to hospital, get dry and much better, get discharged, be well for a couple of weeks, ask carer for whisky, get drunk, fall etc etc. It was mil who had to go round in the middle of the night when he fell - not the carer.

I find it patronising and ageist to say that older people should be allowed to kill themselves because "it's their only pleasure".

If more people had challenged gf over his drinking when he was 80 maybe his 90s would have been easier.

CrowyMcCrowFace · 22/04/2017 08:18

I would. In fact when I'm 76 & on my way out I'm definitely going to be on 2 bottles of wine a day I reckon. I'd try to be off the fags though because I have asthma & can imagine emphysema is even more horrible.

However, she's an adult & should be able to enjoy her perfectly legal vices. Even if they are shortening her life.

Can she not get them delivered from Tesco (& everything else whilst she's at it?)? I don't know how online shopping works in UK.

Just thinking she's going to have a rough few days withdrawal if you get flu or go on holiday...

Hulder · 22/04/2017 08:19

No hospice drinks trolley provides 2 bottles of wine a day! And no fags!
Patients may be allowed to bring in alcohol but if it was 2 bottles of wine a day we would be having strong words and removing it.

And no hospices have to be non-smoking as they are a workplace so bound by the same non-smoking rules as everywhere else.

We provide a smoking area outside - so you have to sit in the rain/cold depending on weather, and wait for a staff member to be free to take you down.

The hospice staff may be accommodating but they can't be made to work in others smoke just because they are terminally ill. Neither do they have to put up with drunks.

Ginmakesitallok · 22/04/2017 08:19

I really doubt that she's "enjoying" her vices.

usernumbernine · 22/04/2017 08:23

Plus. And I can't word this properly so it will be garbled.

Alcoholics lie to get drink. They just do. They will lie and lie and lie to get their fix of alcohol.

You don't know that she can't get to the shop. She might have other people getting her more drink and more fags.

She could get a taxi if she can't walk. But then she'd have to go into the shop and buy her own drink and if she is visibly drunk the shop won't sell it to her.

She's an addict and she's using you and you are her enabler. And I really think you should stop.

She's not terminally ill. She's an alcoholic. And she's using you. That's what alcoholics do. They are selfish and they lie.

DevilsDumplings · 22/04/2017 08:25

I don't agree it's patronising or ageist to say the op knows her own mind and should be allowed what's she's grown used too.

I've recently lost my father who before he died drank and ate what he wanted. Agreed most people would say the amounts could be harmful. From fathers perspective he was enjoying himself and often quoted 'live an enjoyable life, bugger a longer miserable life'

RachelRagged · 22/04/2017 08:26

DDad has emphysema . He did stop eventually (he smoked roll ups not tipped cigarettes) . He gave up 4 years ago now but he still misses it , it has to be said ..

The "let them do what they like at her age ,poor woman" part of me is in conflict with no , don't . Simply thinking of her lungs etc . Its hard because as others have rightly pointed out , she is a grown adult and of sound mind .

As an aside my DM and DAunt were sitting with their Uncle in his final days and hours (lung and bone cancer) at nans home (they shared the place) and he asked for a glass of whisky and a tab (cigarette) Mum was appalled (never smoked) and Aunt said "For gods sake J , he is dying anyway" .. Their uncle got his wish .

CPtart · 22/04/2017 08:27

No I wouldn't. Nothing to do with cigs or wine, but the fact she's relying on neighbours for regular help which is rather unfair IMO, and using emotional blackmail to boot. Sad about her son, but social services are there for cases like these. What else will she expect of you as she becomes more frail?
Might sound selfish, but my manipulative and demanding GM was all of the "oh Bob next door won't mind doing x, y and z". Bob did mind. He had his own issues, problems and responsibilities. One thing keeping an eye out but I wouldn't get involved in any thing more. Sorry.

usernumbernine · 22/04/2017 08:29

For me, the thing is that she isn't terminally ill. She has conditions that will kill her eventually, but no one has said that she has 6 months or a year for example. She could trundle on for years and years.

And the stuff about her son etc - yes that's sad, but she needs help with that. Alcoholics find every excuse under the sun to drink and if she wasn't using her son's death she would use something else as her excuse. (I know that sounds harsh, but it's true)

Hulder · 22/04/2017 08:29

What user said. A million times.

I have heard all kinds of crap from sweet elderly people who don't want to give up cigarettes, alcohol or both. But that's what it is - crap.

You haven't met her doctor, you don't know how ill she is or what her prognosis is (able to walk to the shop is bloody good compared to some people with emphysema I know). The exercise may well be doing her good for all you know.

Don't be an enabler.

dudsville · 22/04/2017 08:29

Her life, her choice. For me I wouldn't want the hassle of doing this shop daily so I'd teach her how to do an online shop and get it delivered.

glitterglitters · 22/04/2017 08:31

The damage to her body is done, they're probably the only pleasures she has left in life.

She will end up hurting herself or making herself worse at this point if she tries to get about.

Personally, I would do it, my mum died of COPD and secondary alcoholic issues and there's a point where it's about just being able to cope with life. And this will probably make it a lot less miserable for her.

The damage is irreversible at this point.

NotYoda · 22/04/2017 08:32

I wouldn't

76 is not that old. if she is an adult (as people keep saying to justify aiding someone's alcoholism) then she can work out how to sort out the logistics of this herself.

The best help you can be is to give her company, or involve someone else in doing so, and shopping for healthy foods.

XiCi · 22/04/2017 08:33

I would suggest she gets a weekly delivery from a supermarket. You shouldn't have the responsibility of having to go to the shops every day for her. Don't you ever go on holiday or have things to do other than her shopping? What happens then?

NotYoda · 22/04/2017 08:34

... and yes, I think she's manipulative. All this saying she is dying and that she's really really old is just as patronising to her as saying it's patronising to try and control what she does

usernumbernine · 22/04/2017 08:34

The thing is, the OP doesn't know the truth of her neighbour's conditions. She doesn't know because the person who told her is an alcoholic and alcoholics lie. (see my previous post) They just do. They can't help it, they just lie. Basically, the Op can't trust what this woman says, because she is drinking 2 bottles of wine a day minimum. And that means she can't trust what she says about her medical conditions.

NotYoda · 22/04/2017 08:35

yes

Renaissance2017 · 22/04/2017 08:39

I'll let you into a secret about being terminally ill.

Everyone thinks;
they know what's best for you.
they know your body better than you do.
that as soon as your body fails, your mind fails as well.

You get sick to death (sorry, couldn't resist!) of;

~being told you can't do something in case something terrible happens (hello....I'm dying. It's already gone wrong!)
~told to rest up. No, I want to see as much of the world as possible.
~ advised to abstain from alcohol/go vegetarian/pray more.

We've worked out we're dying. We can handle that in our own way. If you don't want to help your neighbour, that's fine but don't try to dictate what she does with her own body.

iloveeverykindofcat · 22/04/2017 08:40

Tough one. I can see the arguments on both sides. In your position, I'd probably do it, but maybe have a talk with her first to make sure she is aware of options she could utilize to stop/cut down. If she is and has made her decision, I'd get her what she wants.

usernumbernine · 22/04/2017 08:43

Renaissance but from the OP I don't think the neighbour is terminally ill in the sense that I don't think she has a diagnosis of a terminal condition with x amount of time left?

People with emphysema can go on for years - my friend's dad a similar condition (he had asbestosis) and he lasted years and years from diagnosis. I have crumbling discs in my back - no one has said that's terminal to me.

MaudesMum · 22/04/2017 08:43

I think there's a difference between providing very ill people with an occasional glass of wine and/or cigarette, which seems entirely humane, and enabling them to drink industrial quantities of the stuff, which may hasten their end but won't necessarily make it a better end.

I watched my Mum die of emphysemia in hospital (she was admitted because she was too weak to stand up) and it really wasn't nice at all. Combining that with alcohol withdrawal could be hellish. I'd be incredibly tempted to talk to adult social services about her, or her GP (if you knew who it was) and see if they could offer her some other options to manage her pain. It might not work, but at least you'd have tried.

ptumbi · 22/04/2017 08:46

I would worry more about the fire risks than her health, TBH. If she has emphysema she may have oxygen canisters in the house, which are highly flammable. Cigarettes, wine and oxygen is a highly risky combination.

Plus, as a pp said, she may well be getting other people to buy drinks and fags too.

Having said that, I don't actually know what I'd do.

user1491572121 · 22/04/2017 08:46

This is not a baby or a child. It is an adult woman who can't make it to the shops.

Of course OP should do her the favour. Maudes social services won't care about this...they don't have time and it's her choice.