Active discussions

Meet the Other Phone. Child-safe in minutes.

Meet the Other Phone.
Child-safe in minutes.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

Talk
AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

to think going to a church service when atheist is not that big a deal?

188 replies

parentsvsPIL · 16/04/2017 09:26

My atheist parents take their religion-bashing quite seriously. They make Richard Dawkins look nuanced.

DH and I sing in the local church choir, since it's a good choir, there aren't any other good choirs locally, and we are generally fine with the broad principles being espoused by the church, though we are not believers. It is made fairly explicit that church musicians are not required to be anything more than tolerant of religion.

My family is currently visiting. It being Easter, there's lots of nice music happening at the church, done by our choir. My family loves music and would typically go to anything on offer.

Family have refused outright to allow my niece to go to any of it as they don't want people forcing religion on her. My parents have also refused to go to any of it. My siblings have gone to one service and made lots of comments about being "forced to pray" (we're talking Anglican evensong here, not Billy Graham... they weren't forced to do anything!)

Is this really that big a deal? Well, it clearly is for them, but we just don't get what harm they think it's going to do... Confused

OP posts:
Original poster
parentsvsPIL · 17/04/2017 07:39

also it depends on your views and vocab but music is usually seen as an act of ministry by those for whom an act of worship doesn't make sense.

OP posts:
Dozer · 17/04/2017 07:40

An american friend who is a professional classical singer says the vast majority of her (freelance) work is related to religions.

wittyUserNameHere · 17/04/2017 08:36

But you're not seriously suggesting anyone over about age 10 takes hymn words literally...?

I have no idea but:

  1. doesn't this support my view that children and the impressionable should be shielded from religion if you think the words of the songs are something you grow out of believing?

  2. I get very confused when things are supposed to be taken literally or if we look for the morality behind it. I frequently struggle with either approach.

Thus says the Lord: I will take your wives while you live to see it, and will give them to your neighbor. He shall lie with your wives in broad daylight.

Should we hate homosexuals or are they a metaphor for other evil people?

  1. I had to google most of the musical 'genres' you mentioned but yes, it seems like the main damage would be done through the teachings of the religion as opposed to the music.
SilverLeafClover · 17/04/2017 08:41

I am an atheist and I am just not interested in going to a church service. I don't like the music, the sentiments, the praying.

I don't even like visiting churches when there is no service on, to see the stained glass or whatever.

I also don't like football and could not see the point of going to watch a football match. Even if it was a famous team in an important match.

Just not my thing.

SilverLeafClover · 17/04/2017 08:44

I also don't visit mosques, synagogues or temples. Not interested.

derxa · 17/04/2017 08:58

All the virtue signalling about being an atheist on here. I've been to quite a few funerals recently. In an old fashioned community where a huge amount of people turn up for the funerals of even very old people. The church and service gives great comfort to the bereaved.

OP your relatives just don't sound very kind and thoughtful. Is that what being an atheist involves? Putting yourself first on every occasion.

Original poster
parentsvsPIL · 17/04/2017 09:04

hang on derxa... you know there are twatty Christans and twatty atheists. And thoughtful, humble, kind & selfless atheists & Christians.

I think we know where my family often are in that 2-axis spectrum....

OP posts:
JacquesHammer · 17/04/2017 09:05

Is that what being an atheist involves? Putting yourself first on every occasion

Not sure atheists are a homogenous mass that all deal with their beliefs in the same way.

I am staunchly atheist. I visit churches for both services where necessary and as a place of historical interest.

I will go through the motions of a service - standing where appropriate etc. I don't pray though/sing/make devotions and won't ever enter into theological discussions in them!

Riversleep · 17/04/2017 09:10

My atheist in laws refused to attend my children's baptisms. My DH's Jewish family attended. My DH was atheist when they were born but I was Catholic.

AwaywiththePixies27 · 17/04/2017 09:17

Riversleep that's awful Flowers

AwaywiththePixies27 · 17/04/2017 09:22

My DM spent the whole morning looking decidedly uncomfortable at DDs christening. DM is Pentecostal but Ex was / is RC so she was christened in a cathedral. I think DM genuinely believed God was going to strike her down for daring to attend another denomination 😂 but at least she still came to the service!

derxa · 17/04/2017 09:23

hang on derxa... you know there are twatty Christans and twatty atheists. And thoughtful, humble, kind & selfless atheists & Christians.
I know but for people to make it out to be a virtue that they're an atheist baffles me. It's rare on MN to read 'Im a Christian'.

wittyUserNameHere · 17/04/2017 09:30

I know but for people to make it out to be a virtue that they're an atheist baffles me.

Why is it baffling?

People can be good people despite religion, it's true and many are, but it is virtuous to be an atheist.

Original poster
parentsvsPIL · 17/04/2017 09:30

Sorry, that was directed more at the "putting themselves first" bit.

The virtue signalling seems mostly to be people explaining their standpoint. But it is AIBU so...

OP posts:
Frazzled2207 · 17/04/2017 09:31

Your family is being very unreasonable.
My dh is as atheist as they come and yet comes along to musical stuff we do at church without any quibbles at all.

ZaziesPaws · 17/04/2017 09:32

I reckon there are two types of atheists.

Ones who just aren't religious.

Ones who don't believe in God, but are religious. They tend to find an -ism to use as their religion- atheism, socialism.

The former tend to be able to go to church services etc fine without much fuss, for anything from weddings and christenings to "my MIL wanted to go to the Easter service and didn't want to go on her own".

The latter, not so much.

My parents were both atheists. Both had strong belief systems and faith, but no belief in a deity and wary of institutionalised religion.

But, when I was little, my friend from across the road always went to church on Sunday and I wanted to go because she told me about it. So they let me, and came with me, so I "could make up my own mind".

I went maybe half a dozen times. Apparently I asked the Sunday School Teacher a lot of awkward questions so it obviously wasn't for me.

LassWiTheDelicateAir · 17/04/2017 10:35

My atheist in laws refused to attend my children's baptisms. My DH's Jewish family attended. My DH was atheist when they were born but I was Catholic

Would depend what you expected of them. If sitting passively at the back of the church I would attend although would not take part in prayers. If expected to be actively involved as part of the group at the baptismal font I would not attend.

Dozer · 17/04/2017 10:54

It's not twatty to decline invitations to church services!

I don't think there has been "virtue signalling" on this thread: more prejudices about atheism?

Funerals are very different from musical performances/services IMO. No one on this thread has said they don't attend funerals.

Baptism / christening services (CofE, Catholic) can be hardcore on the religion IME.

originalbiglymavis · 17/04/2017 11:08

I loathe big get togethers and parties. Don't like having to sit through long recitals, sports days and school productions. Hate having to hang around sports fields or carparks waiting for a fixture or club to finish. But I go nonetheless.

We all do things we don't want to - not for our benefit but for the benefit of friends and relatives. We got married in church and if someone had got all high and mighty about it i'd've told them that it wasn't all about them - and to sod off.

We had all-sorts at our wedding and nobody was struck by lightning, caught God, or went out persecuting heathens.

MariafromMalmo · 17/04/2017 11:14

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

MadameCholetsDirtySecret · 17/04/2017 11:26

I'm an atheist and generally avoid church services as they frustrate me. I do like the calm of a church that isn't being used for a service though.
That said, I am going to a very specific service in a cathedral in a few months. It isn't something I will ever get the chance to do again and it is in one of the nation's most iconic buildings, I'm looking forward to the experience. I do t expect a road to Damascus moment though Grin

BitOutOfPractice · 17/04/2017 14:29

I am a fervent atheist. I love a carol concert

Myrobalanna · 17/04/2017 14:39

Well...I'm an atheist and will go to a church wedding, no harm done - it's MY choice.
I don't take my DC to church though, so with some British faffing around the subject I would probably find a way out of this situation.
I believe quite strongly that exposure to religious thinking is something you can choose in later life but should not be exposed to as a child. I realise the CofE is the wishy-washiest end of the spectrum and the community aspect is good, but the issue is giving authority to the magical thinking (in the eyes of the child).
So I'm with them, but I'd try to be polite about it :)

Slightlyperturbedowlagain · 17/04/2017 16:45

See to me atheism is literally an absence of belief, so not a virtue at all, just actually nothing.

TrojanWhore · 17/04/2017 17:32

Atheism means a belief that there is no god. So for example buddhists are atheists.

The absence of belief, especially if combined with a pragmatic and evidence-based assessments of different world views is normally termed agnosticism.

I don't think an agnostic would have any particular problem about attending a church.

But an atheist might (depending in the exact type of atheistic belief they have - there are many types, just like there are many denominations of christian - some of whom would attend places important to other faiths and some who would never go near).