AIBU re Karen Matthews after watching the programme tonight>

[tiptoeingpixie]

Before I say anything, I absolutely think what she did was disgusting, abhorrent and alien to me as a mother how she could do what she did.

After watching programme tonight I've changed my mine in that no, she wasn't evil like some have claimed, she was someone with low intellect, numerous children by various fathers, the stereotype benefit mother that the press love to villi file.

Interested in what other's who saw the programme thought x

I watched the programme on catch up.
I don't mean to be flippant but the person who came out worse from that show was Nick Ferrari IMO.
He had nothing to do with any of it. He has no connection to the child, no experience of anything that would remotely qualify him to comment on what happened.
Yet there he was. Almost wetting himself with fury and reveling
in the opportunity to spit hatred about KM.
There were quite a few people making statements based on nothing but trying to sound as if they were stating facts, not opinions.

Pretty typical Channel 5 fare. Lets not forget that this is the channel that produces the majority of benefit porn. They are The Sun of televisual media.

the person who came out worse from that show was Nick Ferrari IMO.

Amanda Platell seemed almost balanced in comparison.

Yes! It took me a while to work out who she was, specially when she said there was 'a tiny tiny amount of people' who were feckless scrounging babymakers (I paraphrase). I liked the way she read out her article as if it were a piece of classical poetry

I'm not going to get in to the quagmire of whether or not Karen Matthews is evil, because it's such a hot-potato word and I have doubts as to whether it adds any real insight. Understanding why someone has done something is not the same as condoning it. My birth mother (I'm adopted) was abusive and negligent but despite not respecting or liking her, just labelling my mother as "evil" feels reductive. I did want to understand her motives, however.

My feeling is that Karen Matthew's got pulled into a scenario of enormous magnitude, and she quickly lost control. I did watch this documentary, and almost all of the people interviewed confirmed Karen Matthew's low intelligence. But that's just one facet of who she is. I also think she wasn't maternal and she was a poor mother. Some posters have implied that in confirming her lack of intelligence, this somehow means her low intelligence makes her a bad mother. I feel like these are not directly connected, they (her lack of intelligence and her lack of maternal instinct) are just two of several elements to her character.

From a layperson's perspective, I don't even believe she has a pathology, unlike, for example, Ian Brady, who is diagnosed with a severe personality disorder. I honestly just think Matthews' was extremely easily lead, and didn't have the nous to realise that what she was doing was seriously damaging to her daughter.

and didn't have the nous to realise that what she was doing was seriously damaging to her daughter.

I agree. I think she absolutely knew what she was doing was wrong, was a serious crime and would land her in massive trouble. I think she knew it was harmful to her daugher. But I don't think she had (and possibly still doesn't) any concept of the actual damage she was doing to Shannon both physically (the drugs) and psychologically. Let alone the impact of being a famous child for such a horrible reason. I think if she was even slightly aware of that she wouldn't have been able to do it, and also she wouldn't have been able to neglect as abuse her other children in the ways she did.

miffy
It is interesting that you mention your b.mother.
KM reminds me a lot of my DS's bm. I know her well because she is related to me.
I have witnessed her do things very similar to KM. She behaved bizarrely in very important review meetings and during contact visits where she was being assessed.
She would say odd things very similar to the sort of thing KM was reported to have said too.

I suspect that my DS's b.mum is one of the people baying for KM's blood and wouldn't have a clue how similar she is to her.

presumably they were going to have to murder Shannan at. Some point if she hadn't been found by the police?

What makes you think that? If this was their intention, surely they would have murdered her sooner?

People can be of low intelligence and yet very cunning, and I think KM may be one of these. I DO NOT think she's "a child in an adult's body" - I think this is far too simplistic. I think she was/is greedy and selfish, and unable to see the likely consequences of her actions.

At least her being in jail meant that there was at least four years when she wasn't popping out a sprog! Good for her and for any potential infants she may have had.

Goodness knows why Amanda Platell (is that her name) Was prattling on about council estates, and benefit claimants, and The fact that she has 7 kids by 5 men. Correct me if I'm wrong but. She didn't get pregant on her own.

I suppose the crime would have been less had she hsve been middle class.
In Amanda's eyes. .

If by KM you're talking about Kate McCann. She cannot be of low intelligence. She was a GP.
Apologies if I'm wrong.

why on earth would it be Kate McCann when the thread is about Karen Matthews? When did Kate McCann spend 4 years in prison?

Sorry wires crossed. Let's not have a bun fight.

Spider

I did mean Karen Matthews. I was just too lazy to type it out and too dim to realise that there were two missing children whose mothers had the same initials.

Agree about Amanda Platell - smug, self-satisfied, snooty bee-ach.

i agree with you. I dont think anyone is evil. Thats too easy a thing to say and it means we dont have to admit that theres usually a chain of events that lead people to behaving like this, and that chain of events might happen to us and theres a chance we may behave the same way.
Like i can pretend im a better person than Karen Mathews all i like but really its not about how good of a person i am its about the upbringing i had. I had a v good education, i was loved and supported, my family owned their own home and were able to take me on trips across the world. Im not saying ive never known pain and sufferring... but my start in life has made it easier for me to make good decisions. Its made it easier for me to be a good person.
For people who dont have love or education or money..... and especially for people who have violence and fear in their childhoods, making good decisions and being a good person becomes a lot harder.

So i dont think we should ever call anyone evil and we should try and have understanding for why the behaved as they did. If we do that we can help them from continuing to be like that and hopefully try and stop other people behaving like that.

I totally disagree Bat, some people have severe personality disorders and psychopathy, which makes them evil in their actions.

I actually think that in a few years you could see birth control tied to non receipt of benefits. I'd actually vote for it.

Birth control? You realise birth control is to prevent pregnancies? (As well as frequently being used to treat medical conditions.)

You want to ban people on benefits from using birth control? /head tilt/

Tabasco. I think they meant force people to take birth control by taking away their benefits if they don't.

Because the people who would vote for it only mean it for 'them'
Not themselves, anyone they love or anyone they like.

And THAT is how Trump got voted in.