should I apologize? (warning trans thread!)

[startrek90]

I have come to AIBU because people don't hold back.

The other day I posted on fb asking if anyone could recommend where I could get a toy kitchen cheap for my little boy. A friend and I were talking in the comments and I mentioned that my ds loves playing in the house at kindergarten and he apparently spends lots of time there. His teachers joked that they knew when I was weaning his brother because he was 'weaning' the baby doll at nursery. My friend and I were doing a general aww thing and then another acquaintance who was female but is now 'trans masculine gender queer' (I still have no idea what that is exactly, I assumed transgender) commented that my 2 year old was obviously identifying as a girl and sent me a link to mermaids?

I disagreed and just said he is a two year old and playing out what he sees. Since then I have benn inundated with stuff talking about trans children and their high risk of suicide.

We are talking everyday there was something else sent to me, I was tagged in etc..

I'll be honest I got pissed off with this as I don't believe in gender anyway so sent a pm very politely saying to stop it. My son is not trans he is 2.

Then there was a very public fb status about ignorant parents and how their kids will grow up to hate them. I know I should have ignored it but I commented again laying out my opinion about gender. I got accused of being a terf, that I was transphobic and my 'daughter' would grow up and either kill himself because of me or cut me out.

I admit I lost it and told this person to do one and fuck off. I blocked them (should have done it straight away) but now I have a mutual friend (who is also transgender but not so political with it) who contaced me in private saying how upset and worried our mutual acquaintance is and that I should unblock them, apologize for telling them to fuck off and make things up.

I don't think I should but was I out of order?

I used to "be" a horse... (I was really very little).
I also liked anything martial arts related from a young age. And I liked guns, bow and arrows etc... I'm happy being a human woman....

My stepsister said she wanted to be a boy called ... (insert name of her favourite literary hero, she kind of cycled through them periodically, I think.)

She isn't trans either.....

Last time I looked men cooked and fed babies (not breastfeeding obv.)

I wouldn't apologise either.

The world has gone fucking mental.

I really don't care less what gender people identify with or what they do with their genitals, but stop foisting this stuff on pre-pubesent children.

Part of me feels like, it might be better to engage with this person, as there is a possibility you could get them to think a little bit about what they have said, and questions some of the assumptions that they have made.

However, I understand why your reaction was shocked and angry: you must have come away from the exchange feeling that your child is under attack, and I can't really blame you.

Did you accuse them of being sexist by assuming traditional gender roles such as girls should be in the kitchen? You should have.

This with fucking bells on.

What would that person say to a stay at home father? That they weren't a man? FFS
This is what I hate about all this. I have so much sympathy and empathy for trans people and I hope they find happiness and peace. However there seem to now be this overwhelming thing that if you aren't conforming to your gender stereotypes then you are doing your gender wrong and must change.

she was purposefully misgendering my son based on outdated sexism gender norms. I have no intention of apologising to her

HerBluebiro this is a great response, not least because it uses language that the batshit acquaintance might take seriously (possibly).

Don't apologise for anything. Mermaids is a thoroughly homophobic & sexist group who are frankly dangerous to kids.

Absolutely fucking no way apologise. You are owed an apology imo, not that this dangerous fool would be in my life anymore iiwm

You're well rid and thank you for standing up to them. Every little helps

Wow! The ignorance is stunning. As the parent of a trans child you are absolutely NOT being unreasonable. What a ridiculous thing to assume re gender roles and stereotypes

A parent not the parent!

Startrek Of course do not apologize.

Tell your mutual friend to mind their own business. If they start pushing you to do what you do not want to do, I would block them too.

I think I would say do not engage.

But if you need to take it to pieces in your own head....

You know your son, I would imagine better than anyone in the world.
You know your views on gender and you will be informing him of your views which he may accept or reject, as he chooses when he is older.
Your so called friend has their agenda which they suggested to you.
You rejected their view.

"Since then I have been inundated with stuff talking about trans children and their high risk of suicide."

This person is a very dangerous person to have around your son. I would want them at arms length/out of my life. If you other mutual friend shares these views then I would also want them at arms length/out of my life.

"I'll be honest I got pissed off with this..." And you are right to be, stay angry, at least until the desire to be the usual 'polite-peaceful women' goes away! (I mean women are expected to be peace makers, not I expect you to be!)

"I have a mutual friend (who is also transgender but not so political with it) who contaced me in private saying how upset and worried our mutual acquaintance is and that I should unblock them, apologize for telling them to fuck off and make things up."

Why? To make the other person feel better? What are they worried and upset about? That they will not get to push your child towards a lifetime of uncertainty and medicalisation?

DO NOT let these people get into your head.

Fooshufflewickbannanapants I hope you are getting all the genuine help and support you need with your trans child and I really respect anyone struggling with these issues, just in case my post case across as 'bolshy'!

It's after midday now -doesn't that mean you're the fool?

Your child is being a child. Not being trans.

You don't need to apologise to anyone. I was playing with Action Man and toy soldiers when I was young.

Wassup Eating? Does this sound too crazy to be true?

Foosh

Sometimes I wonder.

My cousin is a trans man. He's a genuinely lovely person and just an all around great guy. But he likes some feminine things, even when he was a little kid. And nowadays he still likes to do people's hair and makeup...

That trans friend sounds genuinely badshit crazy.

(the less politically minded as well, btw)

I would keep them blocked and also tell mutual friend to keep their nose out of it. The person sounds like a lunatic

Don't apologise. Friend sounds a tad crazy

This is appalling and I would be sorely tempted to unblock purely to tell them they are a fucking idiot. A boy child plays with a doll and kitchen so is therefore a girl inside? Do boys not grow into men who cook, men who are fathers? Is Gordon Ramsey a woman now?

Ridiculous. Has made me angry so can't imagine how you feel.

"Since then I have been inundated with stuff talking about trans children and their high risk of suicide."

This person is a very dangerous person to have around your son. I would want them at arms length/out of my life. If you other mutual friend shares these views then I would also want them at arms length/out of my life.

Italiangreyhound makes a very good point. If you have someone insisting that a two-year old - a TWO YEAR OLD - will commit suicide when they are older if you do not trans them, they shouldn't be around young people at all. There's a very good reason that, eg, there's ethical standards for reporting suicide. If you repeatedly insist to young people that unless they do XYZ they will be at risk of suicide, then they are far more likely to become at risk of suicide, because it is painted as "inevitable". Suicide contagion is a real thing,.

Archery thanks. A few typos. Never mind you got the gist.

I grew up with a friend who was trans. He sufered tremendous dysphoria in puberty with boobs and periods etc. My experience tells me there are some children who are trans. I am, for want of a better word a believer. I don't know if my friend could have been spared such distress through earlier treatment, or if such distress is actually a necessary part of the diagnosis (in a similar way that knee pain is needed before someone with arthritis gets a knee op done.... just having knee arthritis without pain is not enough to proceed to the risks of surgical intervention). Im glad that i dont have to make these decisions.

But the vast majority of children are just children. And toys are toys. And making assumptions that a child is trans because they are playing is horrifically wrong on all levels. It is as harmful, if not more so than a parent seeing their son playing with a doll and forcing him to stop and play with a tool set or similar.

Toys are toys. At 2 children model their care givers. Male or female they copy what they see.

Keep those people very, very far away from your son.

If any other acquaintances start the bullshit, tell them that you pay him millions in Monopoly money, as he's playing at being a professional chief, which is totally masculine. (Provided it is really, really, really well paid)

But seriously, this is just not on, and I would assume the wacky acquaintance just suffers from a bad case of having internalized misogyny and not wanting it to apply to her.

Well tbf I have 6 of the buggers and have always been one to challenge stereotypes so there have never been any gender roles to worry about. And absolutely not upset by any comments italian it's not a struggle tbh as they are absolutely sure and the rest 9f the kids are absolutely totally non plussed 😂

I think I am probably quite well-known for being very pro-trans and trans-supportive, and happy to say this is completely nuts. Of course a toddler is not trans! A toddler might grow up to be trans (or to be GLB) but there's literally nothing in any kind of toddler play that indicates it and even if they do grow up to be GLBT no good can come of forcing it on them or encouraging it before at least adolescence. As long as boys aren't being actively forced to wear only blue and play with soldiers (and girls vice versa) what difference does it make? As long as parents are loving and supportive that's all that's needed imo.

I genuinely think this is dangerous, not just to kids but to actual trans people. Reducing trans to just "liking pink" or whatever is so offensive and marginalises the struggle of real transwomen imo.

Besides gender stereotypes are a social construct anyway. Throughout most of human history blue was considered a female colour and pink a male colour. Dolls and bricks are just bits of plastic, how can that be gendered? I don't know much about child development but I've read studies saying that having an interest in the biological differences between male and female is a standard stage of child development and that many boy children go through a stage of expressing a desire to not have a penis - it has nothing to do with "gender identity" it has to do with what happens when a baby starts growing up and becoming aware of itself as being a person separate from their mother and resisting this, wanting to "be like mummy."

I will start by saying I don't have a problem if people want to be whoever they want to be, and if people feel it's right for them to be a different gender than their genitalia might suggest then frankly I don't think it's my business. Having met a couple of m to f people socially I have always respectfully treated them as I would any other woman and never had any issues.

Having said that, it's absolutely not this persons business to judge your child based on outdated notions of who does the cooking and childcare. They sound batshit.

Comments about suicide and so on are ridiculous and offensive. Clearly this person has massive issues and frankly it's not your circus and not your monkeys. (I love that expression)

Any further attempt to make you apologise should in my opinion be met with an outraged feminist discussion on men are allowed to cook you know, how dare you suggest feeding a baby is women's work.

I'm a childminder and spend lots of time at toddler groups. I can tell you from lots of experience that two year olds don't give a flying ferrit about the "gender" of toys. They just play, every last one of them