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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

To think this is unfair on this 3 year old

266 replies

ogbu · 08/03/2017 19:44

My friends and I go on a night out every fortnight. We arrange childcare for the night. My son goes to his dads anyway on alternate weekends and most of us have a partner at home or get a babysitter.

Now our friend hasnt been able to find anyone who is willing to babysit as her daughter sleeps so on our nights out she gets dressed, then takes her daughter at 9pm to a childminder that does overnight care. She takes her in a taxi.

We don't go clubbing we're too old for that! But we have a meal and a few drinks. This friend always gets a bit too drunk. She then orders a taxi which I sometimes share. She gets to the childminders house in the taxi and picks her daughter up. Her daughter is handed over to her tired, disorientated and distressed as she's suddenly been woken up and put into a taxi. She also takes a while to get to sleep at the childminders so goes about 11pm to sleep so has only been asleep for about three hours at this point.

She then has a 20 minute taxi ride and my friend takes her home and into bed. At this point it's 3:30am easily. She then sleeps until late that day or wakes at her usual time as is grumpy.

I've always suggested my friend just collect her in the morning and give her a full nights sleep and her a chance to sober up so she's not picking her up drunk. But my friend will not even consider that as she then has to get a taxi in the morning or the hassle of the journey by public transport when she's hungover. She would rather pick her up after her night out.

I've not discussed this with friends and don't want to. so that's why I'm asking here.

I understand she has no one to have her daughter and she wants a night out. But there are other options.

We regularly meet at hers, we have day time meet ups, she could come for just the meal and be back earlier. I'm sure she could find someone to babysit at her house.

I just feel sorry for the daughter being kept awake until 10pm, woken at 2am to be transported into a taxi with her drunk mother, then having to stay awake for the taxi ride, taken home, put to bed again. Having her sleep pattern disrupted like that.

If it was necessary than that's different. But all this is so her Mum can go clubbing.

It's not a child protection concern. But AIBU to feel sorry for the little girl?

OP posts:
arethereanyleftatall · 08/03/2017 23:28

Regarding the disturbing sleep- whenever we have gone to friends for an evening and taken the dc with, we always ask the dc whether they would prefer to stay over the whole night, or to return in the middle of the night and then wake up as late as they like in the morning in their own beds, they always choose the latter option. As do we. It's nicer to wake up in your own bed IMO.

Original poster
ogbu · 08/03/2017 23:29

I've known her about 7 years. We ended contact after she moved away but she got back in contact with me about 8 months ago.

OP posts:
Jux · 08/03/2017 23:40

It's not an insurmountable problem.

Put the child to sleep on a sleeping bag, then she can be carried - sleeping bag and all - into the taxi without waking her up at all. If she's still very young, 2 or 3, she will quickly get used to it and barely notice when she's moved. Our parents did it. I have memories of occasionally waking in the car and falling back to sleep immediately. It was rather fun going to sleep in one place and waking up at home, in my bed, in the morning.

We did it a little with dd too when we were living in a van abroad. She could sleep anywhere and wake up in her bed, barely noticing when she was moved.. When it came to night time potty training, I was very glad that I could actually walk her to the loo in the middle of the night with her barely waking, and falling asleep almost immediately she got back in bed.

Just make it so that the moving of the child is done with as little fuss as poss so get the bag/s in the taxi first, and then pick her up in her sleeping bag as gently as poss, carry her into the taxi. If she wakes a little, just a quiet (very quiet) "shush darling, mummy's here, go back to sleep" is usually enough.

AndKnowItsSeven · 08/03/2017 23:50

It won't be cheaper to get a babysitter if she claims tax credits or uses childcare vouchers.

BlueFolly · 09/03/2017 00:51

can't see the big deal about interrupting the 3yr olds sleep once a fortnight

This.

Atenco · 09/03/2017 01:05

I'm the only friend she has SadSadSad

Trifleorbust · 09/03/2017 01:33

Agree with pp who say you aren't her friend. You don't like her Hmm

But this isn't great.

However, there is tipsy and there is drunk. I'm tipsy after two glasses of wine. I am drunk after the bottle. I would probably trust myself to put my 3 year old child to bed drunk from a physical perspective (although I don't think little kids should see their carers drinking regularly). I wouldn't trust myself to put them in a taxi and carry them round town, juat in case something happened.

Which is it?

SofiaAmes · 09/03/2017 01:35

If this is the worst thing that happens to a 3 year old in her life....seems to me that she's doing ok. Would be a lot worse if her mom has a breakdown because she has no friends (having a child can be very isolating) and is estranged from her family and her only friend that she sees once every 2 weeks, has now decided that she's not perfect enough.

Jux has offered some great advice on how to make it work. And maybe if she's in court with her ex, the current situation won't last very long because he will start having their dd some of the time.

nursebickypegs · 09/03/2017 01:46

I'm surprised the childminder hasn't said anything ?

TheStoic · 09/03/2017 02:13

Swap the weekends you go out so that you can have a babysitter for both your children at your house. Your friend can stay the night and go home the next day.

Original poster
ogbu · 09/03/2017 03:39

The stoic I'm not paying for a babysitter for my son, just so that she can come out. She's welcome to have a babysitter at mine and her daughter sleep at mine too. But I'm going out when my son goes to his dads as that's much more convenient for me and I'm not paying for a babysitter I don't need.

She doesn't drive so would have to get to mine with her daughter, then travel back in the morning. I doubt she would want to do that as she would see her current arrangement as more convenient.

OP posts:
TheStoic · 09/03/2017 03:42

I thought you might do that if you were really concerned about her daughter.

Original poster
ogbu · 09/03/2017 03:45

She could pay for the babysitter and do something in the day. That way she gets a childfree day.

She could let her ex see their daughter and have several days and night free.

She could actually let her parents know she's going out without her daughter and stand up to them and get a babysitter at her house.!

She has options. I do like her. But this childcare arrangement isn't acceptable I feel. She doesn't seem to want to do anything different though.

I shall talk to her about it. I'm sure she will get annoyed and never speak to me again. But I don't agree with the whole thing and what her daughter has to put up with every fortnight.

Her daughter hates going to the childminders. She shouldn't have to go.

OP posts:
Original poster
ogbu · 09/03/2017 03:47

No thestoic because this isn't essential for my friend. She doesn't need to get drunk every fortnight.

If it was to attend hospital or something necessary that's completely different. I'm not paying for a babysitter so her mum can get pissed. No chance.

OP posts:
TheStoic · 09/03/2017 03:54

So the current arrangement would be OK if she wasn't drinking/getting drunk?

sameoldscene · 09/03/2017 04:23

I think the poster that suspected you are looking for an out was correct.
If you feel as desperate for the child as you claim- l think you'd find a way to help. By rejigging things a bit possibly?
I believe you know you are tired of her tagging along on your nights out.
How many of you are in the group?

PodgeBod · 09/03/2017 04:52

It's pretty poor really and I would feel really uncomfortable sharing a taxi under those circumstances. She should cut it down to once a month if paying for the childminder is a factor and put up with the hassle of going out in the morning. I think once a month is still pretty regular to go out especially if she has an active daytime social life. Or ideally the father would have her DD.
I love a good night out but between one thing and another haven't been able to for almost 3 years. It sucks but that's how it is sometimes when you have kids.

Dinnerout1 · 09/03/2017 04:55

you go out drinking till 2am.. That's quite late to just go for a couple of drinks which it probably isn't. Had meal between 7-9pm? It's quite along time to go out especially not having the right child care. It's dangerous for the little girl to be put this this because her mum is intoxicated.. Anything could happen... To the child or the mother.
If you said you had gone to pick little girl up at 12 then that's not too bad but 3.30 am!
Your friend also needs to see her actions in all of this.. Fair enough have a couple of drinks but not over do it because she's picking her daughter up and why stay out so late?

Trifleorbust · 09/03/2017 05:17

Have you posted before, OP? Does your friend have conservative, religious parents and hides her activities from them? If so, am pretty sure you don't like her.

Mummyoflittledragon · 09/03/2017 05:43

It's not an ideal situation. It's not abuse either surely. Even if the cm were the loveliest person ever, her dd possibly still wouldn't like going as it's a disruption to her routine. Moreover, she is picked up by her mummy acting a bit wierd in the middle of her sleep.

You say it isn't fair and yet don't want to help with a solution or compromise. It's entirely your choice. But I find it very sad that as an adult you'd rather just take another taxi to avoid becoming upset yourself and then come on here to berate your friend.

Sundance01 · 09/03/2017 06:39

I'm another one going to say this was extremely common in the past - we used to go to social clubs to drink and kids were allowed - often parents did not go home until the kids had fallen asleep on benches or someone else would take them all to their house and they could collect on our way home. I remember this as a child.

One place we went with my kids did lock ins every week and we didn't leave until 2/3 am.

Its not perfect parenting but hey ho neither is sticking your kid in childcare from 8-6 every day in my opinion. - it's just doing what you need to do to get through life and is doing little harm.

PetalMettle · 09/03/2017 06:57

Oh great @sundance01 so taking your child to nursery/childminder in the day so you can work is the same as giving them a disrupted night and then picking them up pissed in the middle of the night?
Must be nice to be so loaded you don't need to work

WeMustGetOffTheMountain · 09/03/2017 07:06

Its not perfect parenting but hey ho neither is sticking your kid in childcare from 8-6 every day in my opinion. - it's just doing what you need to do to get through life and is doing little harm.

How can you compare having a child in nursery from 8-6 so you can work to provide for that child, to disturbing your young child's sleep every couple of weeks so you can get intoxicated? If getting drunk is what you need to do to "get by" then I'm afraid there is a problem. There are other ways to unwind that don't involve putting your child in danger.

I'm actually quite shocked that people think this is OK. I like a drink as much as the next person, but I find these circumstances not only bizarre, but dangerous.

Trifleorbust · 09/03/2017 07:10

Sundance01:

What a nasty little comment.

Megatherium · 09/03/2017 07:12

If this is the worst thing that happens to a 3 year old in her life....seems to me that she's doing ok.

But it appears that she hates it, and I'm not surprised. Why subject your child to something she hates when it's totally avoidable?

Would be a lot worse if her mom has a breakdown because she has no friends (having a child can be very isolating) and is estranged from her family and her only friend that she sees once every 2 weeks, has now decided that she's not perfect enough.

If you RTFT, you will see that OP sees her considerably more frequently than every two weeks, and she sees her own parents often.

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