To think this is another new evil low of the tories

[seagazer]

www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/housing-benefit-young-people-18-21-scrapped-universal-credit-exemptions-a7610581.html
But on the other hand corporation tax is being lowered.

Gloria, people are answering YOUR questions but you are not giving them the same courtesy.

If a young person comes from a brutal chaotic background (and trust me I work daily with young people who HAVE) . Then getting themselves up and to college everyday is MUCH harder than if they come from stable and comfortable backgrounds. The fact that so many DO manage to do this despite their experience is amazing and they deserve all the help in the world INCLUDING help to keep a roof (even a shared roof) over their heads.

I don't need to read the Guardian and panic...I see it daily with my own eyes. Some help IS available but many young people cannot go home...because home is not a nice place.

Gloria's assumptions are as ignorant and absurd as they are insulting. I think she has forgotten that mumsnet has a range of users from all walks of life, and prefers to sneer at liberalmetropolitanelitechampagesocialistGuardianreadungdo-gooders

One of the housing bloggers (have you heard of blogs Gloria and do you know what they are) is saying there is not an exemption for 18 to 21 year old carers,

Carers are a group that are taken advantage of including by the medical profession Gloria My cousin is in his 50s but i shall use him as an example anyway. He is the only child of my aunt who had a hip operation nearly four months ago and still hasnt got out of bed and wont help herself at all.

The doctor has been around and said " Never mind these things take time. My cousin is doing it all and every time he suggests she tries to do a tiny bit of muscle stretching she turns on the tears.

I suspect if my cousin said he couldnt cope any more and threw in the towel the doc wouldnt be doing the "Never mind " routine. He would be trying to get her to do more. He doesnt have to when my cousin is doing it all though.

Family/friends caring for others save the govt a fortune! My aunt was a carer for over 20 years for 2 different family members. When the 2nd one died within weeks despite having health issues of her own (were in process of getting diagnosed at time) she was pressured into getting work. She ended up taking a temp job as felt she'd no choice. It was quite a physical job and has made her health worse, royally messed up her finances as no money for a month when she started work ditto when the job finished, took her years to get right again.

She's now disabled yet has to pay for the carers she has in and the stress every time she has to explain and re-apply for the little money she does get adds to her ill health (rare condition, few Drs have even heard of it - why it took so long to get a diagnosis).

Carers are treated appallingly in this country.

As for Young carers I don't think they should even exist, a child should not have that responsibility!

What's the bets Gloria's never had difficulty finding a job, never had serious ill health, never had serious financial worries?

Ime people that talk this way that's usually the case.

Graphista It could get very interesting. eg. Imagine the disabled person a carer is caring for loses their PIP because they are deemed to not have any care needs.

The carer has to go out to work or just decides they cant cope anymore.

And the disabled person has an accident at home.

The system cannot blame the carer for not fulfilling care needs that the system deemed were not needed. So surely the carer cant be charged with neglect.

This is merely hypothetical But certainly food for thought!

I think that scenario is possibly already happening, I'd be interested to know how much geriatric admissions have increased since the tories pure (post coalition) got in.

Rates have increased monotonically with age: while the rate rose by only 10% over the period for the 65 to 69 age group, it rose by 50% for the 90 and over age group.
Centre for Health Service Economics and Organisation.

The increases have been year on year since 2001, but significant increases have been noted since 2012.

Interestingly, some of the learning disabled adults I support told me back in 2015, that they voted for the Tories because they were told wrongfully by their parents that they had to vote for them because if they voted for Labour or others they would lose their benefits [anger]

Having spoken to my dbro about this, he told me that when he worked at a residential college, every student was given a polling card in the last GE and the students who don't have the capacity to understand (non-verbal etc) were "helped" by the staff to vote. My dbro said he felt it wasn't right as he would be using his own political beliefs to influence their vote.

Between us, we've met some support staff who have been quite bitter about disabled people on benefits and always begrudge them, so I wouldn't have been surprised if some of them supporting had deliberately put a cross next to the Tories for those students who lacked capacity.

Certainly during my time in Supported Living from the ages of 20-24, I was looked down on for wanting to better myself by the staff, e.g. I would come home from work and find a member of staff and a couple of his favourites in the car park making pointed digs at me. It was almost as if working made the support staff's jobs harder. And when my job ended, I was told by my keyworker that "Employers won't hire disabled people but you've got your benefits, you've managed on those before and you will again." .

And another thing before I jump off my soapbox - my local college gives discounts on college courses to those on HB - so what will happen to those aged 19-21 who are trying to make a better life for themselves and now they have to pay full price for their college courses out of their benefits. I'm pretty sure some will end up dropping out as they will no longer afford to go to college so that will mean more young futures wasted.

So it IS already happening. Own goal there surely it's cheaper to keep the status quo than increase hospital admissions....

Of course I'm FORGETTING they want the nhs to look like it isn't working so they can privatise it

so I wouldn't have been surprised if some of them supporting had deliberately put a cross next to the Tories for those students who lacked capacity.

Wow. Thats a huge accusation to make.

I work at a day centre with LD adults, Gloria. I've heard the staff saying things like "No-one should be on benefits, they should all be working". The people we support have very severe LD and can just about manage a couple of hours voluntary work. I've also heard lovely little gems such as "You need to be nice to me and Jane (Not her real name) as we pay your benefits". "John Smith (again not his real name) gets £900 a month in benefits that's more than what I get a month, it's not fair waaah". "Your money comes from taxpayers, why should I pay more tax for you to have more carers?". These are all things I've heard members of staff say at my workplace. Not all support workers and carers are nice caring people.

I was introduced to our Tory MP at a do last night. He was new in 2015 and has voted for every single one of their proposals since then. In the meantime he is concerning himself with trying to propose a bill to cull herring gulls.

I met a Tory councillor a little while ago (in a non-political setting - he was I suppose what you'd call a 'compassionate Conservative.' After a couple of G&Ts he was very scathing about the average Tory politician's attitude towards social housing.

Becca, I know you're unwell and exhausted yourself, but if you're up to it, would you consider telling the story of your friend having her benefits stopped for not dying on time to John Pring at www.disabilitynewsservice.com/

You can also submit material to the Work and Pensions Commons Select Committee.
www.parliament.uk/business/committees/committees-a-z/commons-select/work-and-pensions-committee/

From memory (so might be wrong), you should address your material to the secretary of the committee, although you can also send it to an MP on the committee if in doubt. Again from memory, sending stuff to select committees is an exception to the general rule that only your own MP can deal with your correspondence.

(I haven't written to them since Anne Begg was chair and now can't find my correspondence, but I was certainly permitted to send them material.)

. Your money comes from taxpayers, why should I pay more tax for you to have more carers
What pathetic ignorant idiots, pity the poor people being cared for by people like that.

HunterofStars Your collugues who do that are sick and disgusting.

You would think they would be a bit more careful though in light of the secret filming that took place at Winterbourne View and other places.

Gloria i cant remember whether it was you or someone else who said "there are plenty of care jobs available" To do that kind of job you have to WANT to do it. People forced into it would create abusive situations like the one Hunter describes.

Gloria, I am making an accusation now. You have failed to answer ANY questions posed to you in this thread while others have answered yours.

Now either you are a goady fucker/troll OR you know that what is happening is reprehensible but cannot respond in any other way than you are currently doing. Either you are stupid or you don't actually care about the most vulnerable in society.

Care to actually respond with anything coherent beyond the "wow that's a big accusation" type posts? Or are you indeed a GR/troll?

Ive been here long enough to know how these threads go...

Can't think of anything to say? then ask a question

Still struggling, accuse the poster of being goady/troll/disablist/ageist

I'm entitled to my views.

You are entitled to you (abhorrent and untrue) views. However, if you post them on the internet then you should expect those who know more than you to question and challenge said views. If you are unable to back said views up with facts then expect opprobrium. If you can't deal with that, don't bother posting your views.
So far you've provided nothing to support your views and when questioned you've fallen back in to the logical fallacy trap. Not really working, is it.

You've not actually said what those views are though Gloria, just asked an a lot of questions which people have been good enough to answer.

So ...where do you stand?

Is it right that a young person struggling is left without support when they cannot go home? Please do enlighten us and tell us your views and if you think this IS acceptable then why you think that way?

So far you've just posted a load of apologist rubbish about middle class students with nice home lives being able to get to college. You wanted to know why if they could do so that poorer students couldn't do the same. I personally doubted your intelligence that you had to even ASK that question.

People answered you though, some of us work daily with students getting to college despite everything, it gets a bit frustrating when a crisis happens and there is no support for that student.

You've not acknowledged ANY of those posts but just posted more inflammatory comments. Is it any wonder that people think you are being goady?

Yes those threads always do go a certain way because most people have compassion....I am guessing you have a hole where that compassion should be. I hope I am wrong though.

What is your NHS job Gloria.

I've answered all YOUR questions I don't think it's unreasonable to expect you to answer at least SOME of the questions you've been asked Gloria.

I've backed up my opinions with facts and research, as have others, you haven't. I'd also like to know what your nhs role is though I think I have an idea.

I've posted this before but think I need to post it again. I'm a mental health nurse and, until a year ago, worked in a team for young people experiencing a first episode of psychosis. in December 2015, I visited a patient at home. She told me that she had no money. She had no money because she had failed to attend a work capability assessment so her benefits had been stopped.
She didn't attend the appointment because she didn't open the letter telling her to attend. She didn't open the letter because she thought it was contaminated.
Previously, she could have applied for a crisis loan but the coalition abolished them. She couldn't ask her family for money because most of them were were in Africa and the ones in the UK had disowned her when she got ill. She couldn't ask friends because she didn't have any. I gave her £10 which was all I had on me and information about Crisis at Christmas even though I knew she wouldn't go as she was too paranoid to walk into a room full of people she didn't know. I also gave her a food bank voucher.
When I came back to work after Christmas, I turned on my work phone to hear a voicemail from the Police to say that she'd been found hanged in a local park on New Years Day.When they broke into her flat, they found that she had no gas or electricity and no food in the fridge or cupboards. It breaks my heart to think of her sitting in the cold and dark and hungry in the season of Goodwill to all men. She didn't leave a note so her suicide may have had nothing to do with her money being stopped but I'm pretty sure i didn't help. She was 19.

Hoolies i remember you posting that

Incredibly sad and horrific and should not have happened. angry]
You did what you could

Others failed her.