to think that a known bully shouldn't be rewarded

[Konmariconvert]

I do name change periodically and this is my first post under my latest name change.

My ds YR4 (and two other boys) have separately been the victim of bullying in school by the same boy. Unbeknown to me at the time the other boys parents have been into school at different times over the last 6 months. The bullying was nasty and bully boy got his groupies to get in the act too.

This boy has been dealt with by the head, who incidentally believed every word I was saying about this boy. I don't know if sanctions were issued but frankly I just wanted the bullying to stop. This boy has calmed down and ds keeps a wide birth. He's back to his normal self and would tell me if not.

Here's the thing... school have just picked their football team, only 10 boys were picked from 40, bully boy has been given a spot. Part of me thinks this is wrong and sends the wrong message to bully boys victims and their parents given that this was only dealt with very recently.

😳

Prioritising the bully (because it is easier) and prioritising the school, because supporting and being inclusive of 'problem children' gives the school a good reputation (as long as you can squash the victims)

Mumsnet double standards at their finest

This child - this 8-9 year old child - who is old enough to know which types of behaviour constitutes bullying and whether they are acceptable or not - is being sent a clear message. If you're good at a sport, it doesn't matter what your behaviour is like because we want to win at football.

I don't believe for one moment he is so good at football that an equally good soccer player among the 30 people not picked for the team couldn't be found.

And he will grow up, knowing that as long as he is good at something his behaviour will be accepted. And then maybe one day he will be in the news as Ched Evans was (remember the baying for his blood?) - and there will be outrage.

I seem to recall people saying during the whole Ched Evans thing - regardless of the fact he was tried and punished - he should never be allowed to play for a top football team again.

Yes I know some think this is "just school football" and "just a 9 year old" and "bullying isn't on the same level as rape" .... this is where it starts. This is where children learn what is and isn't acceptable. This is where the consequence for unacceptable behaviour means you don't get to be on the school team, or in the school maths championships being applauded, or a lead part in the school play. This is where you damn well learn to be a functioning member of society and not a narcissistic predator.

(My son was bullied badly too)

Actually hic, another part of my (very long) complaint to school is that my dd has wen told by the head teacher 'I don't believe you' and the deputy head has repeatedly told both of us that this boy is very nice/he can't help it/he doesn't mean to hurt you/he can't control himself....corner stones of rape culture

Double standards indeed

The times a poster starts a thread relating to their child's behaviour only to be told by the MN masses that they are not being tough enough, or not setting boundaries, or not setting good examples, and how they should be focusing on correcting their child's behaviour rather than making excuses for them!

Honestly, if my child had bullied another to the extent of OP or my example, then I would not be allowing them to play football for the school. No rationale adult thinks this is ok

My DD has been the victim of some horrible bullying in the past, but if one of the bullies actually managed to achieve enough to get picked for a school team, I would think it was a good thing that they may be channelling their energies in a more positive direction and therefore be more likely to leave my DD alone.

What actually happens to this boy is none of your business. You have been told he has been dealt with and appeared happy with that until he got on the football team.

Bullying was dealt with according to OP. At what point is it acceptable to chose the 8 year old child who has already been punished to play in the football team? Will he now be known as the bully until he leaves that school?

A week ago, this child a week ago was being dealt with for bullying.
Now he has got a much sought after place .
How can that not be seen as a reward?
People mention how young he is.
So are his victims, what does it tell them, the victims?

The point it is acceptable is when the child has stopped bullying others for a sustained period of time best names

It's not difficult

When you see attitudes like those on this thread, poor little boy give him a chance etc., - FFS can you not see this is why bullying is so widespread? The girls that bullied my DD went on to prosper and never changed or recognised their behaviour; their parents' attitude was that their kids could do nothing wrong. And this was in a naice village. The bullies were particularly privileged too.

Oh FFS. They are NINE. On MN if you suggested leaving a 9 year old on their own at home for 20 mins you'd be accused of child neglect because they are too young to take responsibility for themselves, make appropriate decisions or know what to do in certain situations for even a few minutes. But do something awful like bullying and comparisons are made with rapists and narcissistic predators?

Nine is the age you may be TOLD what is acceptable or not but you don't necessarily understand why things are good or bad and empathy is not fully formed.

People always say ' they know right from wrong' on these threads but ignore the fact children judge 'right from wrong' on what they've been told and not because they really understand the complexities of actions and the consequences. Executive functioning develops over time.

That's why we have age limits on sexual activity, smoking, alcohol use and voting. That's why we don't let 9 year olds make their own decisions about bedtime, whether they want to do their homework or go to school, washing, brushing teeth etc. Because they make shit decisions. Because they're children.

"You have been told he has been dealt with and appeared happy with that until he got on the football team." - yes the OP was willing to let it lie but it can't have been dealt with if the boy was picked for the team a few days later - one negates the other!

That is why adults have go teach them that actions have consequences.
So bully cant try out for team until they have proved they are no longer a bully.
They hopefully change and all is well,
But a week!, really that is not long enough

zzz *MY 6 YEAR OLD DAUGHTER IS VOMITING 50+ TIMES A DAY. SHE IS UNDER THE CARE OF A CLINICAL PAEDIATRICIAN AND IS BEING REFERED TO A COMMUNITY PEADIATRICIAN. THE CASE IS BEING REFERRED TO SOCIAL SERVICES. SHE HATES HERSELF BECAUSE SHE IS FAT/HER HAIR IS CURLY. SHE WONT TOLERATE SOCKS OR SLEEVES OR BEDCLOTHES. SHE HAS BEEN OUT of school for 5 WEEKS. I HAVE BEEN OFF WORK

I want to break a few noses, I tell you

My ds was severely bullied.

At no point did I ask my ds to break another child's nose or call for the bully to be banned from the football team that kinda makes you a bit of a grown up bully or very childish at least!

I reported each and every incident in writing. I asked for a copy of the anti bullying policy. I wrote to the school. I informed them of their duty of care and if they could not guarantee my son's safety and emotional well being I would remove him from school and inform the local authority, the Education welfare officer, Ofsted, my MP etc etc of my exact reasons for doing so.

Yes Fighter - because this is where it starts.

This is where the 9 year old learns that bad choices have consequences and choosing to behave in a bullying manner results in not being allowed to be in a position of popularity within a school team.

This is where the 9 year old learns that his want to behave in a certain way does not trump someone else's want to go to school without being harmed emotionally or physically.

This is where the 9 year old learns not to grow up into an adult bully.

Bullies are made and not born. This is where it starts.

Well yes fighter part of our bullying WAS 'sexual assault'

BUT...they are just young/thought they were playing a game/was inncocent exploration

My 6 year old with healthy boundaries is NOT a learning aid for the children of fuckwits who do not know how to raise children

Annah - I bet you do. Your pain comes across very clearly. I am sorry for your pain and for the pain of your child. But I will not and cannot demonise another 6 (or 8....and beyond) year old child for unacceptable behaviour. Because they're children. And they fuck up because they're children. And your post suggests there may be other neuro developmental issues at play woth your child which need to be investigated and hopefully will be now even though that's because your child has been so distressed and altered by her experiences that they've come into contact with services.

But this thread wasn't about that. The thread was about a bully being spoken to - which they were. And whether or not they should have other sanctions. Some people said yes. Other people said no.

People's opinions aren't minimising the impact of bullying which we all know can be huge. It's looking at all aspects of this situation which involves very young children.

Schools anti bullying polices are a load of rubbish. Written to fob off parents with. So what if the bullying wasn't done during football. A punishment should be used for bullying and I think not being part of the football team is a good start. I also think children caught bullying should have to stand up in assembly and apologise to their victim. A bit of public humiliation so they can get a taste of the humiliation they put their victims through.

Do you know the punishment for bullies at my ds school? They miss 15 minutes of their playtime at lunch. Yep. I know, must be horrific for them ey? And they wonder why the bullies are still doing it 3 years later. Personally I think primaries just fob it off until such time as the kid leaves in year 6 and then it's the secondary schools problem.

But having been punished separately excluding him from the team woukd be a further or additional punishment. When does it stop? No you can't have cake todsy because you bullied x last week/last month etc. You can't keep continually punishing a child if the behaviour is not ongoing. I fully agree that if there is further bad behaviour in the future then missing training and matches are appropriate sanctions.

It sounds as if your child has suffered horribly at the hands of her bullies Anna and that it hadn't been dealt with appropriately. However we don't know if that is the case here.

Ok, whatever then. Fuck you