... to dislike my future son-in-law?

[ElinorRigby]

We had a rare visit from him and my daughter today - the first time we've seen him in over a year. They live in London - about 2 hours away. We sometimes see my daughter in Central London, but her partner is normally 'too busy' to come along.

The nearer the wedding comes - it's scheduled for August - the more I struggle with his behaviour. He's nearly 30 - some of the traits which I put down to adolescence being full of himself don't seem to have worn off. My daughter has been going out with him for over 10 years, and he is the only boyfriend she has ever had.

So today he informed me, when I asked him about his job he told me that I didn't know anything about the corporate world.

He mansplained all sorts of things about a university which I attended and he didn't attend.

He began eating as soon as food was put in front of him. (My husband cooked.)

He didn't thank us for the meal.

He didn't ask either of us anything about our own pursuits or opinions but spent the entire time talking about what he'd done and what he thought.

Interestingly they had travelled up to go to the wedding reception of one of my daughter's oldest friends - before the friend and her new husband emigrate. However, at the last minute he decided he was 'too tired' and so my daughter went to the event on her own.

So is my daughter marrying a rude selfish tosser?

Sounds so like my ex. To be honest, it did help when a couple of friends and my mum said things like "are you really happy?". It got the cogs turning gently.

Hopefully she'll come around, Op.

There's worse things she can marry than someone who's just lacking the perfect manners you seem to expect.
Maybe he doesn't see you often because of the standoff ish way you sound to come across to him.

Really feel for you! It's difficult when you are worried. I have a very good friend who has married a guy a lot of us (her friends) have massive concerns about.. & other friends have hinted I should of said something to her.. but I knew it wasn't my place & would jeopardise the friendship. I just listen when she has troubles & I often comment 'I personally wouldn't tolerate that from my BF/DH'.. I hope it doesn't end in tears.. but if it does I'll just be there.. x harder when it's your daughter.. I think put the right way I would accept concern from my mum.. but as it happens she thinks the sun shines out my DH's a*se! Hope it all works out OP

I went out with someone for 8 years, and eventually moved in with him. It didn't work out after only living together for 9 months (he was a nightmare! Looking back I always knew but living together definitely cemented this for me! - weirdly he sounds very similar to your future SIL) I later found out that all my friends and family HATED him and I felt a bit betrayed. I wished they had said something. I understand your reticence to say something but maybe you should speak to one of her close friends and see what they think about him?? Maybe there are some sides to him you're not seeing? If her friends agree then maybe they can say something to her?

Had reservations about DD and a partner of what turned out to be three years (not her first bf).Two years in, I told her what her father and I thought ,as gently as possible. She did get upset .I ended by saying that I would never say another word on the matter (I didn't)and if she decided her long term future lay with himr we would obviously welcome him into our family etc .as indeed we had hithertoo tried to do .He was somewhere on the autistic spectrum and he was very hard to get to know /feel affection towards. I could see why in some ways he and DD were suited and I did acknowledge this .But he was a ditherer who couldnt settle to anything ,including a 'proper'job (They were 27 when they got together)and one of the things I pointed out was that she would probably always be the major, if not the only, breadwinner .Which was fine as long as she was ok with that but might be an issue if they wanted a family .
It has taken her about 18months to get over the ending of the relationship but she acknowledges we were right. I think what started her questioning it was an incident on which I was careful not to comment but two of her female friends did . Her friends quite liked him.and we didn't actively dislike him but I could not see a long term future for her with him .
I"m afraid I would have to approach the subject with her and not just before the wedding either

OP, please ask your daughter why he makes her happy and what she hopes their future will be like.
I married my rude, selfish and ultimately (when he couldn't get his own way) abusive ex because I couldn't see what all my family and friends could see. No one wanted to criticise him because he was my choice so they said nothing.
I was divorced within 2 years, having wasted a stupid amount of money on a wedding.
If someone had said to me on my wedding day that I didn't have to go through with it I wouldn't have married him. I knew I wasn't happy but everything had gone too far for me to feel able to back out.
You don't need to criticise him, just try to open up communication with her about how she feels.

Many moons ago..when my parents were alive and I was blindly in love, with a guy who sounds just like your future SIL, my dear mother kept her reservations to herself. We thankfully never married in the end, and my mother only revealed her reservations many years after, but I do think you have to let me our daughter live her own life, and make her own mistakes, that is assuming this ever amounts to what you might think is a mistake! All you can do is be supportive towards both of them. Time can only tell ...

I seem to be the only one to say that YANBU to dislike your son-in-law. I am a great believer in gut instinct. If your gut is telling you there is something off about this guy....you are probably right.

Unlike the others, I do think that it may be possible to have a conversation with your daughter about him. Are you close? Does she confide in you? If she is inexperienced, she might believe that in ending the relationship, she abandons all chance of marriage. children, social conformity, etc. If he is her only boyfriend, she has no frame of reference and knows only that type of relationship, ie, that all men are selfish, egotistical rats. She probably has doubts, but if no-one else speaks up and tells her that they too have concerns, she is unlikely to act.

I would definitely not take the 'he's a tosser, we don't approve, don't marry him' route. Rather, test things gently. Start with an 'any wedding nerves?' conversation, and if she admits to them, gently explore why she is worried. If she tells you she is deliriously happy with him, you really have nowhere to go. However, if she does have concerns you can gently agree with her and say that you had noticed these behaviours, too, and were worried for her. Rassure her that you will support her whatever her decision going forward.

I'm afraid I wouldn't be able to hold back speaking out but I would have done it years ago, subtly and with caution.

On a separate note, your daughter aside, I would have commented by now to future SIL about his table manners and reminded him of accepted courtesies. It wouldn't matter a jot to me what he thought of me and I accept that might cause a rift with daughter but I'm not interested in saying nothing for the sake of family superficial harmony.

I wish you all the best with whatever you decide to do. x

I have to agree that he sounds like a rude selfish tosser-just like my ex husband.I'm afraid that all you can do is be there for your daughter if it goes horribly wrong,but if you can have a diplomatic chat with her first, do so as if you are lucky she might have second thoughts.

I'd like to echo what others have said - keep lines of communication with your DD open. Gently. She'll understand that you will continue to be there for her if things don't work out - that you won't judge.

I wish my DM had done just that in the days running up to my first marriage. I tried talking to her about my reservations - she didn't want to know. Better that she had put her foot in it than her refusal to listen or talk to her daughter whom she professed to love.

So talk - listen - and be there, as you surely will be. Sorry about the future son in law - maybe over time, if things work out, he'll learn something useful about manners and family relationships from you, your DH and family.

Have you asked outright if she feels valued and cherished by him. I'd ask if her brother is invited, if not, why not. Asking the question might invite her in a private moment to be more critical of her acceptance of gross behaviour - it might cause a row - but if asking caring questions of your own daughter leads to WW3 then there is something wrong all round. I'd not have let the 'intelligence' thing pass - being put down by the man who claims to love you? Insulting your daughter in front of you?
Be there for her - but sometimes tough love is important too.

How about asking her friends over for a. Prewedding weekend- over.open house..plenty wine, food...ask them kindly " is he good enough for my daughter", explain you dont really know him and you want her to be happy. If her friends like him they will share positive stories and you may find common ground over a bottle (s) of wine . If they dislike him they will also share with you the negative stories. This isnt sneaky...she is your daughter and you are still her mother and advocate. Enough wine and she may well disclose WHY she is so keen to wed! Tell her your only wish is for her to be happy..give examples..positive from your own life and relationships DONT SLAG HIM OFF EVER. Offer them a prewedding couples course ( most vicars run one and in the Catholic faith they are virtually unavoidable) you can only lead her towards talking about future plans. A selfish man rarely changes and is often worse under pressure ( buying a house, starting a family). Have plenty mum and daughter weekends so she can offload and relax. Make your relationship even stronger. Tell her that married life takes work and you will always still be there for her if she wants anything. Completely avoid discussing him unless she does. She needs to lean on you more than ever..make sure she knows she can..and even big scarey decisions can be right..and you will support her. Can you visit them? See them together at home? With friends? ( make an excuse to buy wedding shoes or the like). If you are shouldering the majority of the wedding cost you are also emotionally and financially invested in making sure of their relationship too. Make sure she knows a delay or cancellation wll not push her away..she is yours and she is loved...in short be the most incredible support you can be now..and after..the rest...you will still be there.Good luck.

On my wedding day my mum asked if I was really happy and sure I was doing the right thing for me and if I wasn't it would be ok. I was mortally offended at the time but now look back and think it was really sweet. Still married 10 years on.

Don't think my father approves of any of my boyfriends, particularly not the one I married. Didn't vocalise it, but it was clear. I have latterly realised it undermined me in that he didn't believe or support my life choices.
Now as a parent, I am trying to support my grown up children's choices. It definitely isn't easy and I want to weigh in with my 'greater experience'. So far, have managed to bite my tongue, but it is hard.

I wonder if people who talk only about themselves know how boring they are? I've known several!

I suspect that many of us wouldn't be the type of person our ILs would choose for their children. I'm certainly not - not sociable enough, not smarmy or cheerful enough.

When MIL realised that 'I was the same as her darling boy' she said that we were well-suited!

Wow, to just decide you're a bit too tired to go to a wedding of a good friend of you're wife's to be after travelling miles - speachless! So is he just spend the day in your spare room sleeping???

Nevermind his rudeness to you!

He is a selfish, rude tosser. BUT he is HER selfish, rude tosser! 😂

I married into a middle class family, I'm from a working class background. I often realise that I have managed to offend my in laws because I'm rather lacking in social graces. It actually doesn't feel very nice when you are expected to behave in a way in which you are not accustomed. I try my best but know that I will never live up to their expectations, which is a bit sad because I'm a nice person and my husband and I are very happy together. I'm just saying you could be wrong and could be letting your expectations cloud your judgement. He might feel uncomfortable about being judged by you and your daughters friends and this might be why he avoids visits.

I'd probably have sweetly asked him to enlighten me about the corporate world just to see what he came out with. For the university 'Have you spent much time there?' Perhaps he had an interview! As to his vast intelligence 'What makes you say that?' or a rambling digression into different types of intelligence, emotional for instance! He seems to lack emotional intelligence himself.
He sounds gauche and insensitive which may be why he struggled to get his first job.
To me it seems that not to invite his soon to be brother-in-law to the wedding is thoughtless but it's up to your DD really, not her partner. Can you bring the subject up without mentioning the bridegroom?
Is he from a culture which doesn't value women? Does he put his own mother down? Making friends with her might make you understand why he's such a rude guest.

My mum made it very obvious that she didn't like my sister's boyfriend, who eventually became her husband. He was a bit disparaging about my sister very very occasionally, which got all our backs up. The relationship decemdend into a huge disaster, he had multiple affairs, they are now divorced.
My mum asked my sister before they got married if she was sure, and actually advised against it. They still went ahead and got married.

There isn't really anything you can do, but do gently suggest tht she doesn't HAVE to get married.

As to the food, if he comes for another meal serve him last!

What Smallchanceofrain said.

Yanbu to dislike him. Someone in my family married a guy much like this, it has NOT gone well, still together but neither respect the other, both miserable, kids sad in the middle. I didn't have the guts to chat to her about why she thought he'd make her happy / be a good husband/dad, and I really wish I had. I didn't find out until years after it that she considered calling off the wedding. Wish I'd known that at the time.

I think it's been 10 years, you've left it too late. The time to say something would have been a couple of years in, or when they moved in together. Now they have a lot of shared history and a shared life and frankly, your opinion isn't worth what it once was when weighed against a decade long relationship, support in further education / career, living together etc.

Keep your opinions to yourself.

Oh and consider if she tends to surround herself with controlling people - maybe take a look at your/her dads attitude to her. Did she learn this was normal growing up? Just a thought.