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Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

...to ask you to support this event?

342 replies

Niamer · 11/02/2017 23:26

www.uniteforeurope.org

  • we are about to spend £120 billion extricating ourselves from the EU. That money is desperately needed in health and social care sectors.
  • many Leave campaign promises, voted for in good faith are untrue
  • millions of people directly affected by Brexit were not allowed a vote.
-the referendum was advisory. To have been binding, a supermajority would have been needed to make such a huge constitutional change.
  • Brexit is likely to result in the permanent break-up of the UK.
  • we are turning our back on our friends and allies of 40 years
  • EU citizens in the UK are uncertain of their rights and in many cases feel unwelcome.

I don't like particularly enjoy going to London, I hate crowds, but I HAVE to be at this march. Please consider attending and sharing this event. We are all victims of a fraudulent campaign and are facing a Tory hard destructive unopposed Brexit. I will NOT let this happen to my children without a fight.

OP posts:
NarkyMcDinkyChops · 15/02/2017 11:04

Mining, steel, all of it...it wasn't the EU that killed it off, that was all home grown strife. It's just scapegoatery.
And you've made out huge with EU money. What do you think is going to happen when that's all gone....do you think the Tories are going to make sure money goes to your deprived areas like the EU did? Keep dreaming.

birdybirdywoofwoof · 15/02/2017 11:34

not how to best preserve the comfort, convenience and lifestyles of the rich/Southerners/MPs.

There were many reasons to vote leave but if you voted leave because you thought:

a. Poor people's lives in the UK would be better out the EU

b. This was some kind of 'fight against the elites'

Then this was a big mistake. A really big mistake.

twofingerstoEverything · 15/02/2017 11:55

I'll be honest and admit that at this point I believe we can't go back on the vote, as much as it pains me to accept. What I want at this stage is to be heard by our government. There seems to be absolutely no regard for 48% of those who voted. The fact she tried to push this through without going through Parliament, the fact she only released the white papers the day after the vote, the fact she's pulling us out of the single market. If I attend this march it'll be to be present and show TM that I do not support her.

To all those people getting hysterical and coming out with the usual hyperbole about Southern elitists and trying to hold the EU responsible for things like the decimation of industry (that was our own government) yada yada... this ^^ is what the march is about. Not to 'overturn democracy', but to remind the government that the 48% who did not vote to leave are still here.

What the country needs now is a leader who can reconcile the nation. What we have is a leader who is stoking division by failing to acknowledge almost half the population and pursuing a hard Brexit. The day I decided to march was the day I heard the Tories talking about 'foreign born' people at their conference.

themueslicamel · 15/02/2017 12:28

48% who did not vote to leave are still here.
This is inaccurate, so a little unbiased clarification.

The uk parliamentary electorate is 44,722,000 (source ONS) and we know that the outcome was split 51.89% leave and 48.11% remain.

However 72.21% voted, while 27.79% didn't bother.

This means that 37.47% of the electorate voted leave to 34.74% remain.

A difference of 2.73%, or to put it another way, a majority of 1,220,910, enough to fill Wembley Stadium over 13.5 times.

As you wereSmile

themueslicamel · 15/02/2017 12:33

Another way to look at it, 65.26% didn't vote to remain, whilst 62.53% didn't vote to leave.

Aren't statistics wonderful....

Parker231 · 15/02/2017 12:37

Not sure I understand the point of this thread - we had the referendum and the leave voters won. It's not the best of five referendums. There have been legal Chaya do parliamentary debates. The government and the prime minister gave now said we are leaving the EU. Whether it turns out to be good or bad it's going to happen.

Parker231 · 15/02/2017 12:42

Challenges not Chaya !

NarkyMcDinkyChops · 15/02/2017 12:48

Whether it turns out to be good or bad it's going to happen

And the point that you have missed is that people need to take action to try and see that isn't too bad. Because that is the way it is looking.

Parker231 · 15/02/2017 13:09

I don't think what the U.K. Government want in Brexit will count for much. We'll end up with what the other European leaders give us.

Notonyournellly · 15/02/2017 15:25

I'll be there, OP. As one of the few in my family entitled to vote in the ref I want to make a stand for my family, and others who weren't allowed a say. DM and DH have both lived and worked here all their adult lives but are non-British passport holders, DS was17 at the time and too young. All are pro EU. DM's Leave voting friends were kind enough to say, oh no, they didn't mean they wanted HER to be kicked out when they voted that way. Nice.

ReleaseTheBats · 15/02/2017 16:39

Polls have consistently shown that the majority of leave voters (and not a much lower percentage than of remain voters) want all EU nationals currently in the UK to be able to stay, provided the EU agrees likewise for UK nationals in the UK. The figures in this recent YouGov poll are 76% of leave and 85% of remain voters.

yougov.co.uk/news/2017/01/18/public-back-brexit-plan-think-eu-will-nix-it/

NarkyMcDinkyChops · 15/02/2017 16:56

Does it matter what they want though? For all the talk of democracy, noone is going to get a say in what actually happens.
They keep saying Brexit means Brexit, but they don't know what that actually means.

birdsdestiny · 15/02/2017 18:36

Whenever I hear the rhetoric about southern elites I want to weep. The Tories will not replace the EU funding given to the North. No chance. It won't be the 'middle class yummy mummys' who are affected by Brexit. Sunderland on the other hand will not be ok.

ReleaseTheBats · 15/02/2017 20:31

I think it does matter. I believe the majority of the population are broadly in agreement with the government's approach to Brexit, including the situation of EU nationals. If this wasn't the case, we would be in a very different situation and I think there would be more people calling for a general election. There aren't, because it is clear the Tories would get back in with a bigger majority if we had a GE.

I also think it is important, since some people are trying to paint all or most leave voters as racists, to point out that if you meet a random remainer or random leaver, there is very little difference in the likelihood that they will want all currently EU nationals in the UK to be allowed to stay or to have to leave.

winkywinkola · 15/02/2017 21:16

Release the bats, I don't know if it's the Express you're reading but I don't think it's accurate information at all.

[]https://yougov.co.uk/news/2017/01/16/public-split-what-kind-brexit-they-think-governmen/ There are other sources of information]]

ReleaseTheBats · 15/02/2017 21:25

winky Your link is to a YouGov poll from 16th January. I am referring to a YouGov poll from 18th January (after TM's Lancaster House speech) linked to in my 16.39 post.

Baffled by the Express comment.

winkywinkola · 15/02/2017 22:03

Conflicting information.

I think TM is going to get her arse bitten very hard.

ReleaseTheBats · 15/02/2017 22:37

I can't find the actual report on that ICM-Avaaz poll your link discusses winky, just a few other articles.

Can you link to the report?

What these articles say the poll shows is that the majority do not support crashing out of the EU if no deal is reached in 2 years. This is followed by most of these people saying there should be an extension to the negotiation times or a second referendum if this situation arises.

SallyMcgally · 16/02/2017 00:21

The march can make a difference. The government and the opposition are keeping a very close and wary eye on public opinion. The white paper opened with a huge lie - the claim that 65 million were united behind Brexit. That alone would make me march (though I'm marching for all the other reasons I've already mentioned on the thread). Politicians cannot simply be allowed to continue to lie and for the lies to remain uncontested.

As it happens I love Europe. My job involves working with wonderful European colleagues, using foreign languages, and sending people abroad. My children were born abroad (thank God - because they at least can keep their EU passports) and I met my husband while living abroad. But I can understand why not everyone feels the way I do. I can see areas where the EU needs to improve. I certainly don't think all leavers are racist or stupid - I know many lovely leavers. And I think loads of remainers didn't/ don't know that much about how the EU works, and that's fair enough - loads of us didn't need to think about it too much until recently. But that's part of the reason why this should never, ever have been decided in a public referendum conducted in this way.

But what I absolutely cannot get my head round - and if anyone can help me I'd be genuinely grateful - is the trust that people are willing to place in the government to see us through this. We are one of the wealthiest countries in the world and just look at the increasing numbers of people using food banks. All of those millionaire MPs accepted their 11% payrise, while cutting benefits to the most vulnerable in society. 'I am Daniel Blake' told the story of hundreds of people. Hundreds of people died, while the government told them that they were fit to work. thank you Iain Duncan-Smith. Our schools are woefully underfunded, and Michael Gove brought about a massive teacher shortage. The NHS is on its knees and Jeremy Hunt, author of a book praising the privatision of medicine, has just returned from the USA where he's 'looking at different healthcare models.' Theresa May's department could have reduced EU immigration massively, had it been inclined to, but failed to, just as it failed to reduce non-EU immigration. Jacob Rees-Mogg has been gleefully rubbing his hands at the prospect of doing away with EU rules and regulations - like the ones that protect our working conditions, our safety in cars, our rights to parental leave, the ones that mean that we know that toys and carseats are safe for our children etc. This is what life has been like under their government and people really trust them to deliver a Brexit that will improve life for people like you and me, for ordinary, working people, who can't afford private schools for their children and can't afford private healthcare ?? Andrea Leadsom thinks we'll save ourselves by selling jam and tea. And Boris bloody Johnson is our Foreign Secretary for Christ's sake. If I were the most rabid Eurosceptic alive, I'd never get behind a Brexit run by this lot. It's the equivalent of desperately needing to find childcare and thinking that King Herod's CV doesn't look too bad, all things considered.

GraceGrape · 16/02/2017 01:00

It's the equivalent of desperately needing to find childcare and thinking that King Herod's CV doesn't look too bad, all things considered.

Grin
Niamer · 16/02/2017 08:28

SallyMcGally You should be speaking at the march, not just attending it Flowers

OP posts:
Amymay1984 · 16/02/2017 08:33

Brilliant post Sally

RufusTheSpartacusReindeer · 16/02/2017 08:35

It's the equivalent of desperately needing to find childcare and thinking that King Herod's CV doesn't look too bad, all things considered.

Perfect, absolutely perfect

Notonyournellly · 16/02/2017 17:29

Sally that is a brilliant, eloquent post. Why would anyone think our country will be better off with that bunch getting their way?

ReleaseTheBats · 16/02/2017 17:46

So are you saying that because we don't like, let's call them, the right wing of the Tory party being in power cause it was so great under Cameron and Osborne, wasn't it?, we should decide to put up with also being governed by the EU, who we don't like either (by we, I mean leave voters, obvs)? I'm not following your logic.

Have you seen that the latest Ipsos Mori poll shows satisfaction ratings for TM of above 50%?

I'm not questioning your decision making process, btw, I just find it odd that you seem to be dismissive of people who think differently.