or was she actually asking me whether or not I am 'poor'?

[PrimsGoat]

I was at playgroup today and started making small talk with a woman I've never spoken to before. We started talking about schools and childcare and she said her children are in private school. I told her my DD is only 2, and not even in nursery yet, as I'm still at home, so I haven't thought much about schools. (I won't be going private, but I didn't tell her that.)

She then went on to ask if DD didn't qualify for free nursery as a 2-yr old? I assumed that she was a bit ignorant of the scheme, which offers free childcare to 'disadvantaged' children (that's the 'official line', not my words) in order to prevent them from falling behind academically when they start school. I told her that DD doesn't qualify, and she replied 'the threshold is so ridiculously low', so clearly knowing that the threshold household income is around £16K / year.

I'm not trying to be disrespectful to anyone who does qualify (in fact I should imagine they would find the question rude also). But effectively she was asking me whether or not I am poor, wasn't she?

She dropped a reference to somethign that indicated she was rich. And then, she dropped a reference to something that would indicate OP was poor.

Well I doubt she said 'my DC are at a private school' she said 'my DC are at dogs dinner school' which the op happens to know is a private school. Are people whose DC are at private school not allowed to mention it in case someone takes it as a slight? I dunno, I'd have thought the 2yo comment was odd but nothing else.

Unlimited

You have a point. I assumed that there had been a conversation about schools. If she just started with 'my DC are at private school' then yeah, that would be a bit show offish.

It's a conversation I hear almost constantly when ever I'm around people who have 2yo's and the askers often look totally bemused when the other person responds as if it's an insult.

People ask it for many reasons it could be awareness raising,it could be a filler it could also be a whine about how bad it is that comfortable people don't get it along with a fair few other reasons.

It's possible she could have assumed you were broke lots of people would when mums have buggies like bugaboo/icandy/oyster unless they are fairly obviously old, next and john Lewis baby clothes appear to provoke the same response.

But that is no more likely than the other possibilities

My dc4 gets the 2yr funding because of my mental health. No one has ever asked about our income.

If she is aware of things like thee income threshold, perhaps she is also aware of the other myriad of reasons why dc qualify for the funding, too, and only commented on the threshold being so low as that was the reason that excluded her dc from the funding?

But I expect you would think some of the other reasons embarrassing as well - things like a disabled parent, having a disabled sibling, the dc having a disability or a delay, the mom suffering with pnd, being a twin! (all the reasons I can think of for the dc at my dc's nursery wo are on the funding - there is only ONE there for the low income thing that I know of!!)

I don't think YABU : She sounds like one to avoid in the future.

Kids dressed up to the nines in pristine designer stuff usually seem to be from benefits claiming families. No judgement, just an interesting observation.

I'm on benefits (ill health and single parent) I can't afford designer stuff even if I did feel I had something to prove.

Can someone give me a list of what the showy brands are? My DCs are usually found climbing trees in Primark gear but visits to great grandma result in outfits bought from Zara in the sales for under a tenner.

Think no more of her comment OP

Taking the exchange as a whole- I think its pretty clear she was attempting to one up OP

Agreed. But you'll get the one-upmanship thing anywhere. I've had countless experiences. For example, where I am there's a huge waiting list for brownies and scouts and they're held near our house. One of the parents managed to get her DC in quite quickly - cue one evening in the summer coming home with the DCs and passing Prissy Mum. "What are you doing here?!" She demanded. At least she had the good grace to look sheepish when I pointed out I lived there.

Well I doubt she said 'my DC are at a private school' she said 'my DC are at dogs dinner school' which the op happens to know is a private school.

No. This is how it went. I was talking to my neighbor about schools. Neighbor went to get a cup of tea, so I started chatting to this woman instead, as I'd never seen her before and I wanted to be friendly. I carried on with the same subject, saying something like 'X and I were just talking about how to apply for school places already, even though our children are only 2, haha. I'm told you have to start thinking about this stuff early.' She then replied something like 'Oh, OK. We decided to go private.'

I know absolutely nothing about the school system or about local schools so I wouldn't be able to tell whether or not something was a private school.

OK so in case obviously she's a twat. I worry even less about what twats think about me and my financial position than normal people.

I think a lot of people are missing the point actually. OK, so you don't care if people think you are poor. Bully for you. I do care. Apparently this makes me an insecure social climber type, but there you go.

It's hard for me to 'own' my background, as I'm still dealing with a mother who thinks I've 'risen above my station' just because I went to university, and recently suggested I take a job as a toilet cleaner instead of looking for something in my sector as it's 'too competitive'. (No doubt I will now get comments from people thinking I'm a snob for not taking her up on this helpful idea.)

I was asking whether or not you think this woman was playing some kind of social status game with me. Not whether or not I should care about that.

It seems entirely possible that she had forgotten that the 2 yr old nursery was not universal like the 3 yr old nursery is.

Then when you mentioned qualifying she thought oh shit yeah I should have known that and so made a comment about the threshold being low rather than admitting that she'd forgotten there was one.

If I had said the threshold is so low I wouldn't mean "you look poor enough that you should get free nursery", I would mean "I think free nursery should be available for all children".

I dont think your a snob OP. I have family members who think I've risen above my station and still question why I haven't got a proper job yet. Hmm. Hmm. Having a nervous breakdown and falling ill shortly after and then becoming a single parent to two DCs. The youngest with SN. Strangely enough your options are then limited.

I think she was playing a social status game in a sense OP but in the nicest way possible, you'll have to develop a thicker skin as you'll get this until your DC goes to secondary school and beyond. I've encountered so many competitive parents, I once had a father furious that my DD had got into the 'good teachers' class like I'd bribed the school or something. I wouldn't know where to start!

Learn to smile, nod and grit your teeth.

I'm sorry your family is not more supportive, pixies. And I'm sure you're right about competitiveness among parents. I never encountered this kind of talk much before I had DD.

Everybody is a product of their ubringing, OP and I can see why you feel the way you do, particularly since your last comment about your mother's attitude.

People who are sneering at your worries if they either have never experienced poverty or were poor but have the self-confidence to 'own' their background are showing a lack of empathy and understanding.

Having said that, although it is understandable that you have such a strong desire to ensure your child never has to worry about money, your anxiety about it and about how you and your family are perceived by others is likely to affect your child. You simply can't guarantee she will never in her life have to worry about money, but you can bring her up so that she accepts herself for who she is and so that she is not ashamed of her background.

I was asking whether or not you think this woman was playing some kind of social status game with me. Not whether or not I should care about that.

It's impossible to get into her head though isn't it? And surely you wouldn't be drawn into a social status game anyway would you. So she would be playing alone?

FWIW I think a lot of this stems from the judgment you've met in the past, including from those close to you and how this affects your self esteem. Competitiveness is there with some over lots of things, but if it helps them feel better about themselves (shrugs). The truly confident aren't competitive in this way imo so if she felt the need to do that underneath she is probably desperate to be liked and admired.

You simply can't guarantee she will never in her life have to worry about money, but you can bring her up so that she accepts herself for who she is and so that she is not ashamed of her background.

You're right. Luckily my DH is nothing like me in this regard. He's very secure in himself. I'm hoping DD takes after him! But of course I need to work on my own self esteem. I don't want to 'poison' DH and DD with this crap...

I doubt you are going to poison her. I think ultimately though you can't stop people being twats (which I think she was being with further clarity). You can only control how you respond to it.

Thankyou PrimsGoats. Thankfully it's only a select few family members so I just have minimum contact with them and plod on.

I was asking whether or not you think this woman was playing some kind of social status game with me. Not whether or not I should care about that.

To answer this, I think she was. However, I suspect it was more about her wanting to make herself look better, because she has her own issues, than putting you down if that makes sense? Don't forget, you don't know her at all and she could be a compulsive liar who has never even been able to afford the petrol to drive to a private school, much less enroll her children in one. It's hard I know, but please try not to let her get to you.

You are being over sensitive.

I find these questions fascinating because I see that I go around putting my size 9s in it all the time. I would be perfectly capabable of asking that question and asking if as awkwardly as that woman did just to keep a conversation going. I also worked in Benefits for ages and became obsesssed with maximising everyone's income! Looking back on it, it's likely that when my kids wee young I came across like that woman did as I was always suggesting benefits that people could apply for. Mind you, it helps that I dress like a scarecrow and my kids always wear hand me downs and I don't give a shite if people think I am rich or poor (my mother was an absolute money snob- and in contrast to the OP I have reacted by being repelled by snobbery). None of us were there but on balance I think the likelihood was that she was just prattling on, trying to seem like a Helpful Hetty with no idea that she was touching a nerve.

Maybe she was saying free nursery provision is so important that the 16k threshold is too low insofar as people earning between say £16k and 25k should be eligible too. That's how I'd have taken it I think.

Might she have been sharing regret that as 'the threshold is so ridiculously low' neither of you qualified? I know you've convinced yourself otherwise, and are keen to take offence, but...

You know, there are worse things than not going through life "wanting for nothing". Being in want of stuff you don't need when you're a kid, is not a terrible tragedy.

OP it must be bloody hard carrying this paranoia around with you. Maybe the woman is mad and was playing mind games, or maybe she was just making conversation and she's not particularly socially sensitive.

But tbh you sound like hard work and like you're constantly looking out for insults where none was intended. This is really sad because you may be giving off vibes which repel people who might otherwise be friends, or you may be rejecting potential friends because you think they've been putting you down when they're completely oblivious to such a thing.

To your credit, you do own the fact that you're a bit of a snob because of your upbringing, but the next question is, what are you going to do about it? Are you going to try and change that so that your life is easier and you don't pass these unfortunate attitudes on to your DC, or are you going to accept them and live with them weighing you down for the rest of your life?

OP do put this behind you and stop stressing about it. You've got so much going for you, university education, good secure DH and, I'm sure, a lovely child. You're as good as anyone else and a lot better off (in many ways, not just financially) than a lot of others. Relax and enjoy your life.
On any kind of activity holiday the scruffiest hand me down clothes are worn by the DC of comfortably off families who genuinely don't care. Very expensive and prestigious schools hold second hand uniform sales. They also have parents happily looking through 'preloved' books and toys at Christmas Sales and charity fundraisers. The pupils at one London private school were warned, after a nasty incidence of violence (not school related) not to walk through a nearby estate. At least one boy on a bursary lived on the estate.
Forget about the possibly judging convo. Next time don't sit near her or cheerfully change the subject.