DD is pregnant and I'm devastated

[Veryworriedmumof1]

My husband thinks I'm BU and that we will deal with like like we've dealt wi everything else in life. He's a glass half full kind-of man and I'm not. AIBU and overly emotional? To avoid drip feeding; I have depression and anxiety and I can be quite negative and overly fearful.

DD aged 22 has been mentally ill since she was a teenager. She's bright but missed a lot of schooling due to inpatient psychiatric admissions. She's quite determined though and found herself a good job not long after she dropped out of school. Things were improving for her; she had a job, she occasionally socialised and she seemed less unwell. Then, she met an emotionally abusive alcohol dependent arsehole. I think that's when we lost her.

DD and the arsehole live 20 miles from us in the most disgusting hovel that I've ever seen. I know that people with mental health problems can self neglect but she was never like this before she met him. I've tried everything to make her life better; I go to their flat once a week to clean, do all their laundry, buy food, make them dinner and drop it around. I give her money to spend on nice things for herself but I expect she gives it to him to buy booze. :( She kept missing work and lost her job late last year.

DD confessed that she wanted to move nearer to me and I offered to sell our house, buy a flat and give her the money to rent in our area. They discussed it, apparently, but he doesn't want to, so she won't. Her room is here and available for her. I want her home.

We love our daughter very much and she has lots of positive attributes. However, her mental illness brings out the worst in her. She's so demotivated and can barely look after herself at the moment. When she said that she was pregnant, I told her that I loved her and would support her. I can't stop sobbing. She can't look after a baby. She can't look after herself. DD is 5ft5 and must be less than 7 stone now because she doesn't eat properly. She doesn't get dressed most days and I don't know she doesn't shower as much as she could. I've dragged her to the GP but she won't go. There's nothing I can do with an adult who won't engage with mental health services. I don't want to have to contact social services about my own daughter but they can't safely look after a child, so what choice do I have?

We are not in a position to be the main carers of a baby but we will do everything in our power to support DD. She is welcome to move back home with the baby (and we will help) but that arsehole is not stepping foot through my door.

I know she's an adult but she's an ill one who missed out on growing up due to mental illness. She is immature and I don't even ask her to look after the cats while we are away because she couldn't cope with the responsibility.

I've given her info on women's aid and other DV charities. I've offered to fund private therapy for her. I know I'm a mug doing her cleaning but she's ill and I can't have her living in filth. I will never see any grandchild of mine living like that either.

I'm crushed. I want her to be happy and healthy.

This is a very tough situation. There is no "easy answer" and it's sounds like your doing the best you can for your daughter.

What is clear, however, is this young woman needs support whichever way she chooses to proceed with her pregnancy.

If she does want to have the baby, then it is important she gets the help she needs to cope. OP cannot do it all, it sounds like her daughter needs professional input, it is unlikely she will make improvements to her life and health without support. Whichever way you look at it, the baby's needs have to come first- having a mother who has mental health problems (not being treated, according to OP), is not looking after herself in any way and lives with an emotionally abusive alcoholic is not a good situation to bring a child into. Things need to change for the sake of the baby's welfare. I know some women do manage on their own/with family support, but many more don't.

I have seen it in a professional capacity (not SW) and I can say the evidence and anecdotally/personal experience is that, generally speaking, the earlier the support is put in the better the outcome. What often happens if things are hidden/the full picture not disclosed (under the guise of "giving them a chance" and/or due to fears that the baby will be removed etc) is that the support is put in when things are already going awry. It's then harder to get things back on track and it's harder for SW to step back- because the baby is seen/known to be at risk, rather than possibly at risk. I'm saying all SW are saints who never make the wrong call, BTW, merely that not letting SS understand the full picture won't make things better. It may make it worse. I suggest with her previous mental health history the MW will flag it up and be keeping a closer eye.

WRT her partner, if he genuinely is abusive then there is a lot of evidence to show that abuse can escalate during pregnancy and after the baby is born. It is difficult because harping on about him is likely to push her closer to him/distance himself from OP. I think re-iterating she can come home anytime is the right way to go. However, if you really fear for her safety then you may have to be a little more blunt.

OP, I'm not going to comment on whether or not you should involve SS at such an early stage. But if you do (and genuinely, I'm on the fence here), please make sure that - whatever level of responsibility you're able/willing to take for the child - that you act as your daughter's advocate, and help all of the professionals to see her strengths.

Throughout my first pregnancy, I had hard-core and heavy-duty professional surveillance due to historic mental health issues. The whole thing was focused on what I couldn't do, what might go wrong, what risks I posed, how vulnerable I was. It was very depressing, and really undermined my own self confidence and self belief. What I really needed was a strong and stable presence in my life to emphasise that, like your daughter, I had another side to me.. I was from a loving and stable background, well educated, capable to holding down a stable job etc etc. In my case, my husband fulfilled that role, though in your daughter's case that's clearly not going to happen. But if your daughter does end up down the professional route, please be that person for her that reminds her what she CAN do and CAN cope with.

What a hard situation. I hope whatever you do that your DD ends up being a good and happy mum.

I agree GardenView that your view isn't helpful.

First, it's not just about DD any more, she's bringing a baby into an abusive relationship, when she can't even look after herself (or a cat). The consequences for the baby may be fatal. Both mother and daughter need help. And that's what SS are for.

Second, given DD's mental health history, the fact of her being so underweight, the fact of living in a dirty environment with an addict - the chances of someone else calling SS is high, whether GP, MW or HV. DD really needs help.

It would be better for the OP to make the contact herself, and talk through all the options, rather than having it sprung in her at a moment's notice.

The fact that your 20something mates are apparently so dysfunctional that they live in 'shitpits' with alcoholics says far more about them than anything else. If true, it's completely bizarre. Perhaps you've normalised the abnormal. Either way, it's a dangerous environment to bring a baby into.

OP cannot do it all, it sounds like her daughter needs professional input, it is unlikely she will make improvements to her life and health without support

Exactly. DD needs professional help that OP can't give her - although she's doing a sterling job.

I also made the same point about escalation of abuse during pregnancy and birth, previously. If that were to happen, health professionals around DD would be obliged to contact SS purely for safeguarding.

Both mother and daughter need help

That should say mother and baby.

What a difficult struggle for you all. All that you are doing for them is so kind. Are the local adults safeguarding board aware of your daughter and her abusive relationship? They may be able to help. Is your daughter using drugs or alcohol like her partner? Being very under weight is a red flag for drug abuse. She's so very lucky to have a mum who loves and supports her so much I hope this journey is a positive one for you both xxx

For others on this thread if you are worried about a vulnerable adult you can contact adult safeguarding teams through social services, hospitals, and the police.

Trying to write this without sounding really harsh, fifth time lucky

A few flags are present at the moment with what we've been told. So 3 immediate concerns food is bought and weight is low,could it be substance/alcohol abuse, an wearing disorder or the MH issues are back but for personal reasons DD doesn't want to declare. Another possibility is poor health. A GP would most likely run a blood panel and tox screen. Could explain reluctance to see GP.
For those who think substance abuse, how harsh, it could simply be OTC medicines. That's why they're moving to pholcodeine linctus, over codeine linctus. Not to mention on the streets you can buy pretty much anything.
Is imagine both are on incapacity benefit & DLA due to whatever issues they have. If the OH/SIL is an alcoholic, for all the money to go on beer, plus handouts from OP, would suggest a mammoth drinking problem to near lethal levels daily. That's why I'm wondering if DD drinks as it would make more sense in the lack of money. I think we're talking at least £400 a fortnight at least, without what OP is contributing.
Both of them would be classed as vulnerable adults and could seek support via adult services. Both could do with a joint / separate daily support worker at least, as they both sound isolated.
With reference to possible abuse, if you know for sure you need to get DD alone and tell her she is welcome back anytime. If the abuse is suspected you have a harder job. It would be interesting to know why it's OH/SIL who is tagged as abusive and a drunk. It's clear you don't like him, as said before whilst they're together and if there's a baby, they're a unit. DD might not appreciate your attitude towards him, which could push you out of the picture which you don't want. If separated through DD's choice it's slightly easier for you, but the Dads have rights. As it would break a woman's heart, isolation from baby could do the same to OH/SIL. Say hypothetically they chose to get married, how would you feel/deal with this?
Like often attracts like, they most likely try and support each other. Again being vulnerable adults from the info received, find out all you can how this would affect baby before making rash decisions. Hopefully if pregnant it's fairly early giving you time to speak to helplines and search online for further information regarding your rights in this situation.
In an ideal world both would get maximum support, parenting classes, support for their issues. Hopefully this would awaken them to the responsibility of having a child & Young baby.
With regards to your own problems you need to get them addressed, you need to look after yourself. You've got a loving DH, it could be as simple as medication and counselling.
So we can help with links can we ask what part of the U.K. you are in please? Scotland / NW / NE / E / Midlands / SW / SE / Wales / N.I. as we can find as much as possible that could help. If you're willing maybe district. I don't think it would be identifying as I'm sure there's many like yourself in similar situations.
Your first steps are to ascertain she is pregnant, ask is everything ok, a problem shared and all that. Is there any reason for the weight loss? She has nothing to be ashamed about, you're there to support her. The more you know, you don't have to share it here, the better prepared you can be. Has she been ill, does she have any health concerns? Could she tell you more about OH, that way it looks like you regard him. For all you know he could have no one and would love nothing more to have a caring MIL/FIL.
I know this has been a shock and isn't easy. But with that extra info we can try and point you in the right direction. If SS turn up now, when it's possible few people know about this, she could suspect you or DH which could be awful for your relationship. Added in, after a MW or GP appointment then it's feasible that they've acted regarding her past.
Sorry you're having to go through this, I know it's not what you want to hear. I know you don't want to embrace SIL but on that level the closer you are to him, the better the picture will be.
If he has parents, they could be going through the same as you, if they've shared the news. I would rather embrace someone I wasn't keen on, than have distance between you & DD.
Hope this has helped, I know a lot is conjecture, but it's also food for thought. It's not uncommon for the mentally ill to self medicate with alcohol / substances, as in the words of Russell Brand, it's like an anaesthetic to the mental anguish, relieving the feeling you have. I know DH is generally optimistic, again the more info you have, the more you can justify your fears.

Sending love &

Great post Singingintherain.

OP, I hope your talk with your daughter went ok. It's a tough situation for you and very difficult for any parent to see their child living like this when you know things could be so much better for them.

If DD is, as Singing suggests, self medicating with drugs or alcohol this needs urgent intervention as it is extremely likely to cause irreparable damage to the baby.

My situation was a fair bit different to your daughter as was a LDR and no pregnancy, but i have personal experience of having quite severe MH issues and being in an abusive relationship.
I was 18, met him on facebook, lived roughly 450 miles apart so we never actually met in person. I too had to drop out of highschool a year and a half early due to my severe OCD and depression, have become increasingly ill since so not capable of working etc.

In my case he played the nice guy as friends for a few months then the same as boyfriend for a few more months then turned, abusive, manipulative, controlling, telling me i was stupid, worthless, boring, un loveable and a burden on everyone and i was lucky he'd put up with me as nobody else would etc. I've always felt lower class than the average person because of my mental illness, especially once i was working age and couldn't work i've felt like i don't deserve to live and use up precious resources like oxygen, clean water, food etc. I knew it was completely wrong how he was treating me and i should leave, but i felt like such a failure, i'd not been very modest about advertising my relationship and "great" boyfriend when we first got together (out of excitement, he was my first relationship and i was naive and desperate to be loved). I thought people would laugh in my face, tell me what did i expect, someone like me didn't deserve love or to be treated well, and that i was an idiot and how dare i have expected a happy relationship as i wasn't worthy of it. Even when the abuse became sexual (forcing me to act like some sort of prostitute and sex chat constantly and never talk about anything else) i still didn't "get out". The shame and embarrassment of admitting my relationship was bad seemed worse than the abuse. It took him threatening anal rape because i wouldn't consent to it to realise there was nothing remotely positive in how i felt about him, i hated him, he disgusted me, had no love or respect for me and being on my own was infinitely better than having to spend even one more minute serving him. I wish i'd had the strength sooner, my family and facebook friends were lovely and supportive and the total opposite reaction to what i'd thought i'd get.
I felt so much more worthless because of my mental health issues and the fact i couldn't contribute to society that it had left me more vulnerable to be preyed on by an abuser, and in a very sad way i felt like i deserved it for not being "normal".
My parents didn't know about him being abusive, i would have felt stronger and able to leave so much sooner if they had. It may well be pregnancy, or even the actual birth and becoming a mum, shocks her into seeing what her situation really is and she won't want it for herself or her child. Having your support and knowing you're there will make it so much easier for her to make that decision to leave if she ever wants to.

MissVictoria thank you for sharing. I am so sorry that absolute shit made you feel this way. You are an amazing person and I am so glad you managed to get out of that relationship.

Totally agree with jacks11 and GloriaGaynor. Excellent words of encouragement from OhdocalmdownJoanna.

SingingInTheRainstorm you have lots of wise words and experience to bring. I can see that. But I would say be careful that you are characterising things in a slightly rosy way!

"Like often attracts like, they most likely try and support each other."

I could equally say that abusive men are drawn to vulnerable women. If you want to argue that vulnerable women are also drawn to abusive men, or that abusive people are drawn to vulnerable people and vice versa so be it. But the reality here is the OP is worried her dd may be in an abusive relationship. IF she is then the man in the case may well not be supporting her at all.

BUT I agree getting to know the man and being supportive will be the best way to support her daughter. If she goes in negatively her dd will not believe her when/if things are 'pointed out' about the man.

IF there are things to 'point out' I'd do it subtly by talking to her and asking questions gently, so that she can realize for herself if his behaviour is abusive.

AND I totally agree with you when you say to the OP, "With regards to your own problems you need to get them addressed, you need to look after yourself"

Yes the OP must really look after herself, whatever happens it will be a long road ahead. And OP although I may not agree with all that SingingInTheRainstorm writes there is some very, very helpful advice in there, IMHO.

I am sure you know this OP but different substances effect the baby differently, I believe alcohol is one of the worst possible.

If she has a problem with drink there may be a medication she can use/take/be prescribed to help with this. Honesty on her part if vital.

Try and make is as non-judgmental as possible. It would be easy for her to say she is not drinking and carry on (if she is) but if she knows it could seriously affect baby and there may be some medication she can take to ease problems etc and not affect baby, then she may be more open to this.

From what has happened I take it that no one has let the op's dd be an adult.
Still being fed and house cleaned etc.

I want to ask why the op cant let go.

From what has been said no one has given the dd a chance.

I agree that you should not be calling SS as they will do more harm than good.

As for suggesting an abortion. Cant anyone see that if that was suggested by the op then her DD would just think that her dm didn't want her baby and it could cause a rift in their relationship.

Yes offer support in saying when she makes an appointment with the gp if she wants you will go with her. If you are able to not take over the conversation.
But it us up to her to make the appointment.

Remind her she is 22 with her own place and needs to start standing on her own 2 feet. Looking after herself and her family.

Just as an after thought are you absolutely certain that the bf is actually an abusive alcoholic. Just that my own dm thought that of my own dp. Any opinions I had that didn't agree with her own thoughts were immediately put down to him brain washing me.

She also used to let herself in our flat and clean up our "filth"

I was also 7stone 0lbs

Just to add dp although a heavy drinker at that time was certainly not abusive or a brain washer

I don't know that SS would 'do more harm than good'. I certainly don't know that anyone can express that opinion as if it were a fact.

I don't know that SS would 'do more harm than good'. I certainly don't know that anyone can express that opinion as if it were a fact

In the case I know of the child is being raised by their mother and grandparents rather than being adopted. Don't know whether pp would consider that more harm than good or what

It seems to me that a baby's welfare comes before other considerations, and it is a shame to let a situation get to the point where there is danger to the baby's health or welfare before SS might be called. There are plenty of flags here indicating timely support would be useful.

I think people saying 'calling as does more harm than good' is actually more harmful than calling ss. But as others have stated, that's just my opinion.

Math social workers did more harm than good to me, twice.

WHEN you were a child borrowedheart ? I don't doubt what you say but things are very different now to even 10 years ago.