To find this distasteful?

[JunosRevenge]

My dear FIL died recently. FIL requested cremation, and wished for ashes to be scattered (along with those of another deceased close family member).

SIL has asked DH if she can remove some of the ashes to be turned into some kind of glass keepsake. DH is horrified at this idea. He says it is the last thing his DF would have wanted, and I must say I agree with him.

Advice is required from the wise heads of MN. DH doesn't want to cause offence, but he's at a loss as to what to say to his DSis (who is on a notoriously short fuse at the best of times...)

Help!!!

But why is it dogmatic and arbitrary? It's your body.
No it isn't, the deceased does not exist in law after death, their estate does. There are laws about the disposal of a body, and it is an offence for someone (typically the executor or administrator of the estate) to refuse to carry them out.

I'ts a very difficult field, I'm sure. Maybe the OP could suggest a compromise in that the SIL can cake a few of the grounds and preserve them, and her DH can scatter the rest. At some point in the future, the SIL could agree to leave 'hers' with the other remains. I suspect it will cease to be an issue over time.

take, not cake.

I think unless someone stipulates they do not want to be kept

Eh? The OP's FIL gave instructions on what he wanted them to do with his remains. I don't think it's reasonable to expect ill people to think of all the various uses of ashes just to say specifically, "don't do that with what's left of me", when they've left you with a plan! And to be fair to the FIL who sounds like a traditional sort, the idea of his remains being made into jewellery or a paperweight might have been completely beyond his comprehension anyway.

I wouldn't judge anyone for getting this done but it's really not my thing. I would hate to think of any part of me being made into something that stayed behind, only to be thrown out with the rubbish when all who remembered me had gone. I'd rather end up at a place that meant something to me rather than landfill or being sold as an oddity in an antique shop. It's the same reason essentially I wouldn't want to be buried, to be obviously forgotten (even if it was another 50 or 100 years after my death). That's why I have sympathy for the OP's DH- if it were my relatives I'd hope at least one of them would be insisting that I'd hate it and not give assent.

I would hate to think of any part of me being made into something that stayed behind, only to be thrown out with the rubbish when all who remembered me had gone.

That's a good point.

While close family members are alive, or even a generation after it might be seen as sweet, a keepsake etc.

I'm not sure how I'd feel if my mum ever said to me, 'Here, it's your great great great Aunt Doris' and handed me a paperweight/ring.

I imagine a fair few will end up in the tip/charity shops in a few generations.

Surely a keepsake is a watch, wedding ring or make one of his shirts into a cushion or something not a cremated body part.

A keepsake can be different things to different people.

I would hate to think of any part of me being made into something that stayed behind, only to be thrown out with the rubbish when all who remembered me had gone.

Some of you will be thrown out long before that process. As others have said, the process of cremation is not as clean cut and simple as most people would assume.

When my dad died, my mum, myself and my siblings all had a small amount of our dads ashes put into tiny urns that we have kept. My mum has hers in her front room, as do my sisters but mine is kept in a keepsake box.

I think if she wants to have some ashes to be turned into a piece of jewlery, let her.

My step dad went to Australia,and through customs,god knows how it was allowed..well half of him did...the other half is on the mantel piece over the fire.

" I would hate to think of any part of me being made into something that stayed behind, only to be thrown out with the rubbish when all who remembered me had gone"

Why? What will it matter to anyone by then?

It would matter to me- bodily autonomy and all that. I wouldn't want anyone digging me up to have a poke around in 800 or so years either, nor would I want my headstone or memorial being left to disintegrate and look sad and abandoned because there's no one to look after it when my kids are no longer able to do so. I'd rather just be turned into dust and let go, once and for all.

Although I'm not a fan of knick-knacks so really it would almost be poetic if they made me into a paperweight.

You don;t get bodily autonomy after you're dead.

I don't think what toyd said was insensitive. Maisie's ornament is a beautiful and precious thing and I understand why anyone would hate to lose it.

But Maisie should keep it on display to remind her of the loveliness of her mum every day and others should back off.

When my mum died three years ago I took Nobby, her beloved cat, in. He was a pesky little pest and I didn't really want him but I quickly grew to adore him. She was right all along: he was the happiest little soul.

When I took him I got a promise that when the time came, he'd be buried in my mum's garden alongside his brother and her other pets because that's what she would have wanted. He was her favourite. I thought it would be a long time.

On 2 January, being mischievous as always, he ran away from me and was crushed by a car in front of me. He died in my arms. There was so much blood. He loved going out with me by his side but I let him and my mum down that day because I didn't protect him and I will always feel guilty for that.

Circumstances meant that it wasn't to be that he got to rest in my mum's garden as she would have wanted. That upset and angered me: not for me, but for her.

But do you know what? I don't care now. He's been cremated and his ashes are in an urn in the shape of a curled up cat and he's with me. It's not good but it's good enough.

I tried to fulfill my mum's wishes, such as I thought they were, but it wasn't possible. So I did the best I could and my best is all she ever wanted.

However, I am finding it harder to take his death than hers. Weird, isn't it? He was just a cat. But he was the only thing I had left of her and now they are both gone.

So in my rambling way OP I think your husband should let his sister have a spoonful of their father's ashes to do what she wants with them. What's the harm? My mum's cat is just a cat. That's his sister's dad.

What I think is distasteful is not allowing her to remember him as she sees fit.

endofthelinefinally "My 18 year old dd sat down beside me and said:
"Mum, the funeral is about comforting and supporting the living as well as saying goodbye. (DS) would want you to think about the living."

I am so sorry for your loss. Your daughter is very, very wise.

Megatherium

"His remains will be split once scattered. Carried off in the breeze, etc...

That argument really doesn't work. He wanted his remains to be scattered, if he wanted them to be split up and kept by any of the family he would have said so. He clearly hasn't said that he wanted them to go through a manufacturing process and to sit on someone's mantlepiece."

Not true at all, I have put in m y will I want my ashes scattered as it did not occur to me anyone else would want them. i would be delighted if my children wanted to do something with them.

Navy&White / Toyd. It did cross my mind that if burgled it may be stolen/broken but I went ahead anyway. The company that made it didn't use the whole teaspoon full of ashes I gave them so I still have some left should anything happen to this one. I think I would be quite upset if someone stole it though.

JunosRevenge "Can't really drip-feed any more info - suffice to say that there are more than 2 siblings involved. My DH is very laid-back and a people-pleaser normally, unlike his much more dominant siblings. Think it fair to say that the relationships are already fractured, for many other pre-existing reasons. FIL's recent death has polarised many older grievances, and my poor DH is utterly worn down at being overruled yet again."

Please Junos look after your husband. I think he is taking this responsibility to take care of father's ashes very seriously, which is understandable. (Is he the eldest?)

However, whatever your religious or other beliefs, the body, although needing to be treated with respect, is no longer the container of that person after death. Whether you believe there is no such thing as the soul or spirit or whoever you believe there is, I don't know of many (any) who feel that the body is more important than the soul.

Please just look after your husband, he may not 'win' in terms of getting to stick up for his father's wishes, but to be honest I do really believe the dead do not get to call the shots.

If your husbands family is already fractured and difficult then sticking to your fil's wishes may just be too difficult in terms of holding the family together (which may be the more useful pursuet at this time, IMHO).

I can honestly say when we scattered my mother's ashes it was not so amazing as one might feel. The ashes were taken on the breeze very quickly and we sat down to look at old family photos and chat (my sister and I). We then went out for a lovely meal and remembered our dear mum in her life not in her death.

'It would matter to me- bodily autonomy and all that. '

You don't get that after you die. You could, for example, be autopsied whether you wanted that or not.

I think the point of autonomy is that you have a mind able to make decisions. In cases where people's minds are not able to make a decision, the decision passes to those who are able to make decisions - even when the person is still alive. When you are dead you have no autonomy so it is not relevant.

I really think it's strange that people want to have any autonomy after they're one. I couldn't care less if I don't even have a funeral. If, for some reason, it was more helpful to my children financially and they didn't want it, and they wanted to remember me and celebrate me some other way, that's fine.

..After they're GONE, not 'one'