To find this distasteful?

[JunosRevenge]

My dear FIL died recently. FIL requested cremation, and wished for ashes to be scattered (along with those of another deceased close family member).

SIL has asked DH if she can remove some of the ashes to be turned into some kind of glass keepsake. DH is horrified at this idea. He says it is the last thing his DF would have wanted, and I must say I agree with him.

Advice is required from the wise heads of MN. DH doesn't want to cause offence, but he's at a loss as to what to say to his DSis (who is on a notoriously short fuse at the best of times...)

Help!!!

7

Was that really necessary?

Have you had anyone close die?

What do you do in your job?

Sorry, I didn't mean it to be offensive. I'm just being realistic so OP can understand that splitting ashes etc isn't really that big of a deal and perhaps can help deal with the anxiety of doing this.

I am studying Forensics and prior to this did embalming.

I don't think it's distasteful at all. In fact, my friend has a glass business and incorporates a small portion of the ashes into glass beads or pendants. She has done this for almost all my pets. And has does this recently with her cousins ashes and the beads will be left at places he enjoyed, such as, the ocean, park, etc.

I think that because he specified that he wanted his ashes to be scattered in a certain place then they should be.

I think people should do what they want but personally I find the idea of making someone's ashes into jewellery or whatever a bit odd. Each to their own though.

JunosRevenge in your shoes I would try and keep out of it. It is between brother and sister.

I can understand your husband wanting to do what his dad wanted.

But i can also understand your SIL may wish to do something different.

Do you think this will have any impact on your FIL at all? His body will be burnt to ashes, these must be treated with respect but can you think this will in some way 'hurt' your FIL?

7

I know that a lot of what they do to your body after you die is pretty awful, I just choose not to think about it, your post came out of the blue & felt very cold. It felt very 'They've been violated already, taking a bit of ash is nothing'. I'm sure you were just trying to help though.

I am an organ donor. I'm totally fine with that. So was my Dad...I am somewhat ashamed that I am grateful he couldn't donate (he died suddenly and far from a hospital) because despite being a donor & very pro donating, in all honesty, I don't know I could have given the required permission. I had to give them permission to do an autopsy & only agreed because it could help all the grandchildren in the future. But I asked them to do the bare minimum required. It's not how I thought I'd feel. Maybe if he had been ill in hospital & we'd had time to comes to terms with it, knowing his donation could help others & in some way he'd live on then maybe I'd have accepted it. I don't honestly know.

In the same way I know his ashes are just that, ashes, a mix of all of him in every bit, it's not what I 'see' when I think about removing a (albeit small) part of them. I'm glad my mum didn't want to scatter his ashes & I'm glad my siblings haven't asked for part of the ashes either.

Life is weird. Death even more so.

"My DFIL was a** traditional sort, and DH just feels strongly that he would not have wanted his earthly remains split up in this way."

So he does not know for sure what his father would have wanted, I know you said scattered but would taking some out be such a terrible thing?

"It's not that he feels he owns his DF's ashes at all."

Who gets to decide, is one of them the person who has been put in charge of arranging the funeral or are they meant to do this together?

" He just wants to do the right thing by his DF. He adored him." That is understandable. Do you feel your SIL did not love her dad or did not love her dad as much as your dh?

I've had to go to two significant cremations; my dad, 12 years ago, and my mum last year. Twelve years ago there was a power cut at the crematorium when we came to scatter ashes and the staff were at 6s and 7s. A man in overalls dumped my dad's ashed on the grass, did a little bow and was gone.

My mum's was last year, my sister and I rode a golf buddy type thing to the same spot in the crematorium where a dapper little man asked us if we would like to scatter the, ashes; we did. I said to my sister "I'm not going to cry." And promptly began to cry!

It's all so personal and I would just say that the danger is for a family disagreement at this sad time (which I can almost guarantee your FIL would not want!).

*Despite what I posted a minutes ago!" I would say if your SIL has a supportive partner then I would be tempted to stick by my dh and back him up as much as you feel able to. If your SIL has a partner who takes a back seat or if she is single, I would take a back seat.

It really is between the two (or more?) siblings.

I tend to agree with CrazyCavalierLady "How people deal with their loved ones passing is personal. What the dead thought is irrelevant. They are gone. He was cremated and can still have his ashes scattered as per his request."

7 maybe look into studying communication/ people skills next.

op, I find the jewellery distasteful but I also would feel uncomfortable denying your sil if this is something that she feels strongly about. Tough situation.

Tbh it's not what I would want to do with my loved ones' ashes but I think you are unfair to call what your SIL wants to do with her own father's ashes distasteful. As much as possible I would try and stay out of it as it has such potential to cause upset.
I don't think it would be inappropriate to encourage your DH to raise his concerns with his sister as she may not be thinking about how she wouldn't be honouring her father's wishes, it may also be something with a bit more time she changes her mind on (if the loss is recent she may not be ready to fully let go yet). That would be my starting point, obviously it becomes more difficult if your DH and SIL can't agree a way forward. But I do think you should leave it to them to work out.

Sorry for your loss.

I think this comes down to two, completely reasonable, positions. Either the funeral and ritual is for the departed or it's for the people left behind. Your DH is concerned about his DF's feelings and his DSis is wanting to remember in her own way. Both reasonable and incompatible.

I think mourning is for the people still here. But then I'm an atheist from a long line of atheists who didn't much care what became of their bodies. Would it hurt to give her a small amount of ashes and scatter the rest?

So sorry for your loss.

I have only recently seen this and some of the items (glass paperweights is what I was looking at) are beautiful. I'm now thinking of doing this with our dogs ashes, it is such a tiny amount.

I actually think you are mean to deny your SIL something that clearly will comfort her. Whatever your personal feeling about it (distasteful etc) it was her father too and I would say she has every right to do this. Once those ashes are scattered they are gone forever so I'd think very carefully about denying her. Really, as I write, I'm sad for her that you are being so awful

I could be way off the mark here, but would SIL be open to having a swatch one of FIL's favourite shirts made into jewellery instead? Still his but not the ashes?

I don't find the idea distasteful, I think it's lovely to have part of your loved one with you. However, a friend of mine went a bit further and got his mum's ashes TATTOOED on his body! They mix the ashes with the tattoo ink and put them in your skin!

I don't find it distasteful, in fact, I think it's quite lovely. Whenever I visit my grandparents house, I talk to my Nan's ashes, tell her what we're all up to, and that I miss her.

It would bring me great comfort to have a piece of her with me always, to say hello to in the morning, to feel like she was still with me.

I think when someone dies the grief left by those remaining is worked through in very different ways. What is distasteful to some is a lifeline to others.

Unless your DH had a conversation with his father where it was explicitly stated that he wanted his ashes to remain together, it's not possible to know what he would have wanted. Your DH "strongly feels" that he wouldn't have - but he can't know for certain. He isn't any more upset than his sister, grief isn't a competition "I knew him best" "I loved him more".... although sadly it can often become this way. I suspect that actually your DH is the one with strong feelings regarding this, it's something that he doesn't want to happen and so he thinks his Dad wouldn't have wanted it either.

It's not going to hurt your FIL now. It doesn't have to hurt your DH if can choose not to allow it to. It may help your SIL work through a horrific time in her life.

FWIW I think it's a lovely idea. I may look into it for future reference - I wish I'd known about it when my mother died. I would have loved to have a small part of her with me every day, I had none of her jewellery (went to my brother's wife and my sister) and nothing to hold to remember her by. I find it so difficult.

I would give SIL the ashes she needs.
This will bring her comfort, and to deny her that is cruel.
Your fil may have approved, you don't know.
Once you scatter the ashes they will separate anyway, why not give her some?

Unless the deceased specifically said "whatever happens, don't make me into jewellery", I would let sil go ahead. Mourning is to comfort the living.

The thing about having your loved one's ashes is that there is no hurry to do anything with them. It isn't like a burial that has to be done straight way.
Everyone grieves in different ways. No one really knows how they are going to feel until they are in that situation.
My son's ashes are split into a casket and a scatter tube. I won't make any firm decision about them for a while yet. I am too distraught and grief stricken.
When I was making funeral arrangements I was worrying about reconciling my son's non religious views with my husband's beliefs.
My 18 year old dd sat down beside me and said:
"Mum, the funeral is about comforting and supporting the living as well as saying goodbye. (DS) would want you to think about the living."
I think supporting the grieving family members is what matters now.
It would be so sad to fall out about this.
Could you all just wait a little while and reconsider when the grief is less raw?

7
Consider the fact that contributers to this thread are likely to be the recently bereaved.
A little tact and sensitivity wouldn't go amiss.

If it brings comfort to your SIL I don't understand what the problem is. Or why you would want to deny her that comfort just to suit your own tastes

7
You are very insensitive. It is fine for you to be matter of fact about your feelings, but have a wee thought for those of us recently bereaved, and please ask for your comments to be removed. They aren't helpful to OP in any way.

her father is dead.
if a teaspoon of ashes makes that less awful for her then i can't see why you'd deny it.
i can't imagine your fil would wish his death to bring any more pain to his children than it absolutely has to.
even if if he wouldn't want his ashes scattered in principle, we'd all do anything for our children, for their happiness, to comfort them in their time of need...

He adored him

But so did SIL.

I don't think it's distasteful at all, what IS distasteful are 7's comments, have you no sense of kindness?

Sorry for your loss

He's dead. Yes, he had wishes at the time he was alive, but he's now dead and doesn't know what will happen with his ashes.

Let her have some of the ashes. She was as much his daughter as your DH was his son.

Lots of people separate some of the ashes and keep them in a locket or the like. I wish I had done it with my father, but at the time I was too young to make that choice.

Don't make a mountain out of a molehill, OP. She's not making an unreasonable request.

Maybe once your DH actually gets to see and feel how heavy your FIL's 'ashes' are, he may relent. A couple of particles for the SIL really won't be missed and he can still go ahead and complete his fathers wishes with the vast majority left over.